00:00

And so

And so

00:01

Nikita said something in the group message which he says, I think it'd be an interesting idea

Nikita said something in the group message which he says, I think it'd be an interesting idea

00:06

to ask myself or to figure out That's not even that. You're you're you're making it too soft. I remember exactly how he said it. It's it's like, oh, so what are you doing? What are you up to nowadays? Oh, same, you sold the hospital. What are you doing, Sean? You sold what are you gonna Nikilo, you're sitting at Facebook. What are you doing? And he's basically he just said it straight straight up. He goes,

to ask myself or to figure out That's not even that. You're you're you're making it too soft. I remember exactly how he said it. It's it's like, oh, so what are you doing? What are you up to nowadays? Oh, same, you sold the hospital. What are you doing, Sean? You sold what are you gonna Nikilo, you're sitting at Facebook. What are you doing? And he's basically he just said it straight straight up. He goes,

00:25

I'm just thinking about how I can make ten million dollars in three months.

I'm just thinking about how I can make ten million dollars in three months.

00:30

Like, I and if we're like, what? And he's like, yeah. I wanna make app that generates like ten million dollars in ninety days.

Like, I and if we're like, what? And he's like, yeah. I wanna make app that generates like ten million dollars in ninety days.

00:42

What's going on? We have a good episode. We talk about an app that's going viral, but this app is getting written about in a bunch of publications. We actually have the inside story because we kinda saw what was happening behind the scenes early, early on. And so we talk about this guy named Nikita who launches app that has made a million dollars and, like,

What's going on? We have a good episode. We talk about an app that's going viral, but this app is getting written about in a bunch of publications. We actually have the inside story because we kinda saw what was happening behind the scenes early, early on. And so we talk about this guy named Nikita who launches app that has made a million dollars and, like,

00:59

two weeks or something crazy like that. And we tell you the inside story behind it. What else we got? And he called his shot, which, you know, we love here. We also talk about a ransom note that we got through email and why this ransom note was one of the best emails that we've ever got. And me and Sam live brainstorm and live negotiate

two weeks or something crazy like that. And we tell you the inside story behind it. What else we got? And he called his shot, which, you know, we love here. We also talk about a ransom note that we got through email and why this ransom note was one of the best emails that we've ever got. And me and Sam live brainstorm and live negotiate

01:16

how we are going to deal with this ransom note. So if you wanna see that, that's at the end of the episode. We also talk about the Mailchimp CEO getting canceled. And a little debrief of Palmer Lucky. So that's it. Enjoy this episode.

how we are going to deal with this ransom note. So if you wanna see that, that's at the end of the episode. We also talk about the Mailchimp CEO getting canceled. And a little debrief of Palmer Lucky. So that's it. Enjoy this episode.

01:28

Alright. We live. Sam Par what's up?

Alright. We live. Sam Par what's up?

01:31

Nothing. How's it going?

Nothing. How's it going?

01:32

You know, just the usual woke up, decided, okay, no small boy stuff today. Got going.

You know, just the usual woke up, decided, okay, no small boy stuff today. Got going.

01:38

Immediately started considering some small boy stuff, and then I remembered, there will be absolutely none of that today. And so I'm here. What what what was it? I woke up. I was like, I'm a little sore. So

Immediately started considering some small boy stuff, and then I remembered, there will be absolutely none of that today. And so I'm here. What what what was it? I woke up. I was like, I'm a little sore. So

01:50

wake up with a complaint

wake up with a complaint

01:51

and wake it up with a complaint.

and wake it up with a complaint.

01:53

One of the greatest days I've ever had Wow. This is this is not how I'm gonna start my day. Wait. Why was it one of your greatest days? Just like that's just like a general general attitude I have.

One of the greatest days I've ever had Wow. This is this is not how I'm gonna start my day. Wait. Why was it one of your greatest days? Just like that's just like a general general attitude I have.

02:05

Do you wanna

Do you wanna

02:06

start off by recapping Palmer Lucky? Because after talking to him, I feel like he's kind of the greatest guy I've ever talked to. Kind of man. Yeah.

start off by recapping Palmer Lucky? Because after talking to him, I feel like he's kind of the greatest guy I've ever talked to. Kind of man. Yeah.

02:15

Right. Is that how you feel? I thought he was awesome.

Right. Is that how you feel? I thought he was awesome.

02:20

Okay. Let me just say a word that describes Palmer Lucky. I would say, like,

Okay. Let me just say a word that describes Palmer Lucky. I would say, like,

02:29

independent minded. I think,

independent minded. I think,

02:31

I think I really respected that. He is independently minded. I felt like all his opinions were his own. You know, people, like, when they write that shit in their Twitter bio, like opinions of mine, not my employer.

I think I really respected that. He is independently minded. I felt like all his opinions were his own. You know, people, like, when they write that shit in their Twitter bio, like opinions of mine, not my employer.

02:42

You know, his opinions are really his.

You know, his opinions are really his.

02:44

Also, when people write contrarian thinker,

Also, when people write contrarian thinker,

02:47

and it's kind of like, if if you have to say that you're contrarian thinker, you're maybe not, like, the contraer and thinker.

and it's kind of like, if if you have to say that you're contrarian thinker, you're maybe not, like, the contraer and thinker.

02:56

Do you know what I mean? Right. It's like the no offense.

Do you know what I mean? Right. It's like the no offense.

03:01

I'm not a racist

I'm not a racist

03:02

butt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly what it is. So I,

butt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly what it is. So I,

03:06

anyway, yeah, I I I thought he was an independent thinker. I also thought that he was incredibly enthusiastic,

anyway, yeah, I I I thought he was an independent thinker. I also thought that he was incredibly enthusiastic,

03:12

which I liked very enthusiastic. Dead on the inside. Like, we have

which I liked very enthusiastic. Dead on the inside. Like, we have

03:16

We have said no to a bunch of guests just simply because

We have said no to a bunch of guests just simply because

03:21

they're, like, you know, their intelligence is, like, cranked up to level ten. Their success is cranked up to level twelve,

they're, like, you know, their intelligence is, like, cranked up to level ten. Their success is cranked up to level twelve,

03:28

but their, like, charisma and ability to convey any sort of enthusiasm about themselves, about the world, about their story, is so low.

but their, like, charisma and ability to convey any sort of enthusiasm about themselves, about the world, about their story, is so low.

03:37

And, and so they they make for a terrible podcast guest, but for him, it felt not only like did he have charisma to tell stories about the past? He seemed really pumped about what he was doing and what the future looked like and why it mattered. And I just felt like this guy, you know, just like springs out of bed every day.

And, and so they they make for a terrible podcast guest, but for him, it felt not only like did he have charisma to tell stories about the past? He seemed really pumped about what he was doing and what the future looked like and why it mattered. And I just felt like this guy, you know, just like springs out of bed every day.

03:55

Me too. That's exactly how I felt. I felt like he was incredibly enthusiastic about life. And he yes. That that's a great way to explain it, but He, dude, he was so fascinating. He was one of those guys

Me too. That's exactly how I felt. I felt like he was incredibly enthusiastic about life. And he yes. That that's a great way to explain it, but He, dude, he was so fascinating. He was one of those guys

04:06

that I like because I

that I like because I

04:08

don't like I I can't think of a great word to explain, say, other than, like, prolific, but also almost like, this I don't think this is over

don't like I I can't think of a great word to explain, say, other than, like, prolific, but also almost like, this I don't think this is over

04:17

explaining it or overgrandizing

explaining it or overgrandizing

04:20

it, but, like, almost like a Renaissance man, where he would say comments, like, yeah, I bought this marina because there's gonna be new laws about. I don't even understand, like, what he was explaining about his marina, but he said, like, something about his marina and, like, see port access and how it's changing. And then he made another comment about, like he's like, I I was gonna do this. Well, I mean, c standing is is off the table for now. And I was just, like, I don't even really know what c standing is. Exactly. And you were just said it like, well, we all know c standing. Now now is not the time. I was like, what

it, but, like, almost like a Renaissance man, where he would say comments, like, yeah, I bought this marina because there's gonna be new laws about. I don't even understand, like, what he was explaining about his marina, but he said, like, something about his marina and, like, see port access and how it's changing. And then he made another comment about, like he's like, I I was gonna do this. Well, I mean, c standing is is off the table for now. And I was just, like, I don't even really know what c standing is. Exactly. And you were just said it like, well, we all know c standing. Now now is not the time. I was like, what

04:50

what are you talking about? What the hell is he saying?

what are you talking about? What the hell is he saying?

04:53

Yeah. He also he also and and, like, he'll make another comment. He's like, yeah, I have this house we've rented. We have, like, a workshop in one week, and I was building a a jet engine for the water. And we actually discovered that, like, we should make biodegradable

Yeah. He also he also and and, like, he'll make another comment. He's like, yeah, I have this house we've rented. We have, like, a workshop in one week, and I was building a a jet engine for the water. And we actually discovered that, like, we should make biodegradable

05:05

or what did he say? We should make oil based foods. It's kinda like, building a diet coke for every food. And I was just like, we could take this over lots of different paths, but it's just so interesting to me that you have that ability. Yeah. It was, like, a bunch of, like, candy being waved at us. He's just, like, you know, I've one of the largest samurai sword collections in the world, and that just got me into thinking. And it's like, my what?

or what did he say? We should make oil based foods. It's kinda like, building a diet coke for every food. And I was just like, we could take this over lots of different paths, but it's just so interesting to me that you have that ability. Yeah. It was, like, a bunch of, like, candy being waved at us. He's just, like, you know, I've one of the largest samurai sword collections in the world, and that just got me into thinking. And it's like, my what?

05:27

He didn't say that by the way, but there's at least a fifty percent chance he has one of the top ten samurai sword collections in the world. And one hundred percent I own swords. Like, yeah, he definitely owns swords.

He didn't say that by the way, but there's at least a fifty percent chance he has one of the top ten samurai sword collections in the world. And one hundred percent I own swords. Like, yeah, he definitely owns swords.

05:39

Alright. So where do you wanna go next?

Alright. So where do you wanna go next?

05:41

You can drive. Alright. So check this out. I forwarded you an email.

You can drive. Alright. So check this out. I forwarded you an email.

05:46

Did you, see the email I sent from about my Sarah's list? Or maybe maybe she sent this to you too.

Did you, see the email I sent from about my Sarah's list? Or maybe maybe she sent this to you too.

05:52

What was it? So a woman named Kristen,

What was it? So a woman named Kristen,

05:56

sends a, an email. I'm just gonna read it to you. We'll show it on the screen, you know, for those on YouTube, because it's it's kind of amazing looking.

sends a, an email. I'm just gonna read it to you. We'll show it on the screen, you know, for those on YouTube, because it's it's kind of amazing looking.

06:03

Oh my gosh. You open up the email, and it says, I am holding sarah's list dot com hostage.

Oh my gosh. You open up the email, and it says, I am holding sarah's list dot com hostage.

06:09

And she goes, you don't know me, but I obviously know you. I purchased sarah's list dot com. I've turned it into a bomb ass website. I am willing to sell it to you for twenty thousand dollars. This is a steal as I purchased it for thirty thousand dollars.

And she goes, you don't know me, but I obviously know you. I purchased sarah's list dot com. I've turned it into a bomb ass website. I am willing to sell it to you for twenty thousand dollars. This is a steal as I purchased it for thirty thousand dollars.

06:23

I'm essentially giving you ten thousand dollars. You're welcome. If you'd ever if you'd ever like to see salesless dot com again, and then in she turned the font small or for the first time,

I'm essentially giving you ten thousand dollars. You're welcome. If you'd ever if you'd ever like to see salesless dot com again, and then in she turned the font small or for the first time,

06:34

you know, reply to this message. I'm looking forward to hearing from you. Kristen,

you know, reply to this message. I'm looking forward to hearing from you. Kristen,

06:38

and I was just like, this is amazing. I go, who are you? And,

and I was just like, this is amazing. I go, who are you? And,

06:42

who is? Yeah. Who is she? So she's, this is this is woman, Kristen Kent.

who is? Yeah. Who is she? So she's, this is this is woman, Kristen Kent.

06:48

So she sends me her story after that. She goes, I've been at twelve tech for twelve years.

So she sends me her story after that. She goes, I've been at twelve tech for twelve years.

06:53

You know, regrettably, I chose companies off Kristen's list, which was not as lucrative as if I had chose companies off Sales. So for those who don't know, Sarah's list is this concept. I wish to explain. We did a full episode about it. Basically, Sam's wife, Sarah,

You know, regrettably, I chose companies off Kristen's list, which was not as lucrative as if I had chose companies off Sales. So for those who don't know, Sarah's list is this concept. I wish to explain. We did a full episode about it. Basically, Sam's wife, Sarah,

07:05

is,

is,

07:07

a self made millionaire.

a self made millionaire.

07:08

And did not do any of the heroic entrepreneurial things you hear about in the media. She just did one really good thing. She just picked companies

And did not do any of the heroic entrepreneurial things you hear about in the media. She just did one really good thing. She just picked companies

07:17

whose equity was going to, like, whose valuation was gonna go up four or five x in a four year period. So she worked at Facebook.

whose equity was going to, like, whose valuation was gonna go up four or five x in a four year period. So she worked at Facebook.

07:24

And not early at Facebook, not like she was, like, employee four at Facebook. Like, she was, like, in the thousands of employees joined as, like, a middle middle manager type. Not again,

And not early at Facebook, not like she was, like, employee four at Facebook. Like, she was, like, in the thousands of employees joined as, like, a middle middle manager type. Not again,

07:33

I say this not as disparagement because of how amazing it is. Like, she didn't do the things that you think you have to do to become like a self made millionaire.

