00:00

Alright. Today, we're talking about an app that is taking off that I think might be the next TikTok. It's a Chinese app that you've probably never heard of.

Alright. Today, we're talking about an app that is taking off that I think might be the next TikTok. It's a Chinese app that you've probably never heard of.

00:07

Sam got all the numbers behind a cold plunge business that's doing over a hundred million dollars years, including their ad numbers, which is rare. You almost never get to see that. And lastly, we talk about lessons that we learned from Jess Mah, a founder who has built a business up to nine hundred million dollars. And she shared one or two golden little nuggets that we wanted to talk about. Enjoy the steps.

Sam got all the numbers behind a cold plunge business that's doing over a hundred million dollars years, including their ad numbers, which is rare. You almost never get to see that. And lastly, we talk about lessons that we learned from Jess Mah, a founder who has built a business up to nine hundred million dollars. And she shared one or two golden little nuggets that we wanted to talk about. Enjoy the steps.

00:35

Alright. Let me give you an update on something. So we had you know, I take a lot of pride in the fact that we've had some people on here right before they're, like, fame arc really took off. We had Brian Johnson on here.

Alright. Let me give you an update on something. So we had you know, I take a lot of pride in the fact that we've had some people on here right before they're, like, fame arc really took off. We had Brian Johnson on here.

00:47

You said that he mentioned, like, yeah, you guys are one of my first people. Another one, Andrew Huberman. We talked to Andrew Huberman. I remember we talked to him, and I think he was, like, in this hallway in Stanford or something like doing an interview with us. And after the pod or during the pod, I told him that, like, cold plunging is interesting to me. And after the pod, he goes, hey, I wanna send you a cold plunge.

You said that he mentioned, like, yeah, you guys are one of my first people. Another one, Andrew Huberman. We talked to Andrew Huberman. I remember we talked to him, and I think he was, like, in this hallway in Stanford or something like doing an interview with us. And after the pod or during the pod, I told him that, like, cold plunging is interesting to me. And after the pod, he goes, hey, I wanna send you a cold plunge.

01:07

And I was like, that's very kind of you. I I would love that. And so we introduced me to this guy named Brian, Ryan Dewey,

And I was like, that's very kind of you. I I would love that. And so we introduced me to this guy named Brian, Ryan Dewey,

01:14

Ryan sent me a cold plunge. And the company now, it's it's, what's the URL actually? Is it? Plunge dot com. Plunge dot com.

Ryan sent me a cold plunge. And the company now, it's it's, what's the URL actually? Is it? Plunge dot com. Plunge dot com.

01:22

Plunge dot com. Yeah. It's just called plunge.

Plunge dot com. Yeah. It's just called plunge.

01:26

He sent me this thing, and I started using it, and I loved it, and I dug it. And by the way, this also sounds like an ad. This is not an ad. I have nothing to do with these guys.

He sent me this thing, and I started using it, and I loved it, and I dug it. And by the way, this also sounds like an ad. This is not an ad. I have nothing to do with these guys.

01:33

But But Ryan, I will take a free plunge. I said no earlier.

But But Ryan, I will take a free plunge. I said no earlier.

01:37

Did you say no when he offered you one? I said no. I said no the first time. That's crazy. And, I was wrong. Mean, I'm man enough to admit it. I was wrong. I w would like a punch. Thank you. Yeah. They're awesome. But here's the deal. When he was selling them at the time, I think they were, like, thirty five hundred now. I think they're, like, fifty five hundred dollars. And I didn't know if I liked doing it. So I was, like, yeah, I'll take one that because that's a lot of money to spend just for to test something out. And so I got an update on these guys. I think they only launched in two thousand twenty. And in preparation for this pot, I just went and talked to them. We got a bunch of numbers. This year, they're so here listen to their revenue. In two thousand twenty, so the way it started is Ryan and his partner, Michael, they each separately owned,

Did you say no when he offered you one? I said no. I said no the first time. That's crazy. And, I was wrong. Mean, I'm man enough to admit it. I was wrong. I w would like a punch. Thank you. Yeah. They're awesome. But here's the deal. When he was selling them at the time, I think they were, like, thirty five hundred now. I think they're, like, fifty five hundred dollars. And I didn't know if I liked doing it. So I was, like, yeah, I'll take one that because that's a lot of money to spend just for to test something out. And so I got an update on these guys. I think they only launched in two thousand twenty. And in preparation for this pot, I just went and talked to them. We got a bunch of numbers. This year, they're so here listen to their revenue. In two thousand twenty, so the way it started is Ryan and his partner, Michael, they each separately owned,

02:15

brick and mortar, but it's business One of them, Ryan owned this thing called a float therapy,

brick and mortar, but it's business One of them, Ryan owned this thing called a float therapy,

02:20

center or I don't know what it is. Float tank. Yeah. It's like you go. It's like a I used to call them deprivation take. I used to do it in San Francisco every once in a while. You're, like, sitting in this, like, tanning bed that's filled with salt water. You basically float and it's completely dark and no noise, and you feel funky. It's kinda cool. His other partner owned, like, like, a I think it was called a reboot. It was like a sauna that you could go to in LA, but COVID happens. So both of those businesses screwed. And so they're like, man, we gotta figure something out. And they noticed that at their places, people were asking for cold plunges. And they also saw that online, I think at the time, it was, like, fifteen grand to get a coal plunge as opposed to what a lot of people do. What I used to do in college is you get, like, a big trash can, and you just gotta go to, like, seven eleven and buy ice and fill your your thing up, your your bucket with with water hose,

center or I don't know what it is. Float tank. Yeah. It's like you go. It's like a I used to call them deprivation take. I used to do it in San Francisco every once in a while. You're, like, sitting in this, like, tanning bed that's filled with salt water. You basically float and it's completely dark and no noise, and you feel funky. It's kinda cool. His other partner owned, like, like, a I think it was called a reboot. It was like a sauna that you could go to in LA, but COVID happens. So both of those businesses screwed. And so they're like, man, we gotta figure something out. And they noticed that at their places, people were asking for cold plunges. And they also saw that online, I think at the time, it was, like, fifteen grand to get a coal plunge as opposed to what a lot of people do. What I used to do in college is you get, like, a big trash can, and you just gotta go to, like, seven eleven and buy ice and fill your your thing up, your your bucket with with water hose,

03:06

or hose, water from the hose, and it takes forever, whatever. And they were like, alright, let's create our own. So two thousand twenty, they did two hundred seventy thousand in revenue.

or hose, water from the hose, and it takes forever, whatever. And they were like, alright, let's create our own. So two thousand twenty, they did two hundred seventy thousand in revenue.

03:13

Two thousand twenty one, they did eight million. Two thousand twenty two, I think we got it in twenty one or twenty two whenever Andrew came on. Two thousand twenty two, they did thirty three million in revenue, This year, two thousand twenty three, they're doing around ten million a month, and they're gonna surpass a hundred million in revenue

Two thousand twenty one, they did eight million. Two thousand twenty two, I think we got it in twenty one or twenty two whenever Andrew came on. Two thousand twenty two, they did thirty three million in revenue, This year, two thousand twenty three, they're doing around ten million a month, and they're gonna surpass a hundred million in revenue

03:30

off freaking cold plunges.

off freaking cold plunges.

03:32

It's wild. Insane. And the way they the way he told me they got started was they basically

It's wild. Insane. And the way they the way he told me they got started was they basically

03:37

dmed Aubrey Marcus who's this health guy on Instagram who owns on it And they were like, hey, man, we're gonna we'll come to your house and just set up a cold plunge for free. And so they get a u haul and they fill it up with this, like, little homemade thing that they did. They used, like, a bunch of parts from Home Depot, I'd imagine, because I have an early version. It looks like something you could kinda have together. And they brought it to his place, and they set it up for him. And they were like, is there anyone else you think we should talk to? And he's like, yeah, Superman, talk to this guy. And so they get a u haul, and they fill it up with five more, and they start delivering it to these guys. And I guess that's how I got, like, you know, it was a lunch tour. Would go there and they would fill a four or five of these going to plunge tour, and they would Instagram while they were doing it. And so people on IG would see it. Like like me, I would see it on IG, and it'd be like, Damn, this must be, like, some super successful company because they're they're they're only delivering to people that I know. Like, you know, influencers, basically, even though there were no other customers. It was only those customers. Yeah. And there's it was only, like, a few of them. It was, like, they they they threw this thing together. And I guess that's when I kinda that's when Andrew, like, I guess they were, like, Andrew, you know, we have this money for you to give away. Do you wanna give away to whoever? They gave one to me, they gave one to Sah Hill. They so far, they've given away hundreds of these things.

dmed Aubrey Marcus who's this health guy on Instagram who owns on it And they were like, hey, man, we're gonna we'll come to your house and just set up a cold plunge for free. And so they get a u haul and they fill it up with this, like, little homemade thing that they did. They used, like, a bunch of parts from Home Depot, I'd imagine, because I have an early version. It looks like something you could kinda have together. And they brought it to his place, and they set it up for him. And they were like, is there anyone else you think we should talk to? And he's like, yeah, Superman, talk to this guy. And so they get a u haul, and they fill it up with five more, and they start delivering it to these guys. And I guess that's how I got, like, you know, it was a lunch tour. Would go there and they would fill a four or five of these going to plunge tour, and they would Instagram while they were doing it. And so people on IG would see it. Like like me, I would see it on IG, and it'd be like, Damn, this must be, like, some super successful company because they're they're they're only delivering to people that I know. Like, you know, influencers, basically, even though there were no other customers. It was only those customers. Yeah. And there's it was only, like, a few of them. It was, like, they they they threw this thing together. And I guess that's when I kinda that's when Andrew, like, I guess they were, like, Andrew, you know, we have this money for you to give away. Do you wanna give away to whoever? They gave one to me, they gave one to Sah Hill. They so far, they've given away hundreds of these things.

04:49

And they're killing it. And never in a million years would have thought a cold plunge business would do north of a hundred million in revenue. By the way, they've given away over a thousand plunges. That's insane. Right? That's like the that means influencer marketing was, like, so important.

And they're killing it. And never in a million years would have thought a cold plunge business would do north of a hundred million in revenue. By the way, they've given away over a thousand plunges. That's insane. Right? That's like the that means influencer marketing was, like, so important.

05:03

To to them at the beginning.

To to them at the beginning.

05:08

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

05:11

See, most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. Think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. HubSpot,

See, most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. Think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. HubSpot,

05:21

grow better.

grow better.