I say this not as disparagement because of how amazing it is. Like, she didn't do the things that you think you have to do to become like a self made millionaire.

07:41

She joined Airbnb again as employee, I don't know, something hundred. What what was it? Maybe like three three or four hundred? No. A thousand. Oh, a thousand. Okay. Great. Great. And Airbnb goes public at evaluation of this four five x. And so, you know, if you're receiving a stock grant for, let's call it, sixty thousand dollars a year,

She joined Airbnb again as employee, I don't know, something hundred. What what was it? Maybe like three three or four hundred? No. A thousand. Oh, a thousand. Okay. Great. Great. And Airbnb goes public at evaluation of this four five x. And so, you know, if you're receiving a stock grant for, let's call it, sixty thousand dollars a year,

07:58

you know, on top of your you get you get some base comps. I'm just gonna use fake numbers. Base compensation, let's say, is one fifty, and then they give you fifty k of stock. A year. For four over four years, that's two hundred k of stock. But now the stock price, four or five x's, you made a million dollars during that time period.

you know, on top of your you get you get some base comps. I'm just gonna use fake numbers. Base compensation, let's say, is one fifty, and then they give you fifty k of stock. A year. For four over four years, that's two hundred k of stock. But now the stock price, four or five x's, you made a million dollars during that time period.

08:14

And you were safe. You didn't have to, like, work ninety hour weeks. You, got to work at a fun growing company that was gonna, like, win this category. And you didn't have to have this, like, amazing lightning and model genius idea in order to do it. And so she had done that a few times, and so we said, oh, this was actually intentional. You and Sarah sat down. And you guys were like, made lists. We like made lists. Like, what's like a five hundred person's company that has good maternity leave, you know, like these are all like the tell tell signs that it's like an interesting startup has, you're in the, you know, top quartile of pay just for off salary.

And you were safe. You didn't have to, like, work ninety hour weeks. You, got to work at a fun growing company that was gonna, like, win this category. And you didn't have to have this, like, amazing lightning and model genius idea in order to do it. And so she had done that a few times, and so we said, oh, this was actually intentional. You and Sarah sat down. And you guys were like, made lists. We like made lists. Like, what's like a five hundred person's company that has good maternity leave, you know, like these are all like the tell tell signs that it's like an interesting startup has, you're in the, you know, top quartile of pay just for off salary.

08:49

You have, interesting benefits, good health care, like all this stuff that a lot of startups

You have, interesting benefits, good health care, like all this stuff that a lot of startups

08:54

that are early don't have.

that are early don't have.

08:56

But big companies do, yet they can still five or ten x. So, yeah, we made that list. So we made the list and of the we put twelve companies on that list. This was like a year, a year and a half ago now. Twelve companies on that list, think we did the the recap. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think the in the year, year and a half since then, the average company values up, like, two and a half x or something crazy. And an eleven out of the twelve companies raised

But big companies do, yet they can still five or ten x. So, yeah, we made that list. So we made the list and of the we put twelve companies on that list. This was like a year, a year and a half ago now. Twelve companies on that list, think we did the the recap. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think the in the year, year and a half since then, the average company values up, like, two and a half x or something crazy. And an eleven out of the twelve companies raised

09:21

a, like, significant up round since then. So we were, like, very high hit rate And if you got in whatever your stock value would have been at that time, I think on average, it's something like two and a half x. Could be wrong. I I don't remember the math. But And so this lady sets a site by and I'm looking at it. This is amazing.

a, like, significant up round since then. So we were, like, very high hit rate And if you got in whatever your stock value would have been at that time, I think on average, it's something like two and a half x. Could be wrong. I I don't remember the math. But And so this lady sets a site by and I'm looking at it. This is amazing.

09:38

But the her email is she so she dm'd me on Twitter. And so whenever people deem me d DM me on Twitter, I either ignore them or I just, like, clicked a heart emoji. Like, thank you. I recognize you, but I don't wanna talk. And that's what I did with her. And I just replied, it said, I'm an idiot. This is you're actually you're you're different. Yeah.

But the her email is she so she dm'd me on Twitter. And so whenever people deem me d DM me on Twitter, I either ignore them or I just, like, clicked a heart emoji. Like, thank you. I recognize you, but I don't wanna talk. And that's what I did with her. And I just replied, it said, I'm an idiot. This is you're actually you're you're different. Yeah.

09:57

This is a really good one. So, okay. So then here's what I wanna do. So you go to the website. Just sarah's list dot com. It says twelve startups that can make you a millionaire. It's got a picture of richie Rich, which is hilarious. And then it goes, who is Sarah? Who are we, and why do we have any business sharing a list like this? And then it tells the story about Sarah, about us, whatever. Selection criteria, it's a it uses our criteria, which is that It's a company that's already valued over two hundred fifty million dollars. So it has a low risk profile, meaning it's likely not gonna go to zero, a stable work environment, a high salary, great benefits, but still can make you a millionaire because the the equity has potential to five to ten x. And then it has our list, which was like Flexport and Uniswap and Andrew and Replet and Airtable and Figma. Like Figma got acquired for whatever twenty billion or something like that or more than that.

This is a really good one. So, okay. So then here's what I wanna do. So you go to the website. Just sarah's list dot com. It says twelve startups that can make you a millionaire. It's got a picture of richie Rich, which is hilarious. And then it goes, who is Sarah? Who are we, and why do we have any business sharing a list like this? And then it tells the story about Sarah, about us, whatever. Selection criteria, it's a it uses our criteria, which is that It's a company that's already valued over two hundred fifty million dollars. So it has a low risk profile, meaning it's likely not gonna go to zero, a stable work environment, a high salary, great benefits, but still can make you a millionaire because the the equity has potential to five to ten x. And then it has our list, which was like Flexport and Uniswap and Andrew and Replet and Airtable and Figma. Like Figma got acquired for whatever twenty billion or something like that or more than that.

10:40

You know, after we, if we mentioned it on this list, when it was that's like a ten I think from where we mentioned it. So anyways,

You know, after we, if we mentioned it on this list, when it was that's like a ten I think from where we mentioned it. So anyways,

10:47

then it says find a friend at job. So you go to the job board and it goes, these are place holder jobs. You guys should consider syncing this up to one of these websites, but those cost money, which is why, and the last job host says I'm not doing it. And the tagline

then it says find a friend at job. So you go to the job board and it goes, these are place holder jobs. You guys should consider syncing this up to one of these websites, but those cost money, which is why, and the last job host says I'm not doing it. And the tagline

11:00

So the tagline at the bottom says Sarah's List. Get rich in five to ten years, over fifty percent guaranteed.

So the tagline at the bottom says Sarah's List. Get rich in five to ten years, over fifty percent guaranteed.

11:08

So hilarious. So then I started thinking. Okay. So I said, let's brainstorm this live here on the podcast.

So hilarious. So then I started thinking. Okay. So I said, let's brainstorm this live here on the podcast.

11:14

Should we do this deal?

Should we do this deal?

11:16

And No. And okay. So your your opinion is no, and give me why. No. Here's why. It's just a a a website that would take me five minutes or no. It would take me oh, it's a website that'd take me three hours to copy and a domain name. So for that reason, it's not that valuable. But What's more valuable is this lady,

And No. And okay. So your your opinion is no, and give me why. No. Here's why. It's just a a a website that would take me five minutes or no. It would take me oh, it's a website that'd take me three hours to copy and a domain name. So for that reason, it's not that valuable. But What's more valuable is this lady,

11:34

Kristen, who's making it. Yes. Her emails

Kristen, who's making it. Yes. Her emails

11:37

are are beautiful

are are beautiful

11:39

her copies, beautiful, her I just looked at her Twitter. This woman,

her copies, beautiful, her I just looked at her Twitter. This woman,

11:44

Kristen is the exact type of people that I like to be around. She also works at Expa. At which, XPA is basically a company founded by the founder of Uber Garrett. I think is Garrett Camp. Yeah. And they basically are a startup

Kristen is the exact type of people that I like to be around. She also works at Expa. At which, XPA is basically a company founded by the founder of Uber Garrett. I think is Garrett Camp. Yeah. And they basically are a startup

11:57

studio that launches companies. I don't actually know any of the companies that they've launched, but I imagine a lot of them are really successful, but she works there, which is also a really good, like, indicator that she's like on to something.

studio that launches companies. I don't actually know any of the companies that they've launched, but I imagine a lot of them are really successful, but she works there, which is also a really good, like, indicator that she's like on to something.

12:08

Do I think that we should buy this? Absolutely not. Do I think that I want this woman in my life and would love to work with her in some capacity? One hundred percent. Agreed. The real value here It's not the domain. It's not the website. It's Kristen Kent. Okay. So here's my here's my proposal to Kristen Kent. Here's my counter offer.

Do I think that we should buy this? Absolutely not. Do I think that I want this woman in my life and would love to work with her in some capacity? One hundred percent. Agreed. The real value here It's not the domain. It's not the website. It's Kristen Kent. Okay. So here's my here's my proposal to Kristen Kent. Here's my counter offer.

12:25

My public podcast counteroffer to you, Kristen.

My public podcast counteroffer to you, Kristen.

12:29

I'll give you the twenty thousand dollars. I'll give it to you. In fact, I'll give you the thirty thousand dollars that you paid for this, this domain. If you really paid that much for this domain, I mean, that's kinda crazy. And, but that comes with this catch.

I'll give you the twenty thousand dollars. I'll give it to you. In fact, I'll give you the thirty thousand dollars that you paid for this, this domain. If you really paid that much for this domain, I mean, that's kinda crazy. And, but that comes with this catch.

12:43

We're gonna work together on this project.

We're gonna work together on this project.

12:45

You're gonna do the work on the on the company side and I'm gonna do the work on the promotional side, the distribution side.

You're gonna do the work on the on the company side and I'm gonna do the work on the promotional side, the distribution side.

12:52

And here's what we're gonna do with Sarah's list.

And here's what we're gonna do with Sarah's list.

12:55

We're gonna turn Sarah's list into a half a million dollar a year

We're gonna turn Sarah's list into a half a million dollar a year

12:59

passive income stream. Passive ish, I should say. Passive for me. That's a little active for you.

passive income stream. Passive ish, I should say. Passive for me. That's a little active for you.

13:05

By the way, by the way, Sean, when you say, we we gotta let's remember that this is Sarah's list of which I am fifty percent of Sarah's list. So Whatever is is on the side right now. Sam said no. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. I got him on the record. No. A moment ago. And he's not a part of the account Sarah herself will get a one percent royalty as we use her name. Not a chance. Wait. Here's what we gotta do. What what per what percentage of the of the of the dividends, would you give or would you want Kristen to have?

By the way, by the way, Sean, when you say, we we gotta let's remember that this is Sarah's list of which I am fifty percent of Sarah's list. So Whatever is is on the side right now. Sam said no. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. I got him on the record. No. A moment ago. And he's not a part of the account Sarah herself will get a one percent royalty as we use her name. Not a chance. Wait. Here's what we gotta do. What what per what percentage of the of the of the dividends, would you give or would you want Kristen to have?

13:35

Kristen deserves fifty percent. She deserves fifty percent.

Kristen deserves fifty percent. She deserves fifty percent.

13:39

I agree that the other fifty percent split you and I. And we will. Ninety ten, you got sir.

I agree that the other fifty percent split you and I. And we will. Ninety ten, you got sir.

13:48

So the other share the royalty with Sarah.

So the other share the royalty with Sarah.

13:52

So here's what we're gonna do. Actually,

So here's what we're gonna do. Actually,

13:55

I don't know if I even wanna say this this deal. Now that we're having these, this this intense negotiation. I wanna give out my great idea. Okay. I'll give out my great idea. So here's the great idea. Here's how we're gonna make this work. So normally a job this is like monetized as a job board. Right? It would be a list of companies that we are curating saying these companies are great. And let's say we might take it to twenty four, twenty five companies,

I don't know if I even wanna say this this deal. Now that we're having these, this this intense negotiation. I wanna give out my great idea. Okay. I'll give out my great idea. So here's the great idea. Here's how we're gonna make this work. So normally a job this is like monetized as a job board. Right? It would be a list of companies that we are curating saying these companies are great. And let's say we might take it to twenty four, twenty five companies,

14:16

rather than the twelve we have today.

rather than the twelve we have today.

14:18

And normally on a job board, you pay, like, five hundred dollars a post,

And normally on a job board, you pay, like, five hundred dollars a post,

14:22

for for a job posting. So we would need to go reach out to those companies, get them to post.

for for a job posting. So we would need to go reach out to those companies, get them to post.

14:26

The other thing, you know, but but it hey. This is maybe premium. It's a curated job board. Maybe we could charge more, maybe a thousand, maybe two thousand dollars to be be posting your jobs on here.

The other thing, you know, but but it hey. This is maybe premium. It's a curated job board. Maybe we could charge more, maybe a thousand, maybe two thousand dollars to be be posting your jobs on here.

14:35

So if we've got people to do that, you know, let's say two thousand dollars a month, twenty four companies, let's say half half of them actually do it. You know, that's like twenty four k a month, not bad. But I think we're gonna be in this kind of constant sales outreach period. So let me put out a different idea.

So if we've got people to do that, you know, let's say two thousand dollars a month, twenty four companies, let's say half half of them actually do it. You know, that's like twenty four k a month, not bad. But I think we're gonna be in this kind of constant sales outreach period. So let me put out a different idea.

14:50

Here's a different idea.

Here's a different idea.