05:23

A couple other fun facts. Gonna say a couple of these that you have on your notes. Yeah. Do it. They bought plunge dot com off of a New Orleans Baz band for two hundred fifty k, which is just hilarious. That's a that's wild. They basically are riding this wave. So if you look on Google trends, we'll put this up on the screen on on YouTube, you could see basically cold plunge versus ice bath and just both of them rising over time as, like, you know, the kind of the Huberman era kicks in here. So they're they're right in the back of that. But the insane thing is this ad spend. You gotta talk about this. You talk about it because this is in your this is your wheelhouse. But basically, what they did was They,

A couple other fun facts. Gonna say a couple of these that you have on your notes. Yeah. Do it. They bought plunge dot com off of a New Orleans Baz band for two hundred fifty k, which is just hilarious. That's a that's wild. They basically are riding this wave. So if you look on Google trends, we'll put this up on the screen on on YouTube, you could see basically cold plunge versus ice bath and just both of them rising over time as, like, you know, the kind of the Huberman era kicks in here. So they're they're right in the back of that. But the insane thing is this ad spend. You gotta talk about this. You talk about it because this is in your this is your wheelhouse. But basically, what they did was They,

05:56

Ryan. I've met Ryan. He's almost like

Ryan. I've met Ryan. He's almost like

05:59

he I don't know the best way to describe it, but he's one of these guys that was doing Ayahuasca before Ayahuasca was cool. When I went and hung out with him, like, he had his toenails painted because, like, there's something around that. I don't exactly know what it is, but there's, like, something around that. Like, he's, like, eccentric.

he I don't know the best way to describe it, but he's one of these guys that was doing Ayahuasca before Ayahuasca was cool. When I went and hung out with him, like, he had his toenails painted because, like, there's something around that. I don't exactly know what it is, but there's, like, something around that. Like, he's, like, eccentric.

06:14

And I don't think he probably knew anything about Google ads or Facebook ads. And so he said he hired a guy on Upwork to help run Google ads for them. And that's they started. So what and and he even sent me a screenshot. Basically, it shows their revenue. It shows their ad spend, and it shows it broke it down on Google Facebook and even being a little bit. But, like, just looking at their total paid media. That's there's a one to zoom in on this. This is these are kind of bonkers numbers. So this is is this a month? What what what is this? I think this is This is monthly.

And I don't think he probably knew anything about Google ads or Facebook ads. And so he said he hired a guy on Upwork to help run Google ads for them. And that's they started. So what and and he even sent me a screenshot. Basically, it shows their revenue. It shows their ad spend, and it shows it broke it down on Google Facebook and even being a little bit. But, like, just looking at their total paid media. That's there's a one to zoom in on this. This is these are kind of bonkers numbers. So this is is this a month? What what what is this? I think this is This is monthly.

06:42

Think this is monthly, which is crazy. So last month I don't know if it's last month, but one month, eight hundred sixty thousand in ad spend.

Think this is monthly, which is crazy. So last month I don't know if it's last month, but one month, eight hundred sixty thousand in ad spend.

06:50

So eight hundred sixty k in a month, and then their roas on that return on ad spend was seven point one.

So eight hundred sixty k in a month, and then their roas on that return on ad spend was seven point one.

06:57

To get just to put this in this is the that's bananas.

To get just to put this in this is the that's bananas.

07:01

Nobody has seven or eight extra as they said they've had that basically from the beginning, they they used to get,

Nobody has seven or eight extra as they said they've had that basically from the beginning, they they used to get,

07:07

over ten x. Now it's sort of, like, between seven and ten x.

over ten x. Now it's sort of, like, between seven and ten x.

07:11

To get a seven extra as that means you're it's a you have a machine They put a box in this guy's house, and it's a magic box. And the box says if you put one dollar into this box, you get seven dollars out. That's what that means. And so They have this box that they're able to put eight hundred thousand dollars in each month and get out, you know, six million dollars back. And they're just doing that month after month after month. And so you see it on Google, or ROAS is, you know, five point eight. On Facebook, it's ten point seven. I don't know why they're saying this, by the way. I would never reveal this information. If I if I found a magic box that does this,

To get a seven extra as that means you're it's a you have a machine They put a box in this guy's house, and it's a magic box. And the box says if you put one dollar into this box, you get seven dollars out. That's what that means. And so They have this box that they're able to put eight hundred thousand dollars in each month and get out, you know, six million dollars back. And they're just doing that month after month after month. And so you see it on Google, or ROAS is, you know, five point eight. On Facebook, it's ten point seven. I don't know why they're saying this, by the way. I would never reveal this information. If I if I found a magic box that does this,

07:45

you know, I would never share this with anybody, but said to do it. So, you know, here here you go. I think maybe they think they're they're pretty far ahead in terms of competition, but

you know, I would never share this with anybody, but said to do it. So, you know, here here you go. I think maybe they think they're they're pretty far ahead in terms of competition, but

07:54

I don't know.

I don't know.

07:55

If you can get these numbers, anyone can get these numbers on Facebook. There's not they they have no, special sauce there that that's gonna be, you know, un uncopiable, I guess. Why why do they agree to share this?

If you can get these numbers, anyone can get these numbers on Facebook. There's not they they have no, special sauce there that that's gonna be, you know, un uncopiable, I guess. Why why do they agree to share this?

08:06

I just said I'm gonna talk about you in the pod. Like, let me interview, and I said whatever we talk about, this is, like, on the record, so I guess if they change their mind, they'll let me know. Well, I mean, it's cool that they get a big feature. That's cool. But, also, this is crazy. And just prop them. These numbers are insane. So basically And they own the whole thing. So they bootstrap. They haven't taken any funding. And this is, by the way, just in twenty. So they're coming up at four years. So on Facebook, in this snapshot here, this is accurate. The the snap the the stack on Facebook, so the cost to acquire a customer on Facebook for them is three hundred eighty seven dollars. They're selling this thing for five thousand dollars. So you could see you're paying, you know, just under four hundred bucks to get somebody to pay you five thousand bucks. Amazing trade on on the ad spend. And you could see why this thing is scaling

I just said I'm gonna talk about you in the pod. Like, let me interview, and I said whatever we talk about, this is, like, on the record, so I guess if they change their mind, they'll let me know. Well, I mean, it's cool that they get a big feature. That's cool. But, also, this is crazy. And just prop them. These numbers are insane. So basically And they own the whole thing. So they bootstrap. They haven't taken any funding. And this is, by the way, just in twenty. So they're coming up at four years. So on Facebook, in this snapshot here, this is accurate. The the snap the the stack on Facebook, so the cost to acquire a customer on Facebook for them is three hundred eighty seven dollars. They're selling this thing for five thousand dollars. So you could see you're paying, you know, just under four hundred bucks to get somebody to pay you five thousand bucks. Amazing trade on on the ad spend. And you could see why this thing is scaling

08:48

so crazy. Well, you know, over It's wild. Right? Eight million thirty three million and then now over a hundred million. And they bootstrap This is profitable. They didn't raise any outside money. And now they're expanding into, like, saunas and other shit too. So that's pretty insane. What do you think this company could sell for? Let's say they they get to have no idea what the profit is. Let's say I get to a hundred so two thousand twenty, they started at two hundred a quarter million dollars in May two thousand twenty. In year four, their fourth year business, they're gonna do a hundred million. What could this sell for? Is this could this be a two or three hundred million dollar company? Definitely.

so crazy. Well, you know, over It's wild. Right? Eight million thirty three million and then now over a hundred million. And they bootstrap This is profitable. They didn't raise any outside money. And now they're expanding into, like, saunas and other shit too. So that's pretty insane. What do you think this company could sell for? Let's say they they get to have no idea what the profit is. Let's say I get to a hundred so two thousand twenty, they started at two hundred a quarter million dollars in May two thousand twenty. In year four, their fourth year business, they're gonna do a hundred million. What could this sell for? Is this could this be a two or three hundred million dollar company? Definitely.

09:17

Definitely.

Definitely.

09:18

Yeah, I would if you're getting

Yeah, I would if you're getting

09:20

Like, just to put this in perspective, if you're getting ADX roas on your money, and let's say that continues. They'll say they can if they said they're doing, you know,

Like, just to put this in perspective, if you're getting ADX roas on your money, and let's say that continues. They'll say they can if they said they're doing, you know,

09:29

whatever, eight to ten million a month. So they're over a hundred million dollars, let's say a hundred twenty million in revenue.

whatever, eight to ten million a month. So they're over a hundred million dollars, let's say a hundred twenty million in revenue.

09:36

The minimum that they should be selling for is one x revenue. So a hundred twenty million. In this case, let's say that because of their growth rate, because of the insane profitability on their on their ads, This company has to be you know, make a bank. Right? Like, normally, peep most people in e commerce are breakeven

The minimum that they should be selling for is one x revenue. So a hundred twenty million. In this case, let's say that because of their growth rate, because of the insane profitability on their on their ads, This company has to be you know, make a bank. Right? Like, normally, peep most people in e commerce are breakeven

09:54

or slightly losing money on first order.

or slightly losing money on first order.

09:57

You know, that gets you that's like you have a row as of, like, between one and two. These guys are doing, you know, six or seven times better than that. So so that's kind of insane. This company should be worth, you know, two hundred fifty, three hundred million dollars right now. You know, I I don't know how big that clear light sauna company is, but I'm pretty sure it's pretty big.

You know, that gets you that's like you have a row as of, like, between one and two. These guys are doing, you know, six or seven times better than that. So so that's kind of insane. This company should be worth, you know, two hundred fifty, three hundred million dollars right now. You know, I I don't know how big that clear light sauna company is, but I'm pretty sure it's pretty big.

10:16

Man, if I'm these guys, I might take that sale that to make that amount of money in three or four years,

Man, if I'm these guys, I might take that sale that to make that amount of money in three or four years,

10:22

And I don't know what their financial situation was before, but let's just assume that they were just getting by owning a brick and mortar business. That's wild. That that is a crazy story. I would take advantage of that. Or I would sell, like, thirty million dollars of secondary. I would sell, like, thirty million dollars at even, like, a hundred million dollar valuation and thirty percent only But now you got, you know, you put fifteen million bucks in the bank and you can keep going. If if you really wanna keep going, that's what I would do, in this case, because you could bank that huge life changing sum.

And I don't know what their financial situation was before, but let's just assume that they were just getting by owning a brick and mortar business. That's wild. That that is a crazy story. I would take advantage of that. Or I would sell, like, thirty million dollars of secondary. I would sell, like, thirty million dollars at even, like, a hundred million dollar valuation and thirty percent only But now you got, you know, you put fifteen million bucks in the bank and you can keep going. If if you really wanna keep going, that's what I would do, in this case, because you could bank that huge life changing sum.