14:52

We're gonna take these companies, and we're gonna host a demo day once a quarter. What's that what's gonna happen at the demo day? We're gonna basically,

We're gonna take these companies, and we're gonna host a demo day once a quarter. What's that what's gonna happen at the demo day? We're gonna basically,

15:01

each week, we're gonna feature one of these companies. We're gonna create an email list. We're gonna spin off our current email list, and we're gonna say, gonna feature one of these companies. We're gonna go deep dive, but why this company is a good company to work for? And interested people, you know, high high quality people in tech might Well, that needs to be an upsell. That needs to be an upsell. Where it's like for twenty five doll for twenty five thousand, like, you get a deep dive. As a minority owner, I'm not sure you have a say here.

each week, we're gonna feature one of these companies. We're gonna create an email list. We're gonna spin off our current email list, and we're gonna say, gonna feature one of these companies. We're gonna go deep dive, but why this company is a good company to work for? And interested people, you know, high high quality people in tech might Well, that needs to be an upsell. That needs to be an upsell. Where it's like for twenty five doll for twenty five thousand, like, you get a deep dive. As a minority owner, I'm not sure you have a say here.

15:25

So

So

15:27

I could barely hear your voice. It was so faint like your equity ownership in this.

I could barely hear your voice. It was so faint like your equity ownership in this.

15:32

So so So you're If we're in the same room, do you think I would have hit you already? Or

So so So you're If we're in the same room, do you think I would have hit you already? Or

15:38

or will that be coming in the next? Will that be coming in the next ten minutes or would it have already have happened?

or will that be coming in the next? Will that be coming in the next ten minutes or would it have already have happened?

15:45

So

So

15:46

so you know the way you promoted Hussle Con where you used to write these kind of blog posts once a week. I think you would you would feature speaker of Hussle Con, and you would tell their story in this awesome infographic, and then you would say, do you like stories like this? You should come to Hussle Con we're gonna have twenty five bad ass entrepreneurs, including this person speaking there, and you should attend. And you did that for twelve, like, twenty five weeks. And you sold out, like, five hundred tickets to this thing. So what we're gonna do is we're gonna do that once a week cadence about these companies, do a little deep dive. That's a email. And then

so you know the way you promoted Hussle Con where you used to write these kind of blog posts once a week. I think you would you would feature speaker of Hussle Con, and you would tell their story in this awesome infographic, and then you would say, do you like stories like this? You should come to Hussle Con we're gonna have twenty five bad ass entrepreneurs, including this person speaking there, and you should attend. And you did that for twelve, like, twenty five weeks. And you sold out, like, five hundred tickets to this thing. So what we're gonna do is we're gonna do that once a week cadence about these companies, do a little deep dive. That's a email. And then

16:15

it's gonna get people to attend

it's gonna get people to attend

16:17

the

the

16:18

the hiring day. And hiring day is where the founder of those companies gonna come, and they're gonna give

the hiring day. And hiring day is where the founder of those companies gonna come, and they're gonna give

16:23

them a little five minute flash presentation on their company. And it's gonna be a cure and applicants apply to join. And these are you gotta be good to join. That's why we gotta keep the quality high on the company side and the applicant side. And then we're not charging for a job posting. We take the rec like the recruiter fee because when a recruiter places a candidate, one of these companies, they take twenty or thirty thousand dollars right away. And so if we could place, like, twenty five candidates in a year

them a little five minute flash presentation on their company. And it's gonna be a cure and applicants apply to join. And these are you gotta be good to join. That's why we gotta keep the quality high on the company side and the applicant side. And then we're not charging for a job posting. We take the rec like the recruiter fee because when a recruiter places a candidate, one of these companies, they take twenty or thirty thousand dollars right away. And so if we could place, like, twenty five candidates in a year

16:47

at twenty thousand dollars a pop, you're talking half a million dollars of

at twenty thousand dollars a pop, you're talking half a million dollars of

16:52

of revenue, which is basically all we have to do is hire a writer. We're gonna hire a ghost writer who's just gonna write these company deep dives on the companies that we select. Have you heard of the daily,

of revenue, which is basically all we have to do is hire a writer. We're gonna hire a ghost writer who's just gonna write these company deep dives on the companies that we select. Have you heard of the daily,

17:01

it was called the daily muse. Now it's called the muse, the muse dot com. Have you heard of that company?

it was called the daily muse. Now it's called the muse, the muse dot com. Have you heard of that company?

17:07

The muse dot com. No. I don't think so. Was that right? Oh, it's like a women's tiring thing. Was that the Yeah. The muse thought. Yeah. It was it's called the muse dot com. It's been around now for ten years. And the woman who started, I've been actually DMming. I've been wanting to come on here. She went to Duke too. Oh, did Catherine, I take her name as? Yeah. And so she went to YC. And so I actually

The muse dot com. No. I don't think so. Was that right? Oh, it's like a women's tiring thing. Was that the Yeah. The muse thought. Yeah. It was it's called the muse dot com. It's been around now for ten years. And the woman who started, I've been actually DMming. I've been wanting to come on here. She went to Duke too. Oh, did Catherine, I take her name as? Yeah. And so she went to YC. And so I actually

17:25

originally thought they that this was a great idea, but they screwed it up by raising a lot of money. And I think they've raised twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, tens of millions. I I don't know the exact number. But basically, what they would do is they would do these deep dives on companies and charged the company some, like, fairly big fee to do a deep dive on the company, and they somehow got tons of traffic. Now they're still getting eight million people a month coming to their website or six million, something like that. And they had tons of people coming to their website from search, which is incredibly valuable.

originally thought they that this was a great idea, but they screwed it up by raising a lot of money. And I think they've raised twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, tens of millions. I I don't know the exact number. But basically, what they would do is they would do these deep dives on companies and charged the company some, like, fairly big fee to do a deep dive on the company, and they somehow got tons of traffic. Now they're still getting eight million people a month coming to their website or six million, something like that. And they had tons of people coming to their website from search, which is incredibly valuable.

17:55

And I thought that they, like, were just chugging along, but, like, not doing that great because I hadn't heard about them. I have a feeling they actually might be killing they've raised a lot of money and they actually are starting to buy other companies at this point. And they do these deep dives on companies. And another guy who does this is packing McCormick And I have no idea what he charges for this anymore, but when the economy was crushing it, I think he was charging twenty five to fifty thousand dollars -- More more. -- per deep dive. I think it was a little more. I remember he was making a hundred thousand a month if I recall correctly off his deep dives, and I think he might have been doing one or two Wow. That that's pretty amazing. And so I think you could do something like that. Here's the milk road, by the way. We do a deep dive thing, and it's like, I don't know, I forgot what it cost. I think it's it's like something between twenty five and forty k depending on on the total, like, promotion. And who do you hire to do that?

And I thought that they, like, were just chugging along, but, like, not doing that great because I hadn't heard about them. I have a feeling they actually might be killing they've raised a lot of money and they actually are starting to buy other companies at this point. And they do these deep dives on companies. And another guy who does this is packing McCormick And I have no idea what he charges for this anymore, but when the economy was crushing it, I think he was charging twenty five to fifty thousand dollars -- More more. -- per deep dive. I think it was a little more. I remember he was making a hundred thousand a month if I recall correctly off his deep dives, and I think he might have been doing one or two Wow. That that's pretty amazing. And so I think you could do something like that. Here's the milk road, by the way. We do a deep dive thing, and it's like, I don't know, I forgot what it cost. I think it's it's like something between twenty five and forty k depending on on the total, like, promotion. And who do you hire to do that?

18:41

I wrote the first few because our like, we have one of our writers wrote it that I, like, kinda, like, changed it big time, but now we are hiring a writer just to do the deep dives. How much would you pay a writer to do that?

I wrote the first few because our like, we have one of our writers wrote it that I, like, kinda, like, changed it big time, but now we are hiring a writer just to do the deep dives. How much would you pay a writer to do that?

18:53

Couple grand a month, like, two grand a month?

Couple grand a month, like, two grand a month?

18:56

No. No. You really get that. It's per deep dive. Like, pay two thousand dollars for, like, one article.

No. No. You really get that. It's per deep dive. Like, pay two thousand dollars for, like, one article.

19:02

So this is the the value is not in the writing. The value is in that we have a huge list, and that if we promote something to this huge list, you're gonna get a bunch of of traction or you're gonna usage or you're gonna get candidates or whatever it is. So the writer is not bringing the value. The writer just needs to deliver value, but the the list is what the list size why you can charge that much.

So this is the the value is not in the writing. The value is in that we have a huge list, and that if we promote something to this huge list, you're gonna get a bunch of of traction or you're gonna usage or you're gonna get candidates or whatever it is. So the writer is not bringing the value. The writer just needs to deliver value, but the the list is what the list size why you can charge that much.

19:21

Yeah. It's pretty fascinating. I think this is an in really interesting business. I've always I mean, I'm the one who even turns you on to job boards. Aren't I? So, like, you know, your email.

Yeah. It's pretty fascinating. I think this is an in really interesting business. I've always I mean, I'm the one who even turns you on to job boards. Aren't I? So, like, you know, your email.

19:31

Yeah. I don't even I wouldn't have even met Sarah, had you not

Yeah. I don't even I wouldn't have even met Sarah, had you not

19:36

actually Yeah. It's a hundred percent.

actually Yeah. It's a hundred percent.

19:40

I have introduced you to Liz and Sarah. So

I have introduced you to Liz and Sarah. So

19:44

and before me, you weren't even into dot com. So, like,

and before me, you weren't even into dot com. So, like,

19:48

you're welcome.

you're welcome.

19:49

So,

So,

19:51

I think kudos to Kristen, I think she's on to something Well, I think we're onto something. But, she also, it it seems pretty special. Like I said, if you want, if you want a side hustle that'll make, I don't know, two hundred and fifty k a year for you,

I think kudos to Kristen, I think she's on to something Well, I think we're onto something. But, she also, it it seems pretty special. Like I said, if you want, if you want a side hustle that'll make, I don't know, two hundred and fifty k a year for you,

20:03

it's there for the taking.

it's there for the taking.

20:05

I think that's understandable. All you gotta do is all the work.

I think that's understandable. All you gotta do is all the work.

20:13

Yeah. But we'll we'll promote it here. This is an interesting thing.

Yeah. But we'll we'll promote it here. This is an interesting thing.

20:16

I

I

20:19

don't think this is an event venture sized business, which is I I guess why Expa isn't going after it, but it maybe could be.

don't think this is an event venture sized business, which is I I guess why Expa isn't going after it, but it maybe could be.

20:27

It may There was a business back in the day that went through YC called developer auction. Do you remember this?

It may There was a business back in the day that went through YC called developer auction. Do you remember this?

20:32

No. But that sounds a little weird. That's not a great name. In a great way. So, basically, what they did was they were like No, dude. That's not. Oxying

No. But that sounds a little weird. That's not a great name. In a great way. So, basically, what they did was they were like No, dude. That's not. Oxying

20:40

humans doesn't exactly have the best branding.

humans doesn't exactly have the best branding.

20:43

That's why it was great. It's a head turner. And, and, you know, when you're a small company, you need to be a head turner. And so,

That's why it was great. It's a head turner. And, and, you know, when you're a small company, you need to be a head turner. And so,

20:50

so these guys basically, they they realized they were like, wait, the power dynamic is off. Why is it all about applying to jobs when actually, like, the developer is, like, the most valuable, like, developer is, like, gold in Silicon Valley. And so they said, why don't we just curate, like, the top developers?

so these guys basically, they they realized they were like, wait, the power dynamic is off. Why is it all about applying to jobs when actually, like, the developer is, like, the most valuable, like, developer is, like, gold in Silicon Valley. And so they said, why don't we just curate, like, the top developers?

21:05

So, like, who are these quote, ten x engineers?

So, like, who are these quote, ten x engineers?

21:08

And then let's just have them almost like a beauty pageant.

And then let's just have them almost like a beauty pageant.

21:12

They walk down the stage, and then and the companies are, like, raising their paddle. I guess that's not what happened to a beauty pageant, but, like, an auction. Where the the companies were raising the panel be like, I'll give him three hundred thousand. I'll give him four hundred thousand. I'll do his laundry and then someone's like, you know, all

They walk down the stage, and then and the companies are, like, raising their paddle. I guess that's not what happened to a beauty pageant, but, like, an auction. Where the the companies were raising the panel be like, I'll give him three hundred thousand. I'll give him four hundred thousand. I'll do his laundry and then someone's like, you know, all

21:26

And it's like, you know, that's basically, like, the companies were, like, just falling over themselves trying to get this talent. And so they did one, and it was amazing. It was, like, you know, fifty engineers or whatever, And all the engineers got this huge pay jump from these top companies that are like, oh, shit. That's awesome. And then it it built a slow flywheel where they're, like, the next batch of really great developers, like, yeah. Yeah. Do you're gonna do all the work for me to, like, give me my next job offers.

And it's like, you know, that's basically, like, the companies were, like, just falling over themselves trying to get this talent. And so they did one, and it was amazing. It was, like, you know, fifty engineers or whatever, And all the engineers got this huge pay jump from these top companies that are like, oh, shit. That's awesome. And then it it built a slow flywheel where they're, like, the next batch of really great developers, like, yeah. Yeah. Do you're gonna do all the work for me to, like, give me my next job offers.

21:48

Awesome. All I gotta do is just go and explain how, like, yeah, I help scale Netflix is like video infrastructure so that, you know, we got this latency and this blah blah blah.

Awesome. All I gotta do is just go and explain how, like, yeah, I help scale Netflix is like video infrastructure so that, you know, we got this latency and this blah blah blah.