10:51

Because these e commerce companies, let's say,

Because these e commerce companies, let's say,

10:53

you know, ad flips, competition flips, whatever. They don't, like, retain that much value because the sale is already done in the past. You basically get no

you know, ad flips, competition flips, whatever. They don't, like, retain that much value because the sale is already done in the past. You basically get no

11:02

credit for past, you know, past sales here because it's not recurring revenue. It's not like a network effect style business. So You know, you're really only as good as your next year when it comes to e commerce. I I I think at least. So, yeah, I would I would definitely take some money off the table. It's crazy though. And and by the way, I don't know, like, what the science is behind cold punching. I still I've had how long have I owned it for two or three years? Still use it three days a week. Like, I'm into it. It's clinically proven to make you post on social media at least three times more. So that's one proven effect.

credit for past, you know, past sales here because it's not recurring revenue. It's not like a network effect style business. So You know, you're really only as good as your next year when it comes to e commerce. I I I think at least. So, yeah, I would I would definitely take some money off the table. It's crazy though. And and by the way, I don't know, like, what the science is behind cold punching. I still I've had how long have I owned it for two or three years? Still use it three days a week. Like, I'm into it. It's clinically proven to make you post on social media at least three times more. So that's one proven effect.

11:31

There was this one TikTok where these guys were joking. They were like, you know, it's crazy to think about it. But for the first twenty minutes after the Titanic sank,

There was this one TikTok where these guys were joking. They were like, you know, it's crazy to think about it. But for the first twenty minutes after the Titanic sank,

11:40

the passengers were actually healthier,

the passengers were actually healthier,

11:43

until they died.

until they died.

11:47

They actually were increasing their lifespan twenty percent during that first cold plunge until they suddenly died.

They actually were increasing their lifespan twenty percent during that first cold plunge until they suddenly died.

11:55

They're, like, they're, like, too bad, Wim Hof wasn't there to teach them how to breathe. Right. They reduce their risk of heart attack. They're, like,

They're, like, they're, like, too bad, Wim Hof wasn't there to teach them how to breathe. Right. They reduce their risk of heart attack. They're, like,

12:02

they're, like, imagine if William Hallf was there, like, this feels nice,

they're, like, imagine if William Hallf was there, like, this feels nice,

12:05

Like,

Like,

12:07

but there was about fifteen minutes with me. He should do. He should rebrand to the titanic method. He should be like, oh, you don't do titanic breathing? This would this would save you would live, even if you're on the titanic, if you learned this shit.

but there was about fifteen minutes with me. He should do. He should rebrand to the titanic method. He should be like, oh, you don't do titanic breathing? This would this would save you would live, even if you're on the titanic, if you learned this shit.

12:19

It's about fifteen minutes when they were at peak physical shape.

It's about fifteen minutes when they were at peak physical shape.

12:26

Anyway, that's the update. Unplugged. I finally got an update on them. I'm shocked at how they're doing. I guess I'm not that shocked. It's a five thousand dollar product. I just I guess I'm shocked at how many people would buy into this. Never in a million years what I've thought

Anyway, that's the update. Unplugged. I finally got an update on them. I'm shocked at how they're doing. I guess I'm not that shocked. It's a five thousand dollar product. I just I guess I'm shocked at how many people would buy into this. Never in a million years what I've thought

12:38

This many people would buy into this and wanna get cold however many times a week. So that's my update on plunge. I got

This many people would buy into this and wanna get cold however many times a week. So that's my update on plunge. I got

12:46

one thing I wanna jump right into is something that's been on my mind. It's been grinding my gears.

one thing I wanna jump right into is something that's been on my mind. It's been grinding my gears.

12:51

It's been a little,

It's been a little,

12:53

a little itch I need to scratch.

a little itch I need to scratch.

12:55

And that is

And that is

12:57

supplement testing.

supplement testing.

12:59

So you're a big supplements guy. It sounds like you're setting up an ad, by the way. We have to say this is not an ad. No. No. This is not an ad. This is just me being,

So you're a big supplements guy. It sounds like you're setting up an ad, by the way. We have to say this is not an ad. No. No. This is not an ad. This is just me being,

13:08

corny. So,

corny. So,

13:10

I've been thinking about this idea because I've been buying a shit ton of supplements.

I've been thinking about this idea because I've been buying a shit ton of supplements.

13:15

And,

And,

13:16

I don't know about you, but, like, are like, oh, you know, you take that? I'm like, yeah. They're like,

I don't know about you, but, like, are like, oh, you know, you take that? I'm like, yeah. They're like,

13:21

how how does, like, is it working?

how how does, like, is it working?

13:23

I'm like, how the fuck how would I know? It's a supplement. You never know if a supplement's working. Right? Like, I personally feel that way. I don't know if I'm just not in tune, like, with my body. When do you take stuff, do you have, like, a clear,

I'm like, how the fuck how would I know? It's a supplement. You never know if a supplement's working. Right? Like, I personally feel that way. I don't know if I'm just not in tune, like, with my body. When do you take stuff, do you have, like, a clear,

13:34

like, this is helping me versus this is not when it comes actual, like, supplements?

like, this is helping me versus this is not when it comes actual, like, supplements?

13:38

There's

There's

13:39

basically

basically

13:40

only one or two supplements that I've ever taken where I'm, like, this is working. So I take either melatonin or magnesium

only one or two supplements that I've ever taken where I'm, like, this is working. So I take either melatonin or magnesium

13:48

at night.

at night.

13:49

And that's the only those are the only two where I'm like, alright. It helps me go to sleep faster.

And that's the only those are the only two where I'm like, alright. It helps me go to sleep faster.

13:54

Besides that,

Besides that,

13:56

protein. So but protein is it protein is a supplement, but it's, you know, it's it's a nutrient So, like, you wanna eat more protein, whether it comes through a powder or not, I notice my muscles get bigger. Besides that, I don't think I've noticed a difference in mostly anything. Even protein for me, it's not even like I feel my muscles getting bigger. I just feel more full. So I'm like, okay. That did something. Like, that is, like, kind of like a meal replacement.

protein. So but protein is it protein is a supplement, but it's, you know, it's it's a nutrient So, like, you wanna eat more protein, whether it comes through a powder or not, I notice my muscles get bigger. Besides that, I don't think I've noticed a difference in mostly anything. Even protein for me, it's not even like I feel my muscles getting bigger. I just feel more full. So I'm like, okay. That did something. Like, that is, like, kind of like a meal replacement.

14:19

Got it. Like, even creatine, I start taking creatine, and,

Got it. Like, even creatine, I start taking creatine, and,

14:23

I thought that creatine would be

I thought that creatine would be

14:26

I thought creatine was gonna be the hard shit. Like, oh, okay. Here we go. I've crossed the line. I'm doing the hard shit now. Now it's just gonna be, like, a little unfair these gains that I'm about to be having. Can't feel anything. You with creatine?

I thought creatine was gonna be the hard shit. Like, oh, okay. Here we go. I've crossed the line. I'm doing the hard shit now. Now it's just gonna be, like, a little unfair these gains that I'm about to be having. Can't feel anything. You with creatine?

14:37

No. I don't feel anything. When I was taking testosterone,

No. I don't feel anything. When I was taking testosterone,

14:40

I felt that, but that I don't know if that would be under the the the heading of supplements.

I felt that, but that I don't know if that would be under the the the heading of supplements.

14:46

But, like, basically,

But, like, basically,

14:48

if it's illegal or

if it's illegal or

14:50

banned in sports, I've noticed a difference. Besides that, if I could buy it at if I could buy it at Target, I don't know if I've noticed a difference. Right. If you're not having to text a guy to get it, you're not gonna feel it. So

banned in sports, I've noticed a difference. Besides that, if I could buy it at if I could buy it at Target, I don't know if I've noticed a difference. Right. If you're not having to text a guy to get it, you're not gonna feel it. So

15:02

I feel like with supplements, there's an opportunity. The opportunity with supplements

I feel like with supplements, there's an opportunity. The opportunity with supplements

15:06

is to

is to

15:07

be the most trusted source when it comes to supplements. So for you,

be the most trusted source when it comes to supplements. So for you,

15:11

where do you go when you wanna find out if

where do you go when you wanna find out if

15:15

which brand you should be taking or which brand you should not be taking or what's the most effective, what's the cleanest, what's the healthiest for you,

which brand you should be taking or which brand you should not be taking or what's the most effective, what's the cleanest, what's the healthiest for you,

15:22

Where do you go to get that information right now? So I use examine.com to figure out which,

Where do you go to get that information right now? So I use examine.com to figure out which,

15:29

supplements are, like, which the science has shown that it works, but examine dot com. Right? That's the brand. Right? That's the Yeah. Examine dot com in order to stay neutral, they don't promote any brands. Right. And so I go to Amazon. I talk to friends. It it's pretty challenging. It's also challenging because do you remember the mattress review websites? Like, the top one, it ended up being owned by Casper. Exactly. And so it was incredibly challenging to find, like, which like, for example, some protein brands say, we have twenty five grams of protein per scoop, and then you go and research it. And it's like, no. This one actually only has eighteen. Or this has some certifications,

supplements are, like, which the science has shown that it works, but examine dot com. Right? That's the brand. Right? That's the Yeah. Examine dot com in order to stay neutral, they don't promote any brands. Right. And so I go to Amazon. I talk to friends. It it's pretty challenging. It's also challenging because do you remember the mattress review websites? Like, the top one, it ended up being owned by Casper. Exactly. And so it was incredibly challenging to find, like, which like, for example, some protein brands say, we have twenty five grams of protein per scoop, and then you go and research it. And it's like, no. This one actually only has eighteen. Or this has some certifications,

16:04

which means they had to jump through super that hoop. It's actually quite challenging to figure out who's clean and who to trust. Yeah. I think it was Casper that owned was it Casper or purple that that owned a bunch of the the top mattress blog that had, like they were, like, for fifteen years, they were, like, a normal blog, and they went bottom out, and then they, like, started promoting their own shit. And it's the same thing with with supplements, you know, like, the What's rule number one, if you create a protein brand, you go you buy your brand name, your domain, and then you buy the truth about protein dot com, because you're gonna need that too in order to promote your own shit. It's really hard.

which means they had to jump through super that hoop. It's actually quite challenging to figure out who's clean and who to trust. Yeah. I think it was Casper that owned was it Casper or purple that that owned a bunch of the the top mattress blog that had, like they were, like, for fifteen years, they were, like, a normal blog, and they went bottom out, and then they, like, started promoting their own shit. And it's the same thing with with supplements, you know, like, the What's rule number one, if you create a protein brand, you go you buy your brand name, your domain, and then you buy the truth about protein dot com, because you're gonna need that too in order to promote your own shit. It's really hard.

16:37

It's really hard. The reality is that supplements and health and wellness are on the way up.

It's really hard. The reality is that supplements and health and wellness are on the way up.

16:42

People are are it's becoming more and more normal to take a wider and wider variety of these things. There's more and more brands in the market because now you have D to C brands So anyone can create a brain. You don't need to fight for shelf space because you can just be on the internet, the infinite shelf.

People are are it's becoming more and more normal to take a wider and wider variety of these things. There's more and more brands in the market because now you have D to C brands So anyone can create a brain. You don't need to fight for shelf space because you can just be on the internet, the infinite shelf.

16:55

And I think the need has become bigger than ever, for somebody to become the trusted person, and I say person, specifically here, the trusted person

And I think the need has become bigger than ever, for somebody to become the trusted person, and I say person, specifically here, the trusted person

17:03

around

around

17:04

supplement testing.

supplement testing.

17:05

And, have you seen this guy FlavCity?

And, have you seen this guy FlavCity?

17:09

No. How do you spell it? F l a v,

No. How do you spell it? F l a v,

17:12

then city So FlavCity is this guy that my mom will send me. My mom will always send me this thing. So this guy's shtick is genius. Like, in terms of content creation,

then city So FlavCity is this guy that my mom will send me. My mom will always send me this thing. So this guy's shtick is genius. Like, in terms of content creation,

17:21

This is such a good niche, and,

This is such a good niche, and,

17:24

it is so perfect. So what he does is he's like, I'm a trusted guy. I'm not like some super expert or whatever, but I'm just I'm a guy who knows things. And what he does is he goes to a grocery store. If you go look at his Instagram, he'll go to a grocery store, be at Costco.

it is so perfect. So what he does is he's like, I'm a trusted guy. I'm not like some super expert or whatever, but I'm just I'm a guy who knows things. And what he does is he goes to a grocery store. If you go look at his Instagram, he'll go to a grocery store, be at Costco.

17:36

He'd be like, the thumbnail is him holding up, let's say, parmesan cheese. And he'll be like, don't buy this. See, and he'll turn it around. He'd be like, See, it has parmesan cheese, milk, that's fine, but then it has artificial flavors. We don't like artificial flavors because they're gonna be bad for blah blah blah. Instead by this one, and he'll have another one at Costco. That's better. He's like, see this one doesn't have artificial flavors, doesn't have this. It doesn't have this, but it's the best one you could find at Costco. So he's doing it right now on Instagram.

He'd be like, the thumbnail is him holding up, let's say, parmesan cheese. And he'll be like, don't buy this. See, and he'll turn it around. He'd be like, See, it has parmesan cheese, milk, that's fine, but then it has artificial flavors. We don't like artificial flavors because they're gonna be bad for blah blah blah. Instead by this one, and he'll have another one at Costco. That's better. He's like, see this one doesn't have artificial flavors, doesn't have this. It doesn't have this, but it's the best one you could find at Costco. So he's doing it right now on Instagram.

18:04

He's doing it for veggie straws, which is, like, those potato chips that are, like, whatever. They're

He's doing it for veggie straws, which is, like, those potato chips that are, like, whatever. They're

18:10

supposedly made out of vegetables. He goes, this is bad for this reason. Here are some, here here are some better ones for you. Lesser evil power curls,

supposedly made out of vegetables. He goes, this is bad for this reason. Here are some, here here are some better ones for you. Lesser evil power curls,

18:19

Ciette Puffs, Jackson's sweet potato chips. And he and he looks at the back of veggie straws, and he tells you what's wrong with it. Right. And I'm giving this to my kids. Right? Veggie straws. That's better than chips. It's veggies. Right? And it's like so he's he just debunks a lot of things, and he's got his whole thing. He's very high energy He does mainstream products that are in shopping sent, in shopping stores, and he'll be like,

Ciette Puffs, Jackson's sweet potato chips. And he and he looks at the back of veggie straws, and he tells you what's wrong with it. Right. And I'm giving this to my kids. Right? Veggie straws. That's better than chips. It's veggies. Right? And it's like so he's he just debunks a lot of things, and he's got his whole thing. He's very high energy He does mainstream products that are in shopping sent, in shopping stores, and he'll be like,

18:42

this one, Bobby approved. And he's like, got his own little shtick where he's, like, this is Bobby approved.

this one, Bobby approved. And he's like, got his own little shtick where he's, like, this is Bobby approved.

18:47

And he's, like, he's basically dug tomorrow,

And he's, like, he's basically dug tomorrow,

18:50

but for, you know,

but for, you know,

18:52

packaged goods instead of far. And he has two point five million followers that posted the veggie straw ones that I just said has twenty five thousand likes. Exactly. Because it's super affordable because as soon as he says something and you know somebody who eats that, you share it with them. And then he becomes a trusted source. He's not selling you anything. He's just telling you better and worse. He's telling you what to avoid. Or he's like, okay. It's it's the holiday.

packaged goods instead of far. And he has two point five million followers that posted the veggie straw ones that I just said has twenty five thousand likes. Exactly. Because it's super affordable because as soon as he says something and you know somebody who eats that, you share it with them. And then he becomes a trusted source. He's not selling you anything. He's just telling you better and worse. He's telling you what to avoid. Or he's like, okay. It's it's the holiday.

19:12

He he's got one holiday booze haul. It's like, these are the things to, you know, to buy and don't buy when it comes to booze farm salmon. Does farm salmon good or bad? And he just uses the, like, thinker emoji so you're like, oh, shit. Is there something I need to know about farm salmon? Is that not is that not healthy? I thought that was.

He he's got one holiday booze haul. It's like, these are the things to, you know, to buy and don't buy when it comes to booze farm salmon. Does farm salmon good or bad? And he just uses the, like, thinker emoji so you're like, oh, shit. Is there something I need to know about farm salmon? Is that not is that not healthy? I thought that was.

19:27

He's got another one, ditch the goldfish. Right? So he's he's taking these popular products. He's doing this. So I think this is genius. I think more people should literally just copy him.

He's got another one, ditch the goldfish. Right? So he's he's taking these popular products. He's doing this. So I think this is genius. I think more people should literally just copy him.

19:36

Because there's room for more here. And you could differentiate

Because there's room for more here. And you could differentiate

19:39

by being,

by being,

19:40

you know, a mom who's gonna be trusted by moms and do more mom products than than what he's doing, or you could be a meat head who's doing more protein, gym, gym bro type of content. That's kinda what more place, more dates is doing. But I think this format

you know, a mom who's gonna be trusted by moms and do more mom products than than what he's doing, or you could be a meat head who's doing more protein, gym, gym bro type of content. That's kinda what more place, more dates is doing. But I think this format

19:54

is beautiful. So

is beautiful. So

19:55

let me just tell you about this opportunity. Okay. So here's how I'm thinking about this. Do you know Consumer Reports

let me just tell you about this opportunity. Okay. So here's how I'm thinking about this. Do you know Consumer Reports

20:01

they test, like, every product, ellipticals, and, you know, coffee machines and whatever else. Do you know about the company itself, Consumer Reports? I do. We brought them up. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna steal your stays here, but it's wild. It's wild. Well, they're non profit.

they test, like, every product, ellipticals, and, you know, coffee machines and whatever else. Do you know about the company itself, Consumer Reports? I do. We brought them up. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna steal your stays here, but it's wild. It's wild. Well, they're non profit.

20:17

Do you know, you could give give me an accurate guess. You don't have to give me the homie guess where you guess low just to make me feel Give me the what you think the real guess is their revenue per year. Do you know? A hundred.

Do you know, you could give give me an accurate guess. You don't have to give me the homie guess where you guess low just to make me feel Give me the what you think the real guess is their revenue per year. Do you know? A hundred.

20:27

Three almost three hundred million a year, two eighty nine. That's insane. It's crazy. Right? And it's all subscription revenue. What's that? It's all subscription revenue too, I think. Yeah. I don't know the exact mix, but it's it's a nonprofit so you can actually go find a bunch of their stuff.

Three almost three hundred million a year, two eighty nine. That's insane. It's crazy. Right? And it's all subscription revenue. What's that? It's all subscription revenue too, I think. Yeah. I don't know the exact mix, but it's it's a nonprofit so you can actually go find a bunch of their stuff.

20:40

So and they have, like, two hundred fifty million of assets on their books, which, like, nonprofits are are famous for, like, having, you know, high revenue, high expenses, and then just, like, a lot a lot of assets on the books. And so You you have to you have to spend a hundred, sixty bucks a year in order to get access to their articles.

So and they have, like, two hundred fifty million of assets on their books, which, like, nonprofits are are famous for, like, having, you know, high revenue, high expenses, and then just, like, a lot a lot of assets on the books. And so You you have to you have to spend a hundred, sixty bucks a year in order to get access to their articles.

20:56

And it's old as old as hell. Like, you go there and literally, like, the website looks old. You know, like, when you see videos of people from, like, the nineties or the eighties,

And it's old as old as hell. Like, you go there and literally, like, the website looks old. You know, like, when you see videos of people from, like, the nineties or the eighties,

21:06

And it's just like the haircuts are old. The fashion is old. It's all old. And, like, these people have eighties haircuts. And I just realized I saw this. Is time for a new consumer reports.

And it's just like the haircuts are old. The fashion is old. It's all old. And, like, these people have eighties haircuts. And I just realized I saw this. Is time for a new consumer reports.

21:17

JD Power does this for cars. Right? JD Power what is it JD Power and Associates? I don't know who these people are. I don't know what they do. Hundred forty million a year of revenue. So I think there's an opportunity to create the new age consumer reports or JD Power around

JD Power does this for cars. Right? JD Power what is it JD Power and Associates? I don't know who these people are. I don't know what they do. Hundred forty million a year of revenue. So I think there's an opportunity to create the new age consumer reports or JD Power around

21:30

supplements, specifically,

supplements, specifically,

21:32

And I would do it in the TikTok format. So what Flav City is doing, I would do it that way, and I would test every single product, and I would test it in a scientific way that people can't. So They claim

And I would do it in the TikTok format. So what Flav City is doing, I would do it that way, and I would test every single product, and I would test it in a scientific way that people can't. So They claim

21:42

that it has this many, you know, grams of protein per scoop. Let's find out. Truth or dare. Right? I dare you to have the amount of protein you say. You do a little fifteen second thirty second video that's kind of,

that it has this many, you know, grams of protein per scoop. Let's find out. Truth or dare. Right? I dare you to have the amount of protein you say. You do a little fifteen second thirty second video that's kind of,

21:55

you know, talking about each one of these products. The beauty of short form video is for the mister b said this to me and I and I kind of was like, I never thought about this before. He goes, for the first time ever, short form video is the only content format that can be posted on every social network at the same time.

you know, talking about each one of these products. The beauty of short form video is for the mister b said this to me and I and I kind of was like, I never thought about this before. He goes, for the first time ever, short form video is the only content format that can be posted on every social network at the same time.