21:57

So they would just go explain what they did and then the companies would bid. And it was kind of a great idea. I thought they eventually, but the problem is it wasn't gonna scale up. It was like two almost boutique. And so in order to scale up, they changed the model and then ended up pivoting into something else altogether. But, like, if you just kept it boutique, which again, you you can't do this if you raise a bunch of venture money because then your expectations to go huge.

So they would just go explain what they did and then the companies would bid. And it was kind of a great idea. I thought they eventually, but the problem is it wasn't gonna scale up. It was like two almost boutique. And so in order to scale up, they changed the model and then ended up pivoting into something else altogether. But, like, if you just kept it boutique, which again, you you can't do this if you raise a bunch of venture money because then your expectations to go huge.

22:19

But if you're like, if you like making, you know, a million dollars,

But if you're like, if you like making, you know, a million dollars,

22:23

a, you know, a year of, like, passive income, you could do that with a boutique model, like, just by bay basically creating a demo day, but instead of startups pitching investors,

a, you know, a year of, like, passive income, you could do that with a boutique model, like, just by bay basically creating a demo day, but instead of startups pitching investors,

22:32

you have

you have

22:33

you have companies

you have companies

22:34

pitching to to top talent. And so you could just if you're good at curating, right, if you're a good curator, right? We we did a good job curating on the company side. Now you just gotta do a good job creating on the talent side. You could actually create a pretty solid side hustle here. Do enjoy working with your wife.

pitching to to top talent. And so you could just if you're good at curating, right, if you're a good curator, right? We we did a good job curating on the company side. Now you just gotta do a good job creating on the talent side. You could actually create a pretty solid side hustle here. Do enjoy working with your wife.

22:51

No.

No.

22:55

I, There are enjoyable things

I, There are enjoyable things

22:58

but there are also some very unenjoyable

but there are also some very unenjoyable

23:01

things. I but I tell you this on everything. If we have to, like, assemble some, like, Ikea furniture, I'm, like, I hate doing projects with you. And, like, because, like, we're both, we're both too stubborn. We both want our way.

things. I but I tell you this on everything. If we have to, like, assemble some, like, Ikea furniture, I'm, like, I hate doing projects with you. And, like, because, like, we're both, we're both too stubborn. We both want our way.

23:12

And, like, why don't you just listen? And she's, like, why don't you just listen? I'm, like, because I don't wanna listen. And she's like, what needs anyone?

And, like, why don't you just listen? And she's, like, why don't you just listen? I'm, like, because I don't wanna listen. And she's like, what needs anyone?

23:21

I, so I've been I've I'm I'm coming out. I'm gonna do the ideation boot camp again. And I,

I, so I've been I've I'm I'm coming out. I'm gonna do the ideation boot camp again. And I,

23:28

was trying to commit Sarah to, like, quit her job and, like, do this. And it ain't happening. We, like, did a we did a few test trials and No. We took dinner to get her in. Yeah. It

was trying to commit Sarah to, like, quit her job and, like, do this. And it ain't happening. We, like, did a we did a few test trials and No. We took dinner to get her in. Yeah. It

23:39

it didn't work out. Like, it it just

it didn't work out. Like, it it just

23:42

Like, me talking to her, like, work coworkers just just doesn't work. Yes. That's exactly the problem. I talked to her, like, I would talk to somebody who's, like, you know, somebody, you know, on my team at my startup.

Like, me talking to her, like, work coworkers just just doesn't work. Yes. That's exactly the problem. I talked to her, like, I would talk to somebody who's, like, you know, somebody, you know, on my team at my startup.

23:53

And she's just like,

And she's just like,

23:55

why are you speaking to me like this? And I'm like, well, but I'm not in husband mode right now. I mean, like,

why are you speaking to me like this? And I'm like, well, but I'm not in husband mode right now. I mean, like,

24:01

it's modes.

it's modes.

24:02

It's modes. It's just like

It's modes. It's just like

24:04

I would be like, look, you're not stupid, but this is stupid. And she'd be like,

I would be like, look, you're not stupid, but this is stupid. And she'd be like,

24:09

Why are you talking to me like this? I'm like, what do you mean? I'm I'm I'm trying to encourage you. And, like, don't you wanna, like, climb this organization's

Why are you talking to me like this? I'm like, what do you mean? I'm I'm I'm trying to encourage you. And, like, don't you wanna, like, climb this organization's

24:17

ladder. Like, don't you wanna be great and achieve great things? She's like, just wants to punch me in the stomach and act the way out of me. I'm like,

ladder. Like, don't you wanna be great and achieve great things? She's like, just wants to punch me in the stomach and act the way out of me. I'm like,

24:25

Yeah. I don't know if this is gonna work. I wanted this to work, but I I don't think this can happen. So I

Yeah. I don't know if this is gonna work. I wanted this to work, but I I don't think this can happen. So I

24:30

don't know how the couples do it, but,

don't know how the couples do it, but,

24:34

It it wasn't working for us. There are many great examples. Like, the founders of Eventbrite

It it wasn't working for us. There are many great examples. Like, the founders of Eventbrite

24:38

were, that's a husband and wife couple

were, that's a husband and wife couple

24:41

the founders of of Bebo back in the day is Oceo and Michael Burst. They're husband and wife couple. They work together just great.

the founders of of Bebo back in the day is Oceo and Michael Burst. They're husband and wife couple. They work together just great.

24:47

And, yeah, but I think it needs, like, that complimentary

And, yeah, but I think it needs, like, that complimentary

24:51

personalities where one

personalities where one

24:53

and also, like,

and also, like,

24:55

I don't have the best bedside manner. You know, it was a shock

I don't have the best bedside manner. You know, it was a shock

24:59

Like, you know, pretty direct and pretty blunt about stuff.

Like, you know, pretty direct and pretty blunt about stuff.

25:04

And I, you know, I don't have that thing that some people have going for them. I think you have this where you could just be

And I, you know, I don't have that thing that some people have going for them. I think you have this where you could just be

25:09

hella blunt, and it's, like, it's a Sam being Sam. Like, you know, you know, he's gotta he he gets he gets to play by his own rules because that's just the way he is.

hella blunt, and it's, like, it's a Sam being Sam. Like, you know, you know, he's gotta he he gets he gets to play by his own rules because that's just the way he is.

25:18

I have,

I have,

25:20

like,

like,

25:20

I have too much finesse in my game. Like, if you have if you have no finesse, people are like, he's got no finesse. It's fine. Like, he's just being blunt don't take it seriously. But if you have any, then it's like, oh, he could have said that differently, but he chose to say it the wrong way. And you don't get the you don't get that, like, that, you know, that past. To just, like, you know, say things, you know, the the wrong way.

I have too much finesse in my game. Like, if you have if you have no finesse, people are like, he's got no finesse. It's fine. Like, he's just being blunt don't take it seriously. But if you have any, then it's like, oh, he could have said that differently, but he chose to say it the wrong way. And you don't get the you don't get that, like, that, you know, that past. To just, like, you know, say things, you know, the the wrong way.

25:41

Earlier in the episode, we said you would describe,

Earlier in the episode, we said you would describe,

25:45

palmer Lucky in one word. And I think, you know, we both said different things. If I had to describe

palmer Lucky in one word. And I think, you know, we both said different things. If I had to describe

25:51

the this last sixty minute episode in one word, I would say

the this last sixty minute episode in one word, I would say

25:56

exhausting.

exhausting.

25:58

This was an exhausting. I I feel like I just went on, like, a journey with you. And I need to go rest my eyes.

This was an exhausting. I I feel like I just went on, like, a journey with you. And I need to go rest my eyes.

26:06

Is that how you feel? No. I'm just getting stronger by the minute.

Is that how you feel? No. I'm just getting stronger by the minute.

26:10

Dude, that that I believe that's called anti fragile. You and I are not the same. I'm about to eat.

Dude, that that I believe that's called anti fragile. You and I are not the same. I'm about to eat.

26:17

Yeah. You and I are absolutely not the same. Where do we go from here? We end it here? Do we keep going? I wanna do two little things. One. Alright.

Yeah. You and I are absolutely not the same. Where do we go from here? We end it here? Do we keep going? I wanna do two little things. One. Alright.

26:25

I just wanna have a moment of silence for the Mailchimp CEO.

I just wanna have a moment of silence for the Mailchimp CEO.

26:29

What happened? He got wait. The Mailchimp CEO or the founder,

What happened? He got wait. The Mailchimp CEO or the founder,

26:32

Ben.

Ben.

26:33

Ben,

Ben,

26:34

who was the CEO, I think. Right? He was. I think he quit when they sold it. So I I don't know exactly.

who was the CEO, I think. Right? He was. I think he quit when they sold it. So I I don't know exactly.

26:41

Ben Chest down as fuck. Who I leave?

Ben Chest down as fuck. Who I leave?

26:45

So, okay. So so Mailchimp was this, like, darling.

So, okay. So so Mailchimp was this, like, darling.

26:49

They were bootstrapped.

They were bootstrapped.

26:50

I think they're bootstrapped forever. Then they sold to Intuit for many billions of dollars.

I think they're bootstrapped forever. Then they sold to Intuit for many billions of dollars.

26:55

And they did it for, like, twenty years, and they did it out of, like, Atlanta. So they were, like, this indie success story. Right? Like, they're like, you know, like, there's like hundreds of indie hackers right now on indie hackers dot com that, like By the way, you said Atlanta in a very funny way. It's kinda like I usually say Detroit.

And they did it for, like, twenty years, and they did it out of, like, Atlanta. So they were, like, this indie success story. Right? Like, they're like, you know, like, there's like hundreds of indie hackers right now on indie hackers dot com that, like By the way, you said Atlanta in a very funny way. It's kinda like I usually say Detroit.

27:11

You just said Atlanta. You put a you put a hard AT on that. Atlanta. I like that.

You just said Atlanta. You put a you put a hard AT on that. Atlanta. I like that.

27:17

Atlanta.

Atlanta.

27:19

Okay. Well

Okay. Well

27:20

You know, it's like deep Detroit Detroit Atlanta, but don't have

You know, it's like deep Detroit Detroit Atlanta, but don't have

27:25

So this guy, he he had to step down. So he goes,

So this guy, he he had to step down. So he goes,

27:29

so did you see what what he did or what happened? So he sent a,

so did you see what what he did or what happened? So he sent a,

27:34

So he he sent, like, an email or something like that where where his little pull up? I see it. Yeah. He basically just said,

So he he sent, like, an email or something like that where where his little pull up? I see it. Yeah. He basically just said,

27:41

he's, he basically,

he's, he basically,

27:43

said, Chestnut said he identified a dangerous trend in his workforce, new hires introducing themselves using their preferred pronouns. This has come completely unnecessary for a woman who is clearly a woman to tell us her pronouns as she, her, and a man who is clearly a man to tell us that his pronouns are he him. He wrote in an email, to a small group of employees.

said, Chestnut said he identified a dangerous trend in his workforce, new hires introducing themselves using their preferred pronouns. This has come completely unnecessary for a woman who is clearly a woman to tell us her pronouns as she, her, and a man who is clearly a man to tell us that his pronouns are he him. He wrote in an email, to a small group of employees.

28:04

Instead, Chestnut said he understood the practice as rooting kindness but added that In the long run, this approach just more harm than good, forcing people to behave in certain ways that are the opposite of inclusion.

Instead, Chestnut said he understood the practice as rooting kindness but added that In the long run, this approach just more harm than good, forcing people to behave in certain ways that are the opposite of inclusion.

28:15

Okay.

Okay.

28:16

Sounds not horrible, but,

Sounds not horrible, but,

28:19

that's a dangerous

that's a dangerous

28:20

dangerous path to go down. By the way, my recommendation to all of us is to just not comment on this. I think we should just read what happened.

dangerous path to go down. By the way, my recommendation to all of us is to just not comment on this. I think we should just read what happened.

28:28

And then a moment of silence for for,

And then a moment of silence for for,

28:31

for for this guy for getting fired from basically fired here. Oh, I stepped down coincidentally right after this.

for for this guy for getting fired from basically fired here. Oh, I stepped down coincidentally right after this.

28:37

But, you know, for for, you know, whether you agree with him or disagree with him, I kind of feel like having to step down is a pretty,

But, you know, for for, you know, whether you agree with him or disagree with him, I kind of feel like having to step down is a pretty,

28:44

like, severe pedal having to step down from your own company is a pretty severe penalty for, like, having a point of view on this stuff. But, like,

like, severe pedal having to step down from your own company is a pretty severe penalty for, like, having a point of view on this stuff. But, like,

28:51

maybe that's, like, maybe it's a lot more severe than I think. I don't know. Like Well, what's great I think that when you look at when you think about these things,

maybe that's, like, maybe it's a lot more severe than I think. I don't know. Like Well, what's great I think that when you look at when you think about these things,

28:59

words aren't just words. You have to look at intentions. Right. And his intention, if you we don't even have to read it. But his intention is not to say that

words aren't just words. You have to look at intentions. Right. And his intention, if you we don't even have to read it. But his intention is not to say that

29:10

any his intentions are good. His intentions actually, I think, are rooted in, like, I wanna make everyone feel and I wanna be productive. And I, you know, whatever.

any his intentions are good. His intentions actually, I think, are rooted in, like, I wanna make everyone feel and I wanna be productive. And I, you know, whatever.