22:12

I was like, what? He's, yeah, basically,

I was like, what? He's, yeah, basically,

22:14

let's take, you know, Instagram is a single photo that's filtered. Cool. You could post that on Instagram. You could kinda post it on Facebook.

let's take, you know, Instagram is a single photo that's filtered. Cool. You could post that on Instagram. You could kinda post it on Facebook.

22:21

You might be able to post that on Twitter, but it wasn't the native way of doing things. And, you know, like, but but you can't post that on Snapchat the same way. Like, you can't do that. But with short form video, you can literally get on TikTok, YouTube,

You might be able to post that on Twitter, but it wasn't the native way of doing things. And, you know, like, but but you can't post that on Snapchat the same way. Like, you can't do that. But with short form video, you can literally get on TikTok, YouTube,

22:34

Instagram,

Instagram,

22:35

Facebook,

Facebook,

22:36

Snapchat, every single social network

Snapchat, every single social network

22:39

is compatible with short trip short form video, which means troll from video is now the dominant

is compatible with short trip short form video, which means troll from video is now the dominant

22:44

the dominant content format to be creating it. And, I so I think if you do this, you could go across all of them. You can't monetize that. The so typically the way there's basically two ways that you maybe there's three. There's two main ways you monetize this. So there's affiliate, which is wirecutter.com. I've got a a I know a guy named Dennis who started bestreviews.com. He sold it for a hundred and ten million dollars to the worst named company on earth. It was called Tronc, which was, I it's basically the company I think that owns LA Times

the dominant content format to be creating it. And, I so I think if you do this, you could go across all of them. You can't monetize that. The so typically the way there's basically two ways that you maybe there's three. There's two main ways you monetize this. So there's affiliate, which is wirecutter.com. I've got a a I know a guy named Dennis who started bestreviews.com. He sold it for a hundred and ten million dollars to the worst named company on earth. It was called Tronc, which was, I it's basically the company I think that owns LA Times

23:14

and he sold it for a hundred and ten million bucks after Tronc should definitely be, like, a women's jeans brand. That's, like,

and he sold it for a hundred and ten million bucks after Tronc should definitely be, like, a women's jeans brand. That's, like,

23:21

all about your butt or something. Yeah.

all about your butt or something. Yeah.

23:24

Tronc is a horrible David. The junk in the trunk. You know what I'm saying?

Tronc is a horrible David. The junk in the trunk. You know what I'm saying?

23:28

It's a really bad name. It's one of those names that sounds like a noise.

It's a really bad name. It's one of those names that sounds like a noise.

23:32

And so they they sold Tronc. I I think after four years, and they monetized it the same way as Wirecutter so it was through affiliates.

And so they they sold Tronc. I I think after four years, and they monetized it the same way as Wirecutter so it was through affiliates.

23:39

But wirecutter is one of the few. I think NerdWallet does a good job where they do trust where for some, for some reason, I still trust them even though I know they get paid per click, Right. And then the other one, which is harder to pull off, but a way better business, is,

But wirecutter is one of the few. I think NerdWallet does a good job where they do trust where for some, for some reason, I still trust them even though I know they get paid per click, Right. And then the other one, which is harder to pull off, but a way better business, is,

23:51

subscription. And that's what Consumer Reports does. You know why Wirecutter, I think, can has that trust even though they're clearly pushing, you know, they're clearly making money off the recommendations.

subscription. And that's what Consumer Reports does. You know why Wirecutter, I think, can has that trust even though they're clearly pushing, you know, they're clearly making money off the recommendations.

24:02

I think it's two things. One, it's like design and copywriting. So it feels like a person is talking to you and it feels like it's, like, clean. Same with the points guy. They're not saying who's the best. What they're saying what they do is they say best on a budget, this is the one we recommend.

I think it's two things. One, it's like design and copywriting. So it feels like a person is talking to you and it feels like it's, like, clean. Same with the points guy. They're not saying who's the best. What they're saying what they do is they say best on a budget, this is the one we recommend.

24:17

If if price is no no problem, this is the best one period on the market, and then kind of the most common their option is this one. So instead of it being, here's our favorite, and yeah, it's the one we're getting the best kickback on. They kind of give you options of, like, depending on your situation,

If if price is no no problem, this is the best one period on the market, and then kind of the most common their option is this one. So instead of it being, here's our favorite, and yeah, it's the one we're getting the best kickback on. They kind of give you options of, like, depending on your situation,

24:33

we think this is the best in that situation. I feel like for some reason, that changes the and then it's like, yeah. We we make money. You know, we get an affiliate on each one of these, but, like, they're all equal. We're not saying one is better than the other. We're saying one is better in this So I think that And one of the reasons why I think they do that is I I know the founders of NerdWallet. And if I remember correctly, so nerdwallet dot com slash best dash credit dash card. So that's one page. If I remember correctly, that one so basically, their whole business model was to make that page rank number one in Google if you search best credit card. And for a long time, that one page was making, like, forty million of their, like, forty five million dollars a year in sales. And then they were like, alright. Now we need to do best credit card for students, best credit card for fixed income people, best credit card, for your first time credit card, and they had to diversify because best NerdWallet dot com slash best credit card was getting all of their sales. It was that that And their whole company strategy was write articles that get linked back from, like, you know, usa news dot com or business insider or whatever, get high quality links And then in those articles,

we think this is the best in that situation. I feel like for some reason, that changes the and then it's like, yeah. We we make money. You know, we get an affiliate on each one of these, but, like, they're all equal. We're not saying one is better than the other. We're saying one is better in this So I think that And one of the reasons why I think they do that is I I know the founders of NerdWallet. And if I remember correctly, so nerdwallet dot com slash best dash credit dash card. So that's one page. If I remember correctly, that one so basically, their whole business model was to make that page rank number one in Google if you search best credit card. And for a long time, that one page was making, like, forty million of their, like, forty five million dollars a year in sales. And then they were like, alright. Now we need to do best credit card for students, best credit card for fixed income people, best credit card, for your first time credit card, and they had to diversify because best NerdWallet dot com slash best credit card was getting all of their sales. It was that that And their whole company strategy was write articles that get linked back from, like, you know, usa news dot com or business insider or whatever, get high quality links And then in those articles,

25:39

link back to slash best credit card, it it was a pretty wild strategy, and it worked, or it's working. Yeah. You basically wanna write articles that get linked to your overall domain authority goes up, but then you got one or two money maker pages. And those are those are the pages that you need to be the number one search result for. The way you do it is by creating all this goodwill around the other pages, this sort of SEO goodwill.

link back to slash best credit card, it it was a pretty wild strategy, and it worked, or it's working. Yeah. You basically wanna write articles that get linked to your overall domain authority goes up, but then you got one or two money maker pages. And those are those are the pages that you need to be the number one search result for. The way you do it is by creating all this goodwill around the other pages, this sort of SEO goodwill.

26:00

So

So

26:01

I think you would think that ShoreForm video is hard to monetize that's not what you're monetizing. You're not monetizing the ShoreTel video. You're monetizing the trust.

I think you would think that ShoreForm video is hard to monetize that's not what you're monetizing. You're not monetizing the ShoreTel video. You're monetizing the trust.

26:09

So today,

So today,

26:11

Who is both the most trusted

Who is both the most trusted

26:14

voice

voice

26:15

in science and supplements and

in science and supplements and

26:17

the man most likely

the man most likely

26:20

To be in Sam's fantasies?

To be in Sam's fantasies?

26:22

Yeah. My husband, Andrew Hebermann? Exactly.

Yeah. My husband, Andrew Hebermann? Exactly.

26:26

Yeah. And as a what do they call them? My my Huberman husbands something like that. Yeah.

Yeah. And as a what do they call them? My my Huberman husbands something like that. Yeah.

26:31

What what did they say? So I I posted a shirtless picture of him, and he's, like, and I and I was, like,

What what did they say? So I I posted a shirtless picture of him, and he's, like, and I and I was, like,

26:37

people were like, what did they say there? I'm Huber... I'm Hueber's man.

people were like, what did they say there? I'm Huber... I'm Hueber's man.

26:42

Yeah, he he

Yeah, he he

26:43

posted his first shirtless video the other day. And,

posted his first shirtless video the other day. And,

26:47

men around the world were gasping. Clear the calendar, honey.

men around the world were gasping. Clear the calendar, honey.

26:52

Yeah. Alright. So Huberman makes money through his ads and his podcast, but Remember when Rob Dyrdick was on the pod, and he was talking about momentous protein. And he's like, yeah, momentous was kinda dead in the water. We thought we had made the best cleanest protein, but really wasn't going anywhere. And then we did a deal with Andrew Huberman. And we were, like, how much did you pay him? And he goes,

Yeah. Alright. So Huberman makes money through his ads and his podcast, but Remember when Rob Dyrdick was on the pod, and he was talking about momentous protein. And he's like, yeah, momentous was kinda dead in the water. We thought we had made the best cleanest protein, but really wasn't going anywhere. And then we did a deal with Andrew Huberman. And we were, like, how much did you pay him? And he goes,

27:11

I don't know. Whatever it was. It wasn't enough.

I don't know. Whatever it was. It wasn't enough.

27:15

And he was just, like, laughing at, like, how crazy that that was. So, you know, I think the business model here is you build trust for a couple years. And then you come out with your own branded supplement. Right? So you wanna be in the supplements game. You don't wanna be in your whole premise, though, of finding

And he was just, like, laughing at, like, how crazy that that was. So, you know, I think the business model here is you build trust for a couple years. And then you come out with your own branded supplement. Right? So you wanna be in the supplements game. You don't wanna be in your whole premise, though, of finding

27:31

the most trusted

the most trusted

27:33

No. No. No. No. No. You you are the most trusted. You build the trust by say and then finally you say, look,

No. No. No. No. No. You you are the most trusted. You build the trust by say and then finally you say, look,

27:38

I've had it with these companies.

I've had it with these companies.

27:40

I've had it with these. I am just gonna make the one that I wish existed, the one that is truly clean. That is gonna hold the up utmost standard. Right? Derek, from more plates, more dates. That's exactly what he did. Somebody like Jessica Alba with honest company kinda did the same thing. She builds up a bunch of fame and trust in one area, but then she comes out with the honest company. And she's like, this is gonna be the honest brand, the product I wanna give to my kids. Which, by the way, I buy momentous protein in part because I trust Rob and Rob was involved. And I buy VPN, which is, Nick Bare, you know, the

I've had it with these. I am just gonna make the one that I wish existed, the one that is truly clean. That is gonna hold the up utmost standard. Right? Derek, from more plates, more dates. That's exactly what he did. Somebody like Jessica Alba with honest company kinda did the same thing. She builds up a bunch of fame and trust in one area, but then she comes out with the honest company. And she's like, this is gonna be the honest brand, the product I wanna give to my kids. Which, by the way, I buy momentous protein in part because I trust Rob and Rob was involved. And I buy VPN, which is, Nick Bare, you know, the

28:11

jacked guy who runs fast. I was like, well, these guys both seem trustworthy. I'll buy stuff. So I spend all my money with them. Right. Because what else do you have to go on? You you have nothing else to go on. This packaging or that packaging. Right? Like, what else do you have to go on besides

jacked guy who runs fast. I was like, well, these guys both seem trustworthy. I'll buy stuff. So I spend all my money with them. Right. Because what else do you have to go on? You you have nothing else to go on. This packaging or that packaging. Right? Like, what else do you have to go on besides

28:25

the words of somebody you trust. And so I think that's the way you do this ultimately is you,

the words of somebody you trust. And so I think that's the way you do this ultimately is you,

28:31

you ultimately build your own supplement franchise around this more like the honest company. But I think first for a couple years, you're just becoming the most viral trusted source when it comes to the truth about x. And you gotta pick things that are gonna be very shareable,

you ultimately build your own supplement franchise around this more like the honest company. But I think first for a couple years, you're just becoming the most viral trusted source when it comes to the truth about x. And you gotta pick things that are gonna be very shareable,

28:47

as well as, you you know, you know,

as well as, you you know, you know,

28:51

establish your authority in that niche to be able to I'm I'm the most knowledgeable trusted source when it comes to what should I be taking? By the way, we've talked about the Eat This, Not That category.

establish your authority in that niche to be able to I'm I'm the most knowledgeable trusted source when it comes to what should I be taking? By the way, we've talked about the Eat This, Not That category.

29:01

And

And

29:02

we we loved it. I think we talked about it a year and a half or two years ago. We love to eat this, not that category. It's the best. I would love that. When did you say that? Because I remember talking about Flap City because that's his thing. Right? Eat this, not that. He was doing we I I mentioned it maybe a year ago, but I really hadn't, like, fully wrapped my head around it. So eat this, not that, was a line of books.

we we loved it. I think we talked about it a year and a half or two years ago. We love to eat this, not that category. It's the best. I would love that. When did you say that? Because I remember talking about Flap City because that's his thing. Right? Eat this, not that. He was doing we I I mentioned it maybe a year ago, but I really hadn't, like, fully wrapped my head around it. So eat this, not that, was a line of books.

29:21

I remember buying at Barnes and Noble, like, I don't even know how to say it. How do you say I used to call them Barnes and Noble.

I remember buying at Barnes and Noble, like, I don't even know how to say it. How do you say I used to call them Barnes and Noble.

29:27

I remember buying it at Barnes and Noble

I remember buying it at Barnes and Noble

29:29

years ago when I was, like, in fourth grade. It was Eat This, Not That, and it would just show a picture of Doritos, and then it would show an alternative, and then it would explain why. It was a massive hit for a book series. And I remember buying, like, all of them.

years ago when I was, like, in fourth grade. It was Eat This, Not That, and it would just show a picture of Doritos, and then it would show an alternative, and then it would explain why. It was a massive hit for a book series. And I remember buying, like, all of them.

29:42

And I think we said we're, like, fine for a book, but this has to be beyond that. And we talked about it. I think with Steph two years ago, Yes. Yes. So I think this is a a clear, like, content niche that could turn into a pretty monster business.

And I think we said we're, like, fine for a book, but this has to be beyond that. And we talked about it. I think with Steph two years ago, Yes. Yes. So I think this is a a clear, like, content niche that could turn into a pretty monster business.

29:55

And there's a bunch of different there's a bunch of different angles depending on who you are. Derek, for more plates and more dates, obviously, hits the Gymbro market. But then Flavv City hits the, like, mom shop, Costco shopper market, and you should just keep there's there's a lot more niches than that. The New York Times did this article the other day, or a few weeks ago, and it was my guru is better than your guru, and they talked about how people, like you and I, you know, you you and I are team Huberman, but then there's this other group whose team Peter Atilla, and then there's this other one whose team Peter Like, my father-in-law loves this guy named Mark, Mark Heinemann or something like that.

And there's a bunch of different there's a bunch of different angles depending on who you are. Derek, for more plates and more dates, obviously, hits the Gymbro market. But then Flavv City hits the, like, mom shop, Costco shopper market, and you should just keep there's there's a lot more niches than that. The New York Times did this article the other day, or a few weeks ago, and it was my guru is better than your guru, and they talked about how people, like you and I, you know, you you and I are team Huberman, but then there's this other group whose team Peter Atilla, and then there's this other one whose team Peter Like, my father-in-law loves this guy named Mark, Mark Heinemann or something like that.

30:29

And it's like, well, my guru said this, And it's just crazy how we find these guys that we stick to. And whatever they say, we don't know like, I can't tell you entirely

And it's like, well, my guru said this, And it's just crazy how we find these guys that we stick to. And whatever they say, we don't know like, I can't tell you entirely

30:40

why Hebrewman suggests x, y, and z, but I know he suggested

why Hebrewman suggests x, y, and z, but I know he suggested

30:43

that. And I will go to bat and fight other people

that. And I will go to bat and fight other people

30:47

who's they're a guru who said x, y, and z. And I don't even know why. I just know that I trust the answer. That's my guy. And I thought it was really interesting how it is turning in to be something like that. Have you ever heard this explanation of why gossip exists evolutionarily?

who's they're a guru who said x, y, and z. And I don't even know why. I just know that I trust the answer. That's my guy. And I thought it was really interesting how it is turning in to be something like that. Have you ever heard this explanation of why gossip exists evolutionarily?

31:01

No. Sort of nerdy, but it's it's kinda fascinating. So

No. Sort of nerdy, but it's it's kinda fascinating. So

31:05

Everything has,

Everything has,

31:06

a value. Right? Like, even, like, what we consider negative emotions, like, fear. Why does fear have value? Well,

a value. Right? Like, even, like, what we consider negative emotions, like, fear. Why does fear have value? Well,

31:11

you know, if you're a hunter gatherer and there's a lion, you know, fear or paranoia

you know, if you're a hunter gatherer and there's a lion, you know, fear or paranoia

31:16

can be a very useful survival

can be a very useful survival

31:18

tool. And and you need it to be super fearful and paranoid at a certain period of time. Maybe less so today, but we can see why that's evolutionarily baked in. But that that applies to everything. And so gossip is a good example. Gossip. If you just talk to most people gossip, negative thing. Right? Shouldn't do it bad, you know, poor form. It's, it's sort of a lowly thing to do.

tool. And and you need it to be super fearful and paranoid at a certain period of time. Maybe less so today, but we can see why that's evolutionarily baked in. But that that applies to everything. And so gossip is a good example. Gossip. If you just talk to most people gossip, negative thing. Right? Shouldn't do it bad, you know, poor form. It's, it's sort of a lowly thing to do.

31:39

And, actually, gossip is extremely useful. So you think about

And, actually, gossip is extremely useful. So you think about

31:44

humans live in tribes,

humans live in tribes,

31:46

and we're in this society. Well, it's impossible

and we're in this society. Well, it's impossible

31:48

for me to know one by one with each person about their

for me to know one by one with each person about their

31:53

character and their reputation myself through only firsthand experiences.

character and their reputation myself through only firsthand experiences.

31:57

And so how does a tribe function? Well, gossip is actually a necessary thing. I should know that if this person is untrustworthy, because rumors should spread so that the tribe as a whole becomes almost immune to this charlatan.

And so how does a tribe function? Well, gossip is actually a necessary thing. I should know that if this person is untrustworthy, because rumors should spread so that the tribe as a whole becomes almost immune to this charlatan.

32:09

Through gossip. And I don't have to myself go and have a firsthand bad experience. So in that way, gossip has saved me from getting my, you know, my hand burned off the on the stove many times. And so I kinda feel like the the same thing exists where

Through gossip. And I don't have to myself go and have a firsthand bad experience. So in that way, gossip has saved me from getting my, you know, my hand burned off the on the stove many times. And so I kinda feel like the the same thing exists where

32:22

it's sort of silly in a way to, you just trust these online influencers, these gurus, Don't you know they're just trying to sell you something?

it's sort of silly in a way to, you just trust these online influencers, these gurus, Don't you know they're just trying to sell you something?

32:30

Well, yeah. And there's there's some amount of that. But at the same time, what am I gonna do? Go test all my supplements myself?

Well, yeah. And there's there's some amount of that. But at the same time, what am I gonna do? Go test all my supplements myself?

32:36

Like, the inefficiency that would be brought in, if I didn't, trust these people, what am I gonna go read all the white papers myself about clinical studies?

Like, the inefficiency that would be brought in, if I didn't, trust these people, what am I gonna go read all the white papers myself about clinical studies?

32:44

No. I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna we're all gonna outsource that task

No. I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna we're all gonna outsource that task

32:49

to somebody, and we're gonna trust them until they burn our trust, and then we're gonna move on to the next like, ever almost like as a tribe, it is the efficient way to do things even though it's kinda seen as this low IQ move. It's actually not a low IQ move. It is the, like, sort of, like, game theory optimal move to trust people or to trust gossip in certain situations

to somebody, and we're gonna trust them until they burn our trust, and then we're gonna move on to the next like, ever almost like as a tribe, it is the efficient way to do things even though it's kinda seen as this low IQ move. It's actually not a low IQ move. It is the, like, sort of, like, game theory optimal move to trust people or to trust gossip in certain situations

33:08

where you're not gonna wanna do the firsthand work yourself. Look, if George Fordman tells me what grill is best for my bratwurst, I listen to George. He looks like he eats a lot of bratwurst. No. I get it. Where,

where you're not gonna wanna do the firsthand work yourself. Look, if George Fordman tells me what grill is best for my bratwurst, I listen to George. He looks like he eats a lot of bratwurst. No. I get it. Where,

33:19

did you just go and read a book on gossiping? Where'd you get this? I heard this a long time ago, and, you know, my brain was just connecting the dots just now. I wanna tell you about another health company.

did you just go and read a book on gossiping? Where'd you get this? I heard this a long time ago, and, you know, my brain was just connecting the dots just now. I wanna tell you about another health company.