29:18

And

And

29:19

I'm just reading this email a little bit. Like, here's live. And so it does seen, like, a negative email. Here here's the part where I think he got dicey form. So he goes,

I'm just reading this email a little bit. Like, here's live. And so it does seen, like, a negative email. Here here's the part where I think he got dicey form. So he goes,

29:28

he go in the email, he goes,

he go in the email, he goes,

29:30

First, there is a tiny number of peeps at Mailchimp. Strange to use peeps. Maybe that's, like, what they call themselves. Is that, like, a chip word. Yeah. So there's a very tiny number of peeps at Mailchimp who consider themselves transgender,

First, there is a tiny number of peeps at Mailchimp. Strange to use peeps. Maybe that's, like, what they call themselves. Is that, like, a chip word. Yeah. So there's a very tiny number of peeps at Mailchimp who consider themselves transgender,

29:42

forcing either with orders or through guilt.

forcing either with orders or through guilt.

29:45

The approximately thir thirteen hundred other peeps to adopt a new communication paradigm

The approximately thir thirteen hundred other peeps to adopt a new communication paradigm

29:50

that humanity has never had to use in our three hundred thousand years of existence. And under a hundred fifty thousand years of spoken language, in order to make things slightly more comfortable for an extremely small group of peeps is completely

that humanity has never had to use in our three hundred thousand years of existence. And under a hundred fifty thousand years of spoken language, in order to make things slightly more comfortable for an extremely small group of peeps is completely

30:01

illogical.

illogical.

30:02

And he says that if you're forced to do something illogical,

And he says that if you're forced to do something illogical,

30:05

eventually you will believe and do anything, even if it's vicious.

eventually you will believe and do anything, even if it's vicious.

30:09

So, okay, that's like a little, like,

So, okay, that's like a little, like,

30:12

He says, now nowadays, everything is incredibly politicized. I'm finding that peeps are no longer motivated by meaningful work. They're motivated to make political statements. They're using company time and company resources to win a game, again, against their opponents in a game that is raging in their minds and on social media.

He says, now nowadays, everything is incredibly politicized. I'm finding that peeps are no longer motivated by meaningful work. They're motivated to make political statements. They're using company time and company resources to win a game, again, against their opponents in a game that is raging in their minds and on social media.

30:27

Understanding

Understanding

30:28

and respecting that people can have different different views as part of being American, part of being mature adults, peeps of all different, political leanings are free to vote the way they want, blah, blah, blah, but it's not for the workplace.

and respecting that people can have different different views as part of being American, part of being mature adults, peeps of all different, political leanings are free to vote the way they want, blah, blah, blah, but it's not for the workplace.

30:38

So that's what he said.

So that's what he said.

30:40

I'll leave it to anybody to agree or disagree. My personal opinion

I'll leave it to anybody to agree or disagree. My personal opinion

30:44

is

is

30:46

I understand what he's trying to say. I think he said it in a pretty stupid way. Like, it's a little too aggressive.

I understand what he's trying to say. I think he said it in a pretty stupid way. Like, it's a little too aggressive.

30:53

And also Using the word peeps when you're talking about these things is also, like, if I I I I agree with the sentiment here, but I think that if I

And also Using the word peeps when you're talking about these things is also, like, if I I I I agree with the sentiment here, but I think that if I

31:03

if it were a hot button issue, I wouldn't use slang. Yeah. You can't be like, to the homies that had to use the Yeah.

if it were a hot button issue, I wouldn't use slang. Yeah. You can't be like, to the homies that had to use the Yeah.

31:11

I guess internally made they must just always use that. Use that. Like, you know, like Facebook had, like, whatever, like, now has, like, meta made or whatever. Like Dude,

I guess internally made they must just always use that. Use that. Like, you know, like Facebook had, like, whatever, like, now has, like, meta made or whatever. Like Dude,

31:20

it's kind of like to use a pronoun is unmetimate.

it's kind of like to use a pronoun is unmetimate.

31:23

Right? There's two words that I hate you think in a serious, like, argument or discussion, like, if I'm talking to Sarah, my wife or, like, someone else about, like, look, like, you know, they said this in their tweets. Like, if it's ever, like, the word tweets in an argument, like,

Right? There's two words that I hate you think in a serious, like, argument or discussion, like, if I'm talking to Sarah, my wife or, like, someone else about, like, look, like, you know, they said this in their tweets. Like, if it's ever, like, the word tweets in an argument, like,

31:37

do well, I tweeted that. Did you see their tweet? Did you see their tweets? You know what I mean? Like, I don't

do well, I tweeted that. Did you see their tweet? Did you see their tweets? You know what I mean? Like, I don't

31:42

Well, he tweeted it. Like, I I don't wanna use that word or text.

Well, he tweeted it. Like, I I don't wanna use that word or text.

31:46

That word text. Yeah. Like, when I'm having a serious conversation, I wanna talk about something, and I gotta use Well, he tweeted that. You see his tweets? Yeah. Because it's too it's, like, a tooted Adam, and it's, like, you know, it doesn't sound. Not a fan. Strong. But, yeah, I remember when I had peeps to that list. So, yeah, RIP, Ben, I like then, I don't know him. I'm acting like I do. I've cold emailed him a ton of times and he's never replied to me, but, so we kinda know each other. So And,

That word text. Yeah. Like, when I'm having a serious conversation, I wanna talk about something, and I gotta use Well, he tweeted that. You see his tweets? Yeah. Because it's too it's, like, a tooted Adam, and it's, like, you know, it doesn't sound. Not a fan. Strong. But, yeah, I remember when I had peeps to that list. So, yeah, RIP, Ben, I like then, I don't know him. I'm acting like I do. I've cold emailed him a ton of times and he's never replied to me, but, so we kinda know each other. So And,

32:12

Yeah.

Yeah.

32:14

I guess he's just one of those peeps. Yeah. He doesn't reply to my emails. You can take a look at this. So those peeps

I guess he's just one of those peeps. Yeah. He doesn't reply to my emails. You can take a look at this. So those peeps

32:21

Yeah. He's he's him and a six billion can go off and be unhappy by themselves. But, you know, whatever,

Yeah. He's he's him and a six billion can go off and be unhappy by themselves. But, you know, whatever,

32:27

I like Ben Chestma. Chestma. I love Mailchimp. Think it's a great company. Yeah.

I like Ben Chestma. Chestma. I love Mailchimp. Think it's a great company. Yeah.

32:33

Me too. I think Mailchimp is a is a cool, really cool success story.

Me too. I think Mailchimp is a is a cool, really cool success story.

32:38

This data is wrong, every freaking time thing.

This data is wrong, every freaking time thing.

32:41

Have you heard of HubSpot?

Have you heard of HubSpot?

32:43

HubSpot is a CRM platform where everything is fully integrated. Well, I can see the clients hold history, calls, support ticket, emails, and here's a test from three days ago I totally missed.

HubSpot is a CRM platform where everything is fully integrated. Well, I can see the clients hold history, calls, support ticket, emails, and here's a test from three days ago I totally missed.

32:55

Hubspot, grow better.

Hubspot, grow better.

32:58

Do you, do you wanna talk about Nikita?

Do you, do you wanna talk about Nikita?

33:01

Yeah. We kinda did, but it seemed like I know. We glossed it over, I think. So at the end of a podcast a few days ago, the Sean story one, we talked about this guy Nikita Beer who you and I are both friends with but we talked about it at the end of, like, an hour session, and I realized

Yeah. We kinda did, but it seemed like I know. We glossed it over, I think. So at the end of a podcast a few days ago, the Sean story one, we talked about this guy Nikita Beer who you and I are both friends with but we talked about it at the end of, like, an hour session, and I realized

33:16

this is actually really amazing and deserves a significantly more time. And so I'll just kinda give Yeah. So Nikita Beard, he's our good friend. We're in a group text message, with him. And that's actually how I got to know him. And everything I'm gonna explain most everything is public information. So this is, like, through articles and his Twitter feed. So I'm not gonna say anything that is confidential, but basically,

this is actually really amazing and deserves a significantly more time. And so I'll just kinda give Yeah. So Nikita Beard, he's our good friend. We're in a group text message, with him. And that's actually how I got to know him. And everything I'm gonna explain most everything is public information. So this is, like, through articles and his Twitter feed. So I'm not gonna say anything that is confidential, but basically,

33:38

He started an app called TBH. So he went to school in Berkeley, California, started an app called TBH, which was basically,

He started an app called TBH. So he went to school in Berkeley, California, started an app called TBH, which was basically,

33:45

some type of like viral high school app that, like, you could answer questions about your peers, something like that. No. It it wasn't incredibly significant of an app, but it went viral and got millions of users very quickly after him spending over two years trying to create viral apps. And so we kinda felt like he kinda honed in on what works and more importantly what doesn't work. Facebook eventually buys the app for tens of millions of dollars. Originally, it was said to be like a hundred million. I think in a recent article, they're like, it was actually like forty million, which is still a great outcome. And that was about five years ago. And so

some type of like viral high school app that, like, you could answer questions about your peers, something like that. No. It it wasn't incredibly significant of an app, but it went viral and got millions of users very quickly after him spending over two years trying to create viral apps. And so we kinda felt like he kinda honed in on what works and more importantly what doesn't work. Facebook eventually buys the app for tens of millions of dollars. Originally, it was said to be like a hundred million. I think in a recent article, they're like, it was actually like forty million, which is still a great outcome. And that was about five years ago. And so

34:17

Nikita said something in the group message which he says, I think it'd be an interesting idea

Nikita said something in the group message which he says, I think it'd be an interesting idea

34:23

to ask myself or to figure out how can I build You're you're making it too soft? I remember exactly how he said it. It's it's like, oh, so what are you doing? What are you up to nowadays? Oh, Sam, you sold are you doing? Sean, you so be what are you gonna do? Nikita, you're sitting at Facebook. What are you doing? And he's basically he just said it straight straight up. He goes,

to ask myself or to figure out how can I build You're you're making it too soft? I remember exactly how he said it. It's it's like, oh, so what are you doing? What are you up to nowadays? Oh, Sam, you sold are you doing? Sean, you so be what are you gonna do? Nikita, you're sitting at Facebook. What are you doing? And he's basically he just said it straight straight up. He goes,

34:41

I'm just thinking about how I can make ten million dollars in three months.

I'm just thinking about how I can make ten million dollars in three months.

34:46

Like, I and if we're like, what? And he's like, yeah. I wanna make an app that generates, like, ten million dollars in ninety days.

Like, I and if we're like, what? And he's like, yeah. I wanna make an app that generates, like, ten million dollars in ninety days.

34:53

And we talked about that. Like, that's just crazy. That's outlandish. We brought it up on this podcast, but it was a really it thing. We just thought of it as an interesting thought exercise. Like, oh, that's actually a really backwards from that dream. Okay. If that's is that possible? Yeah. It is possible.

And we talked about that. Like, that's just crazy. That's outlandish. We brought it up on this podcast, but it was a really it thing. We just thought of it as an interesting thought exercise. Like, oh, that's actually a really backwards from that dream. Okay. If that's is that possible? Yeah. It is possible.

35:08

I guess it is possible. So then, alright, I'm a smart guy. Well, let me find out find out a way I would do it. It is obviously very challenging.

I guess it is possible. So then, alright, I'm a smart guy. Well, let me find out find out a way I would do it. It is obviously very challenging.

35:15

And so I guess he must have had. I don't actually don't know if this is true or not, but I imagine when you sell a company to Facebook, you have some type of non compete. Well, typically, not competes are anywhere from two to five years. The other day, a few months ago, it was the end of a the five year period since selling TBH. And so imagine that was Superior where he was like, great. I can do that. And so he launches this app about three months ago where basically you let you It's the same app as TBH. So what was TBH?

And so I guess he must have had. I don't actually don't know if this is true or not, but I imagine when you sell a company to Facebook, you have some type of non compete. Well, typically, not competes are anywhere from two to five years. The other day, a few months ago, it was the end of a the five year period since selling TBH. And so imagine that was Superior where he was like, great. I can do that. And so he launches this app about three months ago where basically you let you It's the same app as TBH. So what was TBH?

35:46

TBH was a anonymous

TBH was a anonymous

35:48

polling app or complement app. So I don't know if you remember, like, in high school. You they would always pass this thing around the end of the year, the the superlatives

polling app or complement app. So I don't know if you remember, like, in high school. You they would always pass this thing around the end of the year, the the superlatives

35:56

test. And it would be like, Who who is most likely to become a famous, you know, famous in Hollywood, oh, this person in our school. Who is most likely to,

test. And it would be like, Who who is most likely to become a famous, you know, famous in Hollywood, oh, this person in our school. Who is most likely to,

36:06

you know, end up with with ten kids or whatever. Right? They just come up with these, like, future looking things. Who's the best who's got the best smile? This person wins best smile. And so TBH was that because it was playing on this thing, which is

you know, end up with with ten kids or whatever. Right? They just come up with these, like, future looking things. Who's the best who's got the best smile? This person wins best smile. And so TBH was that because it was playing on this thing, which is

36:19

people are very interested in them themselves.

people are very interested in them themselves.

36:22

And and the people around them. And so you're like, alright. If I I'll go through and I'll answer this quiz, and it was using, like, so that sounds very simple. Under the hood, it's gotta be pretty smart. Right? Cause it's gotta surface in your contacts.

And and the people around them. And so you're like, alright. If I I'll go through and I'll answer this quiz, and it was using, like, so that sounds very simple. Under the hood, it's gotta be pretty smart. Right? Cause it's gotta surface in your contacts.