33:29

That's related to all this. But

That's related to all this. But

33:32

before you do, we have a quick segment. It's called

before you do, we have a quick segment. It's called

33:35

thrill of the shill.

thrill of the shill.

33:37

And so it's a time where we're each gonna take a turn. Your turn is is this time to promote whatever we want, but It's to thrill the show because you're gonna show something,

And so it's a time where we're each gonna take a turn. Your turn is is this time to promote whatever we want, but It's to thrill the show because you're gonna show something,

33:47

but you're gonna thrill me a little bit.

but you're gonna thrill me a little bit.

33:50

So about

So about

33:52

eight months ago, you invested in a company called Sheppard.

eight months ago, you invested in a company called Sheppard.

33:55

Yeah. You sent me a graph. I get updates every once in a while. I try not to get too much information because I don't ever wanna reveal something I'm to reveal. But you sent me a graph. Things are going

Yeah. You sent me a graph. I get updates every once in a while. I try not to get too much information because I don't ever wanna reveal something I'm to reveal. But you sent me a graph. Things are going

34:04

more than good. I think I think it's

more than good. I think I think it's

34:07

you could say how many times it's multiplied. But now is your sixty second thrilled the show moment.

you could say how many times it's multiplied. But now is your sixty second thrilled the show moment.

34:12

Oh, amazing. Oh, the pressure is on to thrill with this show. Listen, the way that I'm gonna make this thrilling is I'm gonna share a little info. Alright? Share a little info. Not about the business and the internal numbers necessarily, but about what's working. So I can what I can say, high level

Oh, amazing. Oh, the pressure is on to thrill with this show. Listen, the way that I'm gonna make this thrilling is I'm gonna share a little info. Alright? Share a little info. Not about the business and the internal numbers necessarily, but about what's working. So I can what I can say, high level

34:27

We, the business What's the company where we joined? You gotta say the company's called Shepard. And what they do is they basically make it easy to hire. So I was using them to hire my e commerce company because I wanted to hire more people, but I didn't have the budget. So I was like, alright. Shepard has talent in the Philippines, in LatAm, so, like, we needed a Shopify developer.

We, the business What's the company where we joined? You gotta say the company's called Shepard. And what they do is they basically make it easy to hire. So I was using them to hire my e commerce company because I wanted to hire more people, but I didn't have the budget. So I was like, alright. Shepard has talent in the Philippines, in LatAm, so, like, we needed a Shopify developer.

34:44

Alright. I can either pay an agent expensive agency or hire some guy, but I found a guy for twenty five hundred a month who's awesome. And I did the same thing with customer support, and I did the same thing with all a bunch of these roles.

Alright. I can either pay an agent expensive agency or hire some guy, but I found a guy for twenty five hundred a month who's awesome. And I did the same thing with customer support, and I did the same thing with all a bunch of these roles.

34:53

And so I was using them, and I was like, this is a great business, and I'm gonna buy into it. So I bought into it. And

And so I was using them, and I was like, this is a great business, and I'm gonna buy into it. So I bought into it. And

34:59

since then, the business have basically tripled, So we've tripled the business in eight months. And the business was already doing well to begin with. So that was kind of like way exceeded expectations. Now what actually worked? Well, when I joined, I thought, alright.

since then, the business have basically tripled, So we've tripled the business in eight months. And the business was already doing well to begin with. So that was kind of like way exceeded expectations. Now what actually worked? Well, when I joined, I thought, alright.

35:13

Always, I'm coming in hot. I got ideas.

Always, I'm coming in hot. I got ideas.

35:15

I don't know if you've heard. I got a business podcast. I think I know a thing or two about business. Why don't you listen to my ideas? And I had all these, like, exotic ways that I thought we could, you know, make things better.

I don't know if you've heard. I got a business podcast. I think I know a thing or two about business. Why don't you listen to my ideas? And I had all these, like, exotic ways that I thought we could, you know, make things better.

35:26

And the reality was that the the big lesson, the big takeaway here was

And the reality was that the the big lesson, the big takeaway here was

35:31

a lesson that I had heard early on in the podcast. There was a guy who came on this podcast. I don't remember his name, but he made He has a bag come to peak design. I got his his first name. Sorry. But it peak design, and I was like, dude, you sell, like, eighty million dollars worth of this, like, camera bag. What the hell, man? Like, what's your What was your growth act? What's your secret? And he's like, oh, dude, I used to listen to all these business groups. They talk about this, like, advanced planning and, like, know, like, long, long term thinking and super strategic stuff, he goes, to me, business is the six inches right in front of your face.

a lesson that I had heard early on in the podcast. There was a guy who came on this podcast. I don't remember his name, but he made He has a bag come to peak design. I got his his first name. Sorry. But it peak design, and I was like, dude, you sell, like, eighty million dollars worth of this, like, camera bag. What the hell, man? Like, what's your What was your growth act? What's your secret? And he's like, oh, dude, I used to listen to all these business groups. They talk about this, like, advanced planning and, like, know, like, long, long term thinking and super strategic stuff, he goes, to me, business is the six inches right in front of your face.

36:00

And I was like, what? And I was like, this is also the speech for many given Sunday. And he's like, yes. Business is the six inches in front of your face, and you just gotta keep knocking out the six inches. And so When we were talking about shepard, it was like, alright. Well,

And I was like, what? And I was like, this is also the speech for many given Sunday. And he's like, yes. Business is the six inches in front of your face, and you just gotta keep knocking out the six inches. And so When we were talking about shepard, it was like, alright. Well,

36:13

you know, cool ideas, Sean, but, like, what's the six inches right in front of our face?

you know, cool ideas, Sean, but, like, what's the six inches right in front of our face?

36:17

And,

And,

36:18

we basically did one thing. One thing that really, really worked.

we basically did one thing. One thing that really, really worked.

36:22

And the one thing that really worked that

And the one thing that really worked that

36:24

was

was

36:25

not expected for me was they just did a very simple analysis. They go,

not expected for me was they just did a very simple analysis. They go,

36:30

how do we get more of our best companies customers and less of our worst customers? Which I think in exercise, anybody should do. Like, did you ever do this with either advertisers at the hustle or, like, for Hampton? Like, did you ever define, like, buck buck it out, like, are the best customers who are the worst customers? Because the worst customers take up eighty percent of your time. Basically, what happens is you get in this habit of where yours, like, I'll take any amount. I'll take any customer and take any money, whatever. I'll just do whatever. And then you get all these shit people, and then you're like, oh my god. This sucks. Like, this guy much time, and I don't even make that much money from them. I have to learn who do I fire and who who's who who do I go after instead?

how do we get more of our best companies customers and less of our worst customers? Which I think in exercise, anybody should do. Like, did you ever do this with either advertisers at the hustle or, like, for Hampton? Like, did you ever define, like, buck buck it out, like, are the best customers who are the worst customers? Because the worst customers take up eighty percent of your time. Basically, what happens is you get in this habit of where yours, like, I'll take any amount. I'll take any customer and take any money, whatever. I'll just do whatever. And then you get all these shit people, and then you're like, oh my god. This sucks. Like, this guy much time, and I don't even make that much money from them. I have to learn who do I fire and who who's who who do I go after instead?

37:06

And what most people do is they do it at the beginning, which I think is the wrong move because at the beginning, you don't really know, and you do need to be just a little bit desperate and kinda brute force things. But there's a point where you gotta check-in. Like, you know, if at nine months in, you haven't checked in, do this check-in, which is basically draw a little piece of paper and write our top, you know, ten to twenty percent of customers and our bottom ten to twenty percent of customers. Bottom is, like, drag out your time, lowest profit,

And what most people do is they do it at the beginning, which I think is the wrong move because at the beginning, you don't really know, and you do need to be just a little bit desperate and kinda brute force things. But there's a point where you gotta check-in. Like, you know, if at nine months in, you haven't checked in, do this check-in, which is basically draw a little piece of paper and write our top, you know, ten to twenty percent of customers and our bottom ten to twenty percent of customers. Bottom is, like, drag out your time, lowest profit,

37:29

you know, like most headache, most support required. And then the top is the opposite. And so we did this little exercise. And the thing we realized was We thought the business was people hiring virtual assistance because that was the most common

you know, like most headache, most support required. And then the top is the opposite. And so we did this little exercise. And the thing we realized was We thought the business was people hiring virtual assistance because that was the most common

37:40

thing people would come in for. Right? You come in, you need a VA just to do some tasks, or maybe it's a personal assistant for you or travel travel booking, meeting scheduling, that stuff. And it does do that. That's fine. But then we were yo, who's this group of customers that they hire twice as much as everybody else?

thing people would come in for. Right? You come in, you need a VA just to do some tasks, or maybe it's a personal assistant for you or travel travel booking, meeting scheduling, that stuff. And it does do that. That's fine. But then we were yo, who's this group of customers that they hire twice as much as everybody else?

37:56

And

And

37:57

the, like, LTV, the lifetime value of these customers is also, like, you know, forty, fifty percent higher to who was it. And it was people who needed bookkeepers.

the, like, LTV, the lifetime value of these customers is also, like, you know, forty, fifty percent higher to who was it. And it was people who needed bookkeepers.

38:05

I was like, what? And they're like, yeah, bookkeepers. And they're like, you know, the reason we didn't see it is because it's all concentrated in certain spikes. So, basically, bookkeepers, everybody hires them after tax season.

I was like, what? And they're like, yeah, bookkeepers. And they're like, you know, the reason we didn't see it is because it's all concentrated in certain spikes. So, basically, bookkeepers, everybody hires them after tax season.

38:16

And it's, like, you go through the pain of tax season and then you're, Alright. Never again. Am I gonna feel that?

And it's, like, you go through the pain of tax season and then you're, Alright. Never again. Am I gonna feel that?

38:22

And so you're like, companies will basically hire a bookkeeper. Like, dude, it was such a mess. Such a time suck this year. We just need a bookkeeper.

And so you're like, companies will basically hire a bookkeeper. Like, dude, it was such a mess. Such a time suck this year. We just need a bookkeeper.

38:29

And we're, like, a small business. We don't need, like, a fancy bookkeeper. Let's hire an overseas bookkeeper. And so they they do that. Or accounting firms or anybody who is a tax tax company They need more bookkeepers or their bookkeeping firm. They need more bookkeepers. And so they would hire they would hire lots of the same talent. That talent is priced a little bit more, so there's more profit on that hire. And so anyways, we just by identifying one little thing, but there was, like, three things like that that we did. Those were the, like, tweaks that weren't very sexy.