36:34

It's gonna surface the right four or five names

It's gonna surface the right four or five names

36:36

that you actually know. Who do you actually know? So you could pick, you know, your friends

that you actually know. Who do you actually know? So you could pick, you know, your friends

36:41

And, and then it would send them a text message and saying, hey, Sam, somebody said that you have you have the best smile in your school,

And, and then it would send them a text message and saying, hey, Sam, somebody said that you have you have the best smile in your school,

36:48

download the app to find out who who said it. And you're, like, hundred percent, you're gonna go find out who said I have the best smile or who said I'm most likely this. Who said they have the biggest crush on me? And so, you know, that taps into, like, something pretty deep at a teenager. And so that's what TBH was. Got acquired,

download the app to find out who who said it. And you're, like, hundred percent, you're gonna go find out who said I have the best smile or who said I'm most likely this. Who said they have the biggest crush on me? And so, you know, that taps into, like, something pretty deep at a teenager. And so that's what TBH was. Got acquired,

37:05

And and by the way, that same idea had been done many, many times. Our buddy Souley was the first episode of the podcast. He had built that same superlatives

And and by the way, that same idea had been done many, many times. Our buddy Souley was the first episode of the podcast. He had built that same superlatives

37:12

idea as a Facebook app when the Facebook app platform launched back in, like, two thousand seven or something like that. It also went viral.

idea as a Facebook app when the Facebook app platform launched back in, like, two thousand seven or something like that. It also went viral.

37:19

Like, this is just an idea that goes viral.

Like, this is just an idea that goes viral.

37:21

And you could switch he did it on the Facebook app platform. Nikita did it on the mobile platform where you would send SMS,

And you could switch he did it on the Facebook app platform. Nikita did it on the mobile platform where you would send SMS,

37:27

you know, invites

you know, invites

37:29

based off of this. And so it's the same that was what he did then. It got acquired immediately pretty much immediately got shut down.

based off of this. And so it's the same that was what he did then. It got acquired immediately pretty much immediately got shut down.

37:36

There wasn't really much retention in it. And so it was like, oh, that's a cool idea. It gets people engaged. It goes viral for a short period of time, but there's no engagement. Alright. Sorry. There's no long term retention. Seems like But it gave it it gave him this, like, this persona of, like, I am a I'm a Wonderkin. Like, I know how to make things go viral because, a,

There wasn't really much retention in it. And so it was like, oh, that's a cool idea. It gets people engaged. It goes viral for a short period of time, but there's no engagement. Alright. Sorry. There's no long term retention. Seems like But it gave it it gave him this, like, this persona of, like, I am a I'm a Wonderkin. Like, I know how to make things go viral because, a,

37:55

It is partially true. And, b, Nikita kinda has this, like, aura about him that who knows if it's on purpose or not on purpose where he, like, is mysterious and, like, somewhat silent and only makes sarcastic jokes and everything comes easy to him. Like, that's, like, his, like, cool kid demeanor. Yeah. Yeah. He definitely definitely tries to be a cool kid. Alright. So then,

It is partially true. And, b, Nikita kinda has this, like, aura about him that who knows if it's on purpose or not on purpose where he, like, is mysterious and, like, somewhat silent and only makes sarcastic jokes and everything comes easy to him. Like, that's, like, his, like, cool kid demeanor. Yeah. Yeah. He definitely definitely tries to be a cool kid. Alright. So then,

38:14

It's a app you open up. It says, who do you have a crush on? Who's got the best smile? Who's most likely to be whatever? Who would you trust to bail you out of jail?

It's a app you open up. It says, who do you have a crush on? Who's got the best smile? Who's most likely to be whatever? Who would you trust to bail you out of jail?

38:23

And you you answer, and they're all supposed to be, you know, sort of like pop more positive ish questions. They're not it's not like mean. It's not supposed to be bullying.

And you you answer, and they're all supposed to be, you know, sort of like pop more positive ish questions. They're not it's not like mean. It's not supposed to be bullying.

38:30

And,

And,

38:31

again, starts to go viral. And so we sat there in this group chat as it was happening. So describe kind of how it played out from your perspective. He says things, like, Alright. Now we're adding a thousand people an hour. And I kind of brush that off because, like, I'm thinking maybe these are just bots. Like, this isn't actually

again, starts to go viral. And so we sat there in this group chat as it was happening. So describe kind of how it played out from your perspective. He says things, like, Alright. Now we're adding a thousand people an hour. And I kind of brush that off because, like, I'm thinking maybe these are just bots. Like, this isn't actually

38:48

serious. Well, and there's one little difference. He launches it and we're like, cool man. How do we download the app? He's like, you have it's geofence to these three high schools in Georgia.

serious. Well, and there's one little difference. He launches it and we're like, cool man. How do we download the app? He's like, you have it's geofence to these three high schools in Georgia.

38:58

And we're like, what? And he's like, and we're like, hey. And then he would post, like, a, like, you know, he'd be like, post his graphic. It's going viral, but it's got, like, two hundred people. We're like, only two hundred is, like, There's only, like, two thousand people in the school. This is gonna take a whole school, like, right away.

And we're like, what? And he's like, and we're like, hey. And then he would post, like, a, like, you know, he'd be like, post his graphic. It's going viral, but it's got, like, two hundred people. We're like, only two hundred is, like, There's only, like, two thousand people in the school. This is gonna take a whole school, like, right away.

39:12

But it uses, like, academic language. Like, it has a k factor of blank, but we're seeing that user retention stagnates at this thing, and the turn happens at three percent. Like, it was incredibly.

But it uses, like, academic language. Like, it has a k factor of blank, but we're seeing that user retention stagnates at this thing, and the turn happens at three percent. Like, it was incredibly.

39:22

Is blah blah blah. We're like, okay. That's cool. And then and then he goes, then he's supposed to chart and we're like, oh, sick. Like, I don't, like, how come I don't see it? When I go to my app store chart, like, you know, social free apps, he's like, we put it in the games category under puzzles.

Is blah blah blah. We're like, okay. That's cool. And then and then he goes, then he's supposed to chart and we're like, oh, sick. Like, I don't, like, how come I don't see it? When I go to my app store chart, like, you know, social free apps, he's like, we put it in the games category under puzzles.

39:35

Like, he's like, that way we're gonna, like, stay away from competition till we flip the switch. And we're like, whoa, like, damn, this guy is like,

Like, he's like, that way we're gonna, like, stay away from competition till we flip the switch. And we're like, whoa, like, damn, this guy is like,

39:42

this is like, If you want a Game of Thrones and they're talking about, like, you know, how to invade King's landing,

this is like, If you want a Game of Thrones and they're talking about, like, you know, how to invade King's landing,

39:48

it's like these guys standing at this giant table moving these chess pieces around, like, talking about conquering.

it's like these guys standing at this giant table moving these chess pieces around, like, talking about conquering.

39:55

That's him, but the chess pieces are like high schools. And he's been a bit Yeah. It's like,

That's him, but the chess pieces are like high schools. And he's been a bit Yeah. It's like,

40:00

it's like James Bond villain of high school,

it's like James Bond villain of high school,

40:04

you know, quizzes, if that's such a big By the way, there's one key twist to the whole thing.

you know, quizzes, if that's such a big By the way, there's one key twist to the whole thing.

40:10

It's TBH again, but he's like, this time,

It's TBH again, but he's like, this time,

40:13

we're not trying to be the next Snapchat.

we're not trying to be the next Snapchat.

40:16

We don't care about their retention.

We don't care about their retention.

40:17

We're just gonna put an in app purchase that says pay to see who voted for you. And he's like, they're gonna pay. And we're like, well, I get well, would they pay? They're gonna pay. And it's like the thing is a freaking

We're just gonna put an in app purchase that says pay to see who voted for you. And he's like, they're gonna pay. And we're like, well, I get well, would they pay? They're gonna pay. And it's like the thing is a freaking

40:30

six ninety nine

six ninety nine

40:31

weekly

weekly

40:32

subscription.

subscription.

40:33

So this is basically twenty eight dollars a month This is double the price of Netflix

So this is basically twenty eight dollars a month This is double the price of Netflix

40:39

to see who voted for you. And he's like, yep. So if we're converting, you know, whatever four percent of people,

to see who voted for you. And he's like, yep. So if we're converting, you know, whatever four percent of people,

40:46

we take over this state, Georgia, Georgia has this many high schools. At least high school has this many students. And, yeah, one point eight million dollars a month. Okay. Good. Yeah. Let's go.

we take over this state, Georgia, Georgia has this many high schools. At least high school has this many students. And, yeah, one point eight million dollars a month. Okay. Good. Yeah. Let's go.

40:55

That's basically my my reenactment of how they're thinking about this. And at this with TBH, he had raised a little bit of money. He had raised money from founders from fun and gray lock. And like the the when you do that, it says, you know, you I've gotta build the next Snapchat.

That's basically my my reenactment of how they're thinking about this. And at this with TBH, he had raised a little bit of money. He had raised money from founders from fun and gray lock. And like the the when you do that, it says, you know, you I've gotta build the next Snapchat.

41:11

This way, with this new company, he just basically says, dude, I I'm self funded. I've got four engineers living in my LA house right now. We're just trying to, like, make it big, make it fast. And, what do they say on South Park? Like,

This way, with this new company, he just basically says, dude, I I'm self funded. I've got four engineers living in my LA house right now. We're just trying to, like, make it big, make it fast. And, what do they say on South Park? Like,

41:23

scale up. No. Start up. Get big. Cash out, bro down. You know, like, that, like, that's exactly what he's trying to do. He's trying to just get in, get the bag, get out, and just maybe return to idea for you.

scale up. No. Start up. Get big. Cash out, bro down. You know, like, that, like, that's exactly what he's trying to do. He's trying to just get in, get the bag, get out, and just maybe return to idea for you.

41:36

Yeah. Not.

Yeah. Not.

41:37

And so anyway, about ten days after it launches, I'm just making these numbers up, but I it's around a week, maybe two weeks.

And so anyway, about ten days after it launches, I'm just making these numbers up, but I it's around a week, maybe two weeks.

41:45

He starts saying like, oh, man, people are starting to spread these rumors that this app is being used for human trafficking.

He starts saying like, oh, man, people are starting to spread these rumors that this app is being used for human trafficking.

41:51

And we laughed that off and he goes, so I changed it to But he was like, he's like, yeah, it's, like, annoying his, like, as hell, like, we're getting a bunch of deletions. Okay. It's gonna die. And we were like, what? The thing that, like, you called your shot, you're like, I'm gonna build an app that goes viral. It's gonna make ten million dollars in, like, ninety days. And that's a ludicrous thing to say.

And we laughed that off and he goes, so I changed it to But he was like, he's like, yeah, it's, like, annoying his, like, as hell, like, we're getting a bunch of deletions. Okay. It's gonna die. And we were like, what? The thing that, like, you called your shot, you're like, I'm gonna build an app that goes viral. It's gonna make ten million dollars in, like, ninety days. And that's a ludicrous thing to say.

42:13

You spend, like, two years plotting. He went through a bunch of different ideas to think about what it could be. Besides, you know what? It's TBH with a payroll.

You spend, like, two years plotting. He went through a bunch of different ideas to think about what it could be. Besides, you know what? It's TBH with a payroll.

42:21

Launch it, like, spends, you know,

Launch it, like, spends, you know,

42:23

has these, like, seven engineers living in his living room, you know, the place smells like, you know, ramen and Old spice, and he's like, alright, We build the app after a few months. We launch this thing in these pockets of Georgia. It goes viral. But then this hulk, you know, this hulk starts saying, This is for, I don't know, with the sex trafficking, human sex trafficking human chinese. Which I didn't even understand, but I didn't even understand, but I didn't even understand. But I shouldn't even say those words. YouTube's gonna, like, deprioritize this algorithm and we're out of the algorithm now. Like, because I said that out loud. And he says that. He's like, well, it's actually it's just like a couple reviews, but I have a feeling that these couple of reviews are gonna, like, spread. Someone already made a video on TikTok. This is just how things work. And so I'm like, it's whatever. Like, that I don't understand that entirely. That sounds like you're just being, like, neurotic, but Sounds good. So he changes the name to crush. Right? Yeah. So app starts getting deleted. Alright. It gets taken down in the app store. Apple

has these, like, seven engineers living in his living room, you know, the place smells like, you know, ramen and Old spice, and he's like, alright, We build the app after a few months. We launch this thing in these pockets of Georgia. It goes viral. But then this hulk, you know, this hulk starts saying, This is for, I don't know, with the sex trafficking, human sex trafficking human chinese. Which I didn't even understand, but I didn't even understand, but I didn't even understand. But I shouldn't even say those words. YouTube's gonna, like, deprioritize this algorithm and we're out of the algorithm now. Like, because I said that out loud. And he says that. He's like, well, it's actually it's just like a couple reviews, but I have a feeling that these couple of reviews are gonna, like, spread. Someone already made a video on TikTok. This is just how things work. And so I'm like, it's whatever. Like, that I don't understand that entirely. That sounds like you're just being, like, neurotic, but Sounds good. So he changes the name to crush. Right? Yeah. So app starts getting deleted. Alright. It gets taken down in the app store. Apple

43:14

takes or something like that. He's like, oh, we're gonna petition, blah, blah, blah, we're gonna re reupload as

takes or something like that. He's like, oh, we're gonna petition, blah, blah, blah, we're gonna re reupload as

43:19

crush. And he sends us, hey, guys, like, new brand.

crush. And he sends us, hey, guys, like, new brand.

43:22

And it looks

And it looks

43:24

Exactly. Like yeah. Exactly, like, crush the soda. Like, like, the grape flavored, like, soda. He sends it in the tech And I if I got so thirsty,

Exactly. Like yeah. Exactly, like, crush the soda. Like, like, the grape flavored, like, soda. He sends it in the tech And I if I got so thirsty,

43:34

like, you know, like, the pavlovian dog response, I saw that. And I was like, I need an orange soda on my tongue right now. And, I hadn't had orange zone in, like, a decade. And I saw that thing, and I was like, I need that.

like, you know, like, the pavlovian dog response, I saw that. And I was like, I need an orange soda on my tongue right now. And, I hadn't had orange zone in, like, a decade. And I saw that thing, and I was like, I need that.

43:45

Re launches again in, like, you know, Alabama at this time. Is like, okay. We're going south, and they attack Alabama with their four high school launch strategy. They do they have this, like, thing set to a tee. And by the way, like, He had he had wrote a memo inside Facebook once about how TBH was launching high schools effectively. He's like, we created basically

Re launches again in, like, you know, Alabama at this time. Is like, okay. We're going south, and they attack Alabama with their four high school launch strategy. They do they have this, like, thing set to a tee. And by the way, like, He had he had wrote a memo inside Facebook once about how TBH was launching high schools effectively. He's like, we created basically

44:04

his theory is basically for a social app, the most valuable thing you can have

his theory is basically for a social app, the most valuable thing you can have

44:09

is a reliable way

is a reliable way

44:11

to test your app. So, like, can you get this into

to test your app. So, like, can you get this into

44:14

a a a small network, like like a high school where most people know each other or know of each other, of a thousand people quickly. Because if you could do that, you could test it in one high school, see what the data says, and then you could tweak the app, launch it in another high school. We'll do it again. He's like, that reliable, like, Petri did to test in is the most valuable thing. So they had come up with a strategy, which was a but this memo got leaked when he was at Facebook, which was like, they would create Instagram accounts, like, you know, crush,

a a a small network, like like a high school where most people know each other or know of each other, of a thousand people quickly. Because if you could do that, you could test it in one high school, see what the data says, and then you could tweak the app, launch it in another high school. We'll do it again. He's like, that reliable, like, Petri did to test in is the most valuable thing. So they had come up with a strategy, which was a but this memo got leaked when he was at Facebook, which was like, they would create Instagram accounts, like, you know, crush,

44:41

you know,

you know,

44:43

you know, archipelago

you know, archipelago

44:45

high, you know, and like, they they take the high school name and they take the the brand name of the thing, and they would make the account private. And they would go follow every kid who had, like, you know, class of whenever twenty twenty two,

high, you know, and like, they they take the high school name and they take the the brand name of the thing, and they would make the account private. And they would go follow every kid who had, like, you know, class of whenever twenty twenty two,

44:56

in that high school. They would follow all of them. So then the kid would say who followed me, it has my high school name in it. They click it. It's private.

in that high school. They would follow all of them. So then the kid would say who followed me, it has my high school name in it. They click it. It's private.

45:03

To to find to see the profile, you gotta follow back. So they would they would request to follow. So a whole bunch of people requested to follow. He's like, but we would not accept anyone. It's, like, there's, like, the, you know, the dentist system on all of a sudden. He's, like, you know, first, we demonstrate value.

To to find to see the profile, you gotta follow back. So they would they would request to follow. So a whole bunch of people requested to follow. He's like, but we would not accept anyone. It's, like, there's, like, the, you know, the dentist system on all of a sudden. He's, like, you know, first, we demonstrate value.

45:16

Then we take it away. And he's, like, then, at four PM on the day before launch, which, the day of the launch when everybody gets out of school. You know, we have a guy in a truck watching people leave the school. As soon as they do, we hit accept request. We accept everybody's request. Everybody gets a notification at the same time. And then they go to it. The bio basically says download the app. See who likes you. You download the app. And then he's like, we would instantly go viral in a high school. So he had this, like, launch strategy, which was, I thought pretty, pretty great, pretty tactical.

Then we take it away. And he's, like, then, at four PM on the day before launch, which, the day of the launch when everybody gets out of school. You know, we have a guy in a truck watching people leave the school. As soon as they do, we hit accept request. We accept everybody's request. Everybody gets a notification at the same time. And then they go to it. The bio basically says download the app. See who likes you. You download the app. And then he's like, we would instantly go viral in a high school. So he had this, like, launch strategy, which was, I thought pretty, pretty great, pretty tactical.

45:44

So he's doing that again now with crush. Crush gonna go. It's gonna launch like that. And it starts to work. And we're like, wow, dude. You did it again. Like, the first one wasn't a fluke.

So he's doing that again now with crush. Crush gonna go. It's gonna launch like that. And it starts to work. And we're like, wow, dude. You did it again. Like, the first one wasn't a fluke.

45:53

You did it again. All of a sudden, like, it totally attracted a different demographic because of this, like, stupid orange soda logo and the name crush. And so he's like, oh god, you know,

You did it again. All of a sudden, like, it totally attracted a different demographic because of this, like, stupid orange soda logo and the name crush. And so he's like, oh god, you know,

46:03

to cut. Alright. Let's move the scene around. Change the name again.

to cut. Alright. Let's move the scene around. Change the name again.

46:07

And he comes back for act three. And this time, it's called

And he comes back for act three. And this time, it's called

46:11

gas.

gas.

46:12

And by the way, this whole so he'd been working on this for many months, maybe more than a year. I don't know. But this whole thing that we're describing takes place over two to three weeks.

And by the way, this whole so he'd been working on this for many months, maybe more than a year. I don't know. But this whole thing that we're describing takes place over two to three weeks.

46:21

And it gets to the point where he starts making up phrases like, we are acquiring new users at this rate per hour. Know, a lot of times we talk about saying like ARR annual recurring revenue. And what a lot of companies will do is they'll take, like, their monthly run rate and multiply that by twelve to say they're this is what they're doing. He was basically doing that at a per hour basis. So he's like, oh, work. You know, we're we're acquiring a thousand users per hour means our, our rate of, like, a new users is, like, three hundred sixty five million, whatever. And Yeah. He's, like, he's, like, if you look dawn day over day, It's like

And it gets to the point where he starts making up phrases like, we are acquiring new users at this rate per hour. Know, a lot of times we talk about saying like ARR annual recurring revenue. And what a lot of companies will do is they'll take, like, their monthly run rate and multiply that by twelve to say they're this is what they're doing. He was basically doing that at a per hour basis. So he's like, oh, work. You know, we're we're acquiring a thousand users per hour means our, our rate of, like, a new users is, like, three hundred sixty five million, whatever. And Yeah. He's, like, he's, like, if you look dawn day over day, It's like

46:56

you're just measuring the period of, like, the Sunrise day over day, what your what your numbers are? That's insane.

you're just measuring the period of, like, the Sunrise day over day, what your what your numbers are? That's insane.

47:03

And so gas starts, like, taking off similar to the original one, but this time, even even more. And in a matter of, like,

And so gas starts, like, taking off similar to the original one, but this time, even even more. And in a matter of, like,

47:13

seven days, I believe. He starts tweeting out the results and letting us know. And basically within, like, seven days, give or take, five days. I don't know exactly.

seven days, I believe. He starts tweeting out the results and letting us know. And basically within, like, seven days, give or take, five days. I don't know exactly.

47:21

It was doing a million daily or had a million daily users was adding thirty thousand new users an hour. Users were answering three point two million polls per hour. In a Brown, like, ten days, I believe he's hit a million dollars in sales, and are also around ten days in. It was number one in the App Store. And he had been telling us it's gonna be number one in the next handful of days. It's gonna be number one and they totally call that. And we're talking number one, like,

It was doing a million daily or had a million daily users was adding thirty thousand new users an hour. Users were answering three point two million polls per hour. In a Brown, like, ten days, I believe he's hit a million dollars in sales, and are also around ten days in. It was number one in the App Store. And he had been telling us it's gonna be number one in the next handful of days. It's gonna be number one and they totally call that. And we're talking number one, like,

47:51

above TikTok,

above TikTok,

47:52

above Instagram, above Facebook.

above Instagram, above Facebook.

47:55

Yeah. Totally.

Yeah. Totally.

47:56

This is all true. And he said he tweets out. He goes, ladies and gentlemen, after a five year hiatus, I'm no longer a one hit wonder. Introducing Gas, the number one app in the App Store.

This is all true. And he said he tweets out. He goes, ladies and gentlemen, after a five year hiatus, I'm no longer a one hit wonder. Introducing Gas, the number one app in the App Store.

48:07

And this is when it turns to the point where it's incredibly

And this is when it turns to the point where it's incredibly

48:10

hard for us to compliment

hard for us to compliment

48:12

him and a root for him because clearly this guy has a chip on his shoulder. Clearly,

him and a root for him because clearly this guy has a chip on his shoulder. Clearly,

48:19

For the last five years, he was mad that he sold too soon or didn't become, like, huge or didn't become wealthier or didn't become whatever his his target was. But he fell short. It felt like, and now he is proving that he is the man because here's what's here's what here's what starts happening. And he gets hilariously

For the last five years, he was mad that he sold too soon or didn't become, like, huge or didn't become wealthier or didn't become whatever his his target was. But he fell short. It felt like, and now he is proving that he is the man because here's what's here's what here's what starts happening. And he gets hilariously

48:37

cocky about it, which I I I love. I love.

cocky about it, which I I I love. I love.

48:40

I love.

I love.

48:41

It it makes me like him even more, but I love. And so a Like, here's an example. A really popular VC tweets out, his name's Josh Shelman. Momentum growth is a powerful feeling, and they could also go away really quickly. I have been

It it makes me like him even more, but I love. And so a Like, here's an example. A really popular VC tweets out, his name's Josh Shelman. Momentum growth is a powerful feeling, and they could also go away really quickly. I have been

48:56

I have been surprised how many things with seemingly unstoppable

I have been surprised how many things with seemingly unstoppable

49:00

momentum

momentum

49:01

have slow crawled this past year. Zooming out growth without deep duration adoption and habits

have slow crawled this past year. Zooming out growth without deep duration adoption and habits

49:07

doesn't count. And Nikita replies,

doesn't count. And Nikita replies,

49:10

just at me.

just at me.

49:11

And so, basically, he just starts going around anyone online on Twitter who's a big shot, who starts talking about height growth stuff. Nikita just pops at it, said, What are you talking about me? And it's

And so, basically, he just starts going around anyone online on Twitter who's a big shot, who starts talking about height growth stuff. Nikita just pops at it, said, What are you talking about me? And it's

49:22

hilarious.

hilarious.

49:23

It is so funny. And so around this time, though, the rumors start happening again about She's been trafficking. And he starts tweeting and sharing

It is so funny. And so around this time, though, the rumors start happening again about She's been trafficking. And he starts tweeting and sharing

49:33

the craziest stuff. And this gets so big that Ashton Cutcher

the craziest stuff. And this gets so big that Ashton Cutcher

49:38

is retweeting

is retweeting

49:39

who, Ashton Cutcher, I didn't entirely know this, but, like, his whole, like, philanthropy thing is human trafficking. And so these rumors of human trafficking start happening at And Ashton Cutcher retweets Nikita and says something like the Nikita sends us a screenshot. It's Ashton Cutcher DMming him. And he's, like, he just, like, he's just screenshotting us these, like, big shot people that are just dming him, like,

who, Ashton Cutcher, I didn't entirely know this, but, like, his whole, like, philanthropy thing is human trafficking. And so these rumors of human trafficking start happening at And Ashton Cutcher retweets Nikita and says something like the Nikita sends us a screenshot. It's Ashton Cutcher DMming him. And he's, like, he just, like, he's just screenshotting us these, like, big shot people that are just dming him, like,

50:00

wink face.

wink face.

50:01

Instead of even saying hi, they're just, like, it's is this how this guy, like, slides into DMs? That's interesting. That that wasn't Ashton Cutcher, but, like, then But Ashton also retweeted it. I'd love to meet I'd love to meet you. I'd love to help you know,

Instead of even saying hi, they're just, like, it's is this how this guy, like, slides into DMs? That's interesting. That that wasn't Ashton Cutcher, but, like, then But Ashton also retweeted it. I'd love to meet I'd love to meet you. I'd love to help you know,

50:13

this thing is a hoax. Because basically what Nikita is saying is he's like, the scene is taking off, like, you wouldn't believe the, you know, it's going viral. The k factor is two. And when k two, what that means is for every person who joins, you know, virally, they invite two more. Right? So it's like, you know, you think about COVID spread fast. Watch how fast the gas app is gonna spread. It's gotta,

this thing is a hoax. Because basically what Nikita is saying is he's like, the scene is taking off, like, you wouldn't believe the, you know, it's going viral. The k factor is two. And when k two, what that means is for every person who joins, you know, virally, they invite two more. Right? So it's like, you know, you think about COVID spread fast. Watch how fast the gas app is gonna spread. It's gotta,

50:32

incredibly high, viral coefficient. That just basically means for free, it's gonna take over whatever demographic it is until that until that coefficient starts to go down because either it's saturated or hits a new market where it's less viral. And so it's going viral.

incredibly high, viral coefficient. That just basically means for free, it's gonna take over whatever demographic it is until that until that coefficient starts to go down because either it's saturated or hits a new market where it's less viral. And so it's going viral.

50:48

Ask the coach, like, I'll help you try to fight these hoax rumors because on TikTok, on Snapchat,

Ask the coach, like, I'll help you try to fight these hoax rumors because on TikTok, on Snapchat,

50:53

you just see story after story of somebody saying, Guys,

you just see story after story of somebody saying, Guys,

50:56

delete this gap gas app. It sucks as hell. I downloaded it, and a a white van started following me around my neighborhood.

delete this gap gas app. It sucks as hell. I downloaded it, and a a white van started following me around my neighborhood.

51:03

And and people are like, oh my god. Oh my god. Share share to keep it keep our sis, like, our school safe.

And and people are like, oh my god. Oh my god. Share share to keep it keep our sis, like, our school safe.

51:09

And it's like, girls, like, girls do not download gas app. Like, like, you ever seen the show, you on Netflix

And it's like, girls, like, girls do not download gas app. Like, like, you ever seen the show, you on Netflix

51:17

say no more. And it's like, yeah, it's like people are just spreading this thing. And so it's like, what the hell? Like, where is this coming from? And he doesn't know. And he's like, it's gotta be a competitor.

say no more. And it's like, yeah, it's like people are just spreading this thing. And so it's like, what the hell? Like, where is this coming from? And he doesn't know. And he's like, it's gotta be a competitor.

51:27

And we're like,

And we're like,

51:28

Okay. What, like, what kind of comp I mean, you've just launched, like, two weeks. So how are they doing this coordinated,

Okay. What, like, what kind of comp I mean, you've just launched, like, two weeks. So how are they doing this coordinated,

51:34

like, social,

like, social,

51:35

like, psyops attack on you and your user base. And he's like, then he's like, we've we've located the source of the hoax

like, psyops attack on you and your user base. And he's like, then he's like, we've we've located the source of the hoax

51:44

or or it originated in China.

or or it originated in China.

51:48

Well, here's what he says. Here's what he says. It's this is the most official tweet ever. It's so funny. He goes, After an investigation, our team found several indications that the gas app that, the gas app human trafficking hoax was planted by an entity or person originating in China.

Well, here's what he says. Here's what he says. It's this is the most official tweet ever. It's so funny. He goes, After an investigation, our team found several indications that the gas app that, the gas app human trafficking hoax was planted by an entity or person originating in China.

52:03

Our data shows users connecting from China when the app first began growing and the fake fake review the first fake review were posted that that same day. And so, basically, he's accusing something or someone in China who starts

Our data shows users connecting from China when the app first began growing and the fake fake review the first fake review were posted that that same day. And so, basically, he's accusing something or someone in China who starts

52:17

He's accusing just the country.

He's accusing just the country.

52:19

Yeah.

Yeah.

52:20

And so this is just taking off from I wanna make ten million dollars. I wanna get in and get out to China is trying actively bring me down. And he just tweeted out, dude. I am calling for a total and complete ban of Chinese goods in entering the United's no. I'm just joking.

And so this is just taking off from I wanna make ten million dollars. I wanna get in and get out to China is trying actively bring me down. And he just tweeted out, dude. I am calling for a total and complete ban of Chinese goods in entering the United's no. I'm just joking.

52:37

But I told him, I was like, dude, you need to go lean in way more because what he's doing in his PR push, he's like, the the the the hoax, the we're a false hoax is being spread about jazz app, humans, you know, trafficking blah blah blah.

But I told him, I was like, dude, you need to go lean in way more because what he's doing in his PR push, he's like, the the the the hoax, the we're a false hoax is being spread about jazz app, humans, you know, trafficking blah blah blah.

52:52

And,

And,

52:53

And I'm like, bro, you need to go full. Trump. You need to be like,

And I'm like, bro, you need to go full. Trump. You need to be like,

52:58

China. The China virus is trying to take down this American success gas gas app. That, you know, TikTok

China. The China virus is trying to take down this American success gas gas app. That, you know, TikTok

53:05

is not only stealing your data. They're trying to take us down because we are the number one app for teens. China is doing this. This is anti China. Like, you should be leaning in way more to this child. I was like, I don't know if this is true, not true, but, like, this is your only hope is to get this. Like, you should stop saying your app's name with the words, you know, human trafficking, and you should start saying,

is not only stealing your data. They're trying to take us down because we are the number one app for teens. China is doing this. This is anti China. Like, you should be leaning in way more to this child. I was like, I don't know if this is true, not true, but, like, this is your only hope is to get this. Like, you should stop saying your app's name with the words, you know, human trafficking, and you should start saying,

53:26

you know, why is China trying to, you know, spread fake news about this? That is that is my my my official recommendation to you. And it's and it's totally working. And so this entire story that we just spent thirty minutes on, this entire story, we're talking, like, twenty days. And this is the roller coaster that we bid in. And he would save you He's on fox news today. Yes. But that's my point. She says these things in this group chat. And when it's on your phone, when it's just on this small thing, you think this is just limited to us six guys in this thing. This is just No big deal. But then you turn on Fox Business News and or Fox News business, and he's on there. You go to Wall Street Journal, and he's on there. You go to business insider,

you know, why is China trying to, you know, spread fake news about this? That is that is my my my official recommendation to you. And it's and it's totally working. And so this entire story that we just spent thirty minutes on, this entire story, we're talking, like, twenty days. And this is the roller coaster that we bid in. And he would save you He's on fox news today. Yes. But that's my point. She says these things in this group chat. And when it's on your phone, when it's just on this small thing, you think this is just limited to us six guys in this thing. This is just No big deal. But then you turn on Fox Business News and or Fox News business, and he's on there. You go to Wall Street Journal, and he's on there. You go to business insider,

54:08

Bloomberg, all these places, and it's real. I go to TikTok, and I open up, and there's a video about this app. And basically,

Bloomberg, all these places, and it's real. I go to TikTok, and I open up, and there's a video about this app. And basically,

54:16

As much as I don't like saying this because I like Nikita, but he is so smug. He has one hundred percent, called his shot, and he hit it. He nailed it. This is this is one of the most epic stories that I've seen behind the scenes in real time in a very long time. It's been quite amazing to watch this entire thing play out in just twenty days.

As much as I don't like saying this because I like Nikita, but he is so smug. He has one hundred percent, called his shot, and he hit it. He nailed it. This is this is one of the most epic stories that I've seen behind the scenes in real time in a very long time. It's been quite amazing to watch this entire thing play out in just twenty days.

54:38

Yeah. He's smug as hell, but I You know, the same reason I find Connor McGregor, very entertaining in the UFC, right, this cocky guy who tries to call his shots and then tries to pull it off, like, I

Yeah. He's smug as hell, but I You know, the same reason I find Connor McGregor, very entertaining in the UFC, right, this cocky guy who tries to call his shots and then tries to pull it off, like, I

54:48

I'm thoroughly entertained, and I'm here for the entertainment.

I'm thoroughly entertained, and I'm here for the entertainment.

54:52

And, like, you know, good for him. Made it happen. This this matters to him. He got really pumped about this, and he made it happen. And it's, like, I feel like, you know, you know, Baine when he's, like,

And, like, you know, good for him. Made it happen. This this matters to him. He got really pumped about this, and he made it happen. And it's, like, I feel like, you know, you know, Baine when he's, like,

55:03

you know, when he sees other people, like, you know, I I felt like Nikita for like four years would see other people try to build social apps and he would just like shit on them. Or he would be like, you know, or people building apps would be like, you know, if your app doesn't let you, you know, flirt with somebody, it's never gonna work, you know, like, or it'd be like, unless you built the number one app in the app store, like, you know, don't talk to me type type of attitude.

you know, when he sees other people, like, you know, I I felt like Nikita for like four years would see other people try to build social apps and he would just like shit on them. Or he would be like, you know, or people building apps would be like, you know, if your app doesn't let you, you know, flirt with somebody, it's never gonna work, you know, like, or it'd be like, unless you built the number one app in the app store, like, you know, don't talk to me type type of attitude.

55:24

And,

And,

55:25

and I find it, you know, pretty awesome that, like, you know, like Baine when he's like, oh, you know,

and I find it, you know, pretty awesome that, like, you know, like Baine when he's like, oh, you know,

55:30

you know, whatever the line is, he's like, you know, you,

you know, whatever the line is, he's like, you know, you,

55:34

You you trained in the dark? I was born in the dark. Like, that's him with these, like, teen viral apps. He's like, you know, oh, you're trying to make a social I was born to make social apps. And, like, he just keep the fact that he just relaunched the Save app is hilarious to be. In so many ways.

You you trained in the dark? I was born in the dark. Like, that's him with these, like, teen viral apps. He's like, you know, oh, you're trying to make a social I was born to make social apps. And, like, he just keep the fact that he just relaunched the Save app is hilarious to be. In so many ways.

55:51

He probably had just, like, a countdown timer to, like, when the non compete ends. No. It wasn't even that because I talked to him in between, and he was considering all these, other ideas. We're considering this one real estate idea. He's considering this other idea. And then it was just like, like,

He probably had just, like, a countdown timer to, like, when the non compete ends. No. It wasn't even that because I talked to him in between, and he was considering all these, other ideas. We're considering this one real estate idea. He's considering this other idea. And then it was just like, like,

56:05

you know, it's sort of a, like, Harry Potter, the one chooses the wizard. It's like,

you know, it's sort of a, like, Harry Potter, the one chooses the wizard. It's like,

56:09

It's just pulling me back in. Just what I think about. I gotta go do this app again. Like,

It's just pulling me back in. Just what I think about. I gotta go do this app again. Like,

56:15

are you fuckers really gonna let me just do this again?

are you fuckers really gonna let me just do this again?

56:19

And he did it again. Yeah. This is pretty amazing. It also goes to show that,

And he did it again. Yeah. This is pretty amazing. It also goes to show that,

56:24

it shows a few things. It kinda breaks a lot of narratives, which I actually like, which is, a,

it shows a few things. It kinda breaks a lot of narratives, which I actually like, which is, a,

56:29

like, you don't really need, like, a mission, you know, all the time. Like, and and and I think that, like, with us. He's Oh, you don't need a verbal mission. The mission could be a noble mission. Ten million dollars to three months. That's a great mission. And I do actually think that maybe there is something where, like, oh, it makes teens feel good or whatever. Maybe that's, like, there. But, like, I think what's there really above all else is get big fast because that's exciting and just, like, play the puzzle. It's just a puzzle. And I think that that's, like, kind of the dominating factor behind what's driving him. And I think that that's the funny thing he goes on five news and he's like doing the interview. You know, they they have the person talking and then the background, they're showing screenshots of the app. And so he's saying he's like, well, the thing we wanted to do was bring positivity

like, you don't really need, like, a mission, you know, all the time. Like, and and and I think that, like, with us. He's Oh, you don't need a verbal mission. The mission could be a noble mission. Ten million dollars to three months. That's a great mission. And I do actually think that maybe there is something where, like, oh, it makes teens feel good or whatever. Maybe that's, like, there. But, like, I think what's there really above all else is get big fast because that's exciting and just, like, play the puzzle. It's just a puzzle. And I think that that's, like, kind of the dominating factor behind what's driving him. And I think that that's the funny thing he goes on five news and he's like doing the interview. You know, they they have the person talking and then the background, they're showing screenshots of the app. And so he's saying he's like, well, the thing we wanted to do was bring positivity

57:09

to teens, you know, teens feel really bad from whatever, like, you know, Instagram, where there's positivity doing things. An app where there's, you know, it's anonymous. But there's no bullying. There's no, there's no, like, sort of negativity.

to teens, you know, teens feel really bad from whatever, like, you know, Instagram, where there's positivity doing things. An app where there's, you know, it's anonymous. But there's no bullying. There's no, there's no, like, sort of negativity.

57:20

And the screenshot

And the screenshot

57:21

is a poll question that says,

is a poll question that says,

57:24

want to steal them from their boyfriend?

want to steal them from their boyfriend?

57:26

He's like, steal from them.

He's like, steal from them.

57:29

He's like, he's like, you know, we just wanna he's like, I get messages every day from teens saying, you know, you know, I was gonna

He's like, he's like, you know, we just wanna he's like, I get messages every day from teens saying, you know, you know, I was gonna

57:35

do something bad to myself, but this app came out. And now, you know, I'm running around in in a field full of flowers.

do something bad to myself, but this app came out. And now, you know, I'm running around in in a field full of flowers.

57:41

And it's, like, It was just hilarious. The whole thing is is like straight Silicon Valley, HBO show. Like, it's so funny to me. It is so funny. And it's so exciting. Another thing is that basically when you're building these apps, like,

And it's, like, It was just hilarious. The whole thing is is like straight Silicon Valley, HBO show. Like, it's so funny to me. It is so funny. And it's so exciting. Another thing is that basically when you're building these apps, like,

57:53

the really good folks are just like maniacal about these little small numbers and just tweaking them and just just being obsessed with these little small things when most people are carried about or worrying about design or

the really good folks are just like maniacal about these little small numbers and just tweaking them and just just being obsessed with these little small things when most people are carried about or worrying about design or

58:08

branding or the logo or just these things that don't matters. Like, dude, all I care about is making this k factor, like, more than one.

branding or the logo or just these things that don't matters. Like, dude, all I care about is making this k factor, like, more than one.

58:17

And so And when it's not, when it's point nine nine, it's we're screwed. We gotta totally redo this.

And so And when it's not, when it's point nine nine, it's we're screwed. We gotta totally redo this.

58:23

And I just thought that it's

And I just thought that it's

58:25

a really interesting story. And this has been like a roller coaster and one of the coolest things that's happened in a long time. I just love following along this. Yeah. Props to him.

a really interesting story. And this has been like a roller coaster and one of the coolest things that's happened in a long time. I just love following along this. Yeah. Props to him.

58:34

Great great job. Thank you for the thank you for the entertainment.

Great great job. Thank you for the thank you for the entertainment.

58:37

Alright. Do you wanna do any more, or should we save it for the next time? I tell you. One more. I do have one more, but,

Alright. Do you wanna do any more, or should we save it for the next time? I tell you. One more. I do have one more, but,

58:43

we should save that one. That sounds too interesting. Okay. Let's save it. Same for the next one. That's it. We're out of here.

we should save that one. That sounds too interesting. Okay. Let's save it. Same for the next one. That's it. We're out of here.

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