And we're, like, a small business. We don't need, like, a fancy bookkeeper. Let's hire an overseas bookkeeper. And so they they do that. Or accounting firms or anybody who is a tax tax company They need more bookkeepers or their bookkeeping firm. They need more bookkeepers. And so they would hire they would hire lots of the same talent. That talent is priced a little bit more, so there's more profit on that hire. And so anyways, we just by identifying one little thing, but there was, like, three things like that that we did. Those were the, like, tweaks that weren't very sexy.

38:57

That made a big difference. And so, kinda, that's my little my my thrill of the show today is to to remind you, go do that little eighty twenty exercise on best and worst customers once you're, like, I don't know, about right around a year into the business, because it will refocus you in a good way. You gotta give the URL.

That made a big difference. And so, kinda, that's my little my my thrill of the show today is to to remind you, go do that little eighty twenty exercise on best and worst customers once you're, like, I don't know, about right around a year into the business, because it will refocus you in a good way. You gotta give the URL.

39:13

Oh, yeah. So go to support shepherd dot com. It whatever you need to hire for, whether it's bookkeepers, virtual assistants, developers, designers,

Oh, yeah. So go to support shepherd dot com. It whatever you need to hire for, whether it's bookkeepers, virtual assistants, developers, designers,

39:19

they got you know, basically, they go find the top one percent of talent in these countries. Got boots on the ground there, like, literally interviewing people. And then you can go find the elite talent there for basically

they got you know, basically, they go find the top one percent of talent in these countries. Got boots on the ground there, like, literally interviewing people. And then you can go find the elite talent there for basically

39:30

eighty percent less than if you hire people in the States. Alright. That's the thrill to chill. That's pretty good. Pretty good first thrill of the chill.

eighty percent less than if you hire people in the States. Alright. That's the thrill to chill. That's pretty good. Pretty good first thrill of the chill.

39:37

Yeah. I I was thrilled.

Yeah. I I was thrilled.

39:39

Alright. So

Alright. So

39:41

do another one. So I got,

do another one. So I got,

39:44

I got one thing for you. So did you see Trunk tweeted this out? And I found this kinda interesting. So he tweeted out about this Chinese quibi. Did you ever see this tweet? No. But is it working?

I got one thing for you. So did you see Trunk tweeted this out? And I found this kinda interesting. So he tweeted out about this Chinese quibi. Did you ever see this tweet? No. But is it working?

39:55

So,

So,

39:56

yeah, I think it is, which is the funny part. So Is it Chinese as in in China or for Chinese American but Chinese content?

yeah, I think it is, which is the funny part. So Is it Chinese as in in China or for Chinese American but Chinese content?

40:05

It's Chinese like TikTok is Chinese. It's made by a Chinese company, but it's at the top of the US charts. It's a company called Real Short. Real Short. It's called Real Short.

It's Chinese like TikTok is Chinese. It's made by a Chinese company, but it's at the top of the US charts. It's a company called Real Short. Real Short. It's called Real Short.

40:15

So, basically, here's what he says.

So, basically, here's what he says.

40:17

It's bite sized English scripted video content. So it's like quibi, but instead of paying for Hollywood hitters, it's cheesy, degrade soap operas slash Hallmark films. The shows are all about affairs, scandals, marital intrigue, and absurd plots. For example,

It's bite sized English scripted video content. So it's like quibi, but instead of paying for Hollywood hitters, it's cheesy, degrade soap operas slash Hallmark films. The shows are all about affairs, scandals, marital intrigue, and absurd plots. For example,

40:32

son in law's revenge.

son in law's revenge.

40:34

I'm getting married without you, or never divorce a secret billionaire, Arris. Let me just pause here.

I'm getting married without you, or never divorce a secret billionaire, Arris. Let me just pause here.

40:42

I'm in on real short. Okay? That was all I needed to hear. I this is this smells like a winner to me. Alright. So

I'm in on real short. Okay? That was all I needed to hear. I this is this smells like a winner to me. Alright. So

40:49

so I I like this general concept. Short video that's scripted versus just like people's, you know, TikToks.

so I I like this general concept. Short video that's scripted versus just like people's, you know, TikToks.

40:56

But it's like

But it's like

40:58

junk food. It's junk food content.

junk food. It's junk food content.

41:01

It's, it's, like, you know, Mori Povich, Hallmark, film. Like, you know, it's just stuff that, like, it's not high brow It just appeals to people. People are gen you know, people have to turn their head to to look at this stuff. It's like Hallmark. Right?

It's, it's, like, you know, Mori Povich, Hallmark, film. Like, you know, it's just stuff that, like, it's not high brow It just appeals to people. People are gen you know, people have to turn their head to to look at this stuff. It's like Hallmark. Right?

41:14

So he goes, a show typically fifty episodes, each episode's only ninety to a hundred twenty seconds each.

So he goes, a show typically fifty episodes, each episode's only ninety to a hundred twenty seconds each.

41:19

They started off by adapting a bunch of Chinese romance, like, kind of So Barbara's for Western audiences.

They started off by adapting a bunch of Chinese romance, like, kind of So Barbara's for Western audiences.

41:26

It's free to watch, but you watch ads, to unlock more episodes, or you could pay coins to unlock them faster.

It's free to watch, but you watch ads, to unlock more episodes, or you could pay coins to unlock them faster.

41:32

Tekrunch estimates that this app has been downloaded eleven million times already across iOS and Android and generated over twenty two million dollars in revenue since August twenty twenty two. So twenty two million dollars in year one.

Tekrunch estimates that this app has been downloaded eleven million times already across iOS and Android and generated over twenty two million dollars in revenue since August twenty twenty two. So twenty two million dollars in year one.

41:45

Not bad.

Not bad.

41:46

It's owned by this Chinese company, COL group,

It's owned by this Chinese company, COL group,

41:49

And they're expanding their audience because the shows were so kind of, like, addictive and, like, you know,

And they're expanding their audience because the shows were so kind of, like, addictive and, like, you know,

41:55

bad that they were banned in China. So where do you go? America, the Las Vegas of the world, where anything goes. And so they brought it here,

bad that they were banned in China. So where do you go? America, the Las Vegas of the world, where anything goes. And so they brought it here,

42:04

pretty crazy. And so so don't you what do you think of this?

pretty crazy. And so so don't you what do you think of this?

42:08

I'm it's this is insane to me. So the actors and actresses, they're white people. So is it white is it, like, are they appealing

I'm it's this is insane to me. So the actors and actresses, they're white people. So is it white is it, like, are they appealing

42:16

to American agents. Four Americans.

to American agents. Four Americans.

42:18

It's like everything else, made in China, made four Americans. So who's who

It's like everything else, made in China, made four Americans. So who's who

42:23

who's buying? I mean, So this is just bothering me in my mind. So you know Hallmark, you know, Hallmark, like, you know, the cars and channel. Familiar? Yeah. So that that company still does about five billion in revenue. Think it's a family owned business. So it's still like a huge thing for the Hallmark. Is it the shops plus the TV or are they separate businesses?

who's buying? I mean, So this is just bothering me in my mind. So you know Hallmark, you know, Hallmark, like, you know, the cars and channel. Familiar? Yeah. So that that company still does about five billion in revenue. Think it's a family owned business. So it's still like a huge thing for the Hallmark. Is it the shops plus the TV or are they separate businesses?

42:40

It's,

It's,

42:42

so the whole company does five billion in sales.

so the whole company does five billion in sales.

42:45

But I think a significant amount of their revenue is not from cards. I think it's from the the the channel. So it says worldwide Hallmark has twenty seven thousand employees.

But I think a significant amount of their revenue is not from cards. I think it's from the the the channel. So it says worldwide Hallmark has twenty seven thousand employees.

42:56

Holy crap.

Holy crap.

42:59

So and and Hallmark channel is, like, a big line of their business, which I think they sold part of it to, Liberty Media.

So and and Hallmark channel is, like, a big line of their business, which I think they sold part of it to, Liberty Media.

43:06

And so It it's like a huge company still. And I think it's it's family owned based out of Missouri.

And so It it's like a huge company still. And I think it's it's family owned based out of Missouri.

43:13

Yeah. Yeah. That's great. Okay. So Hallmark's great. So you're in.

Yeah. Yeah. That's great. Okay. So Hallmark's great. So you're in.

43:17

It just it's telling me you're in. So

It just it's telling me you're in. So

43:20

a few years ago, I I've told this before,

a few years ago, I I've told this before,

43:23

my friend Ramon and I ran a test where

my friend Ramon and I ran a test where

43:26

we created this book called,

we created this book called,

43:29

captivating Claire.

captivating Claire.

43:31

I think that's what it was, was it called captivating Claire? And basically Ramon ran a soap opera website.

I think that's what it was, was it called captivating Claire? And basically Ramon ran a soap opera website.

43:37

And he had this guy on his staff that loved to write short stories, and they were erotic short stories.

And he had this guy on his staff that loved to write short stories, and they were erotic short stories.

43:44

And what we did was we created a WordPress blog, a a WordPress blog, and I think we called it short but romantic

And what we did was we created a WordPress blog, a a WordPress blog, and I think we called it short but romantic

43:50

dot com.

dot com.

43:52

And, basically,

And, basically,

43:53

over the weekend, we he wrote a story on a Friday. On Friday night, the WordPress blog was made. And at the very bottom of the WordPress blog, it was basically just one page of a blog post, and it said,

over the weekend, we he wrote a story on a Friday. On Friday night, the WordPress blog was made. And at the very bottom of the WordPress blog, it was basically just one page of a blog post, and it said,

44:05

we hope you enjoyed this first iteration of of captivating Claire from short but for short but romantic, if you wanna see part two, here's a PayPal link. It's ten dollars a month. Sign up and we will mail you the part two of the story next week when it comes out. And we used fiber, and we got a narrator to do it. This whole project took

we hope you enjoyed this first iteration of of captivating Claire from short but for short but romantic, if you wanna see part two, here's a PayPal link. It's ten dollars a month. Sign up and we will mail you the part two of the story next week when it comes out. And we used fiber, and we got a narrator to do it. This whole project took

44:25

four hundred dollars. We drove traffic for it the next day on Saturday. We had, like, three hundred dollars in sales.

four hundred dollars. We drove traffic for it the next day on Saturday. We had, like, three hundred dollars in sales.

44:32

And we were, like, Holy crap. And if you look up the blog, you might have to use web archive to do it. But because I think we took it down or the domain expired. I remember reading it. If you look at the blog and you go to the comment section. You'll see these people were obsessed with this. They were like, oh my god, cleared at this. I can't wait to read part two. And it was mind boggling. And then we were on Sunday, we were like,

And we were, like, Holy crap. And if you look up the blog, you might have to use web archive to do it. But because I think we took it down or the domain expired. I remember reading it. If you look at the blog and you go to the comment section. You'll see these people were obsessed with this. They were like, oh my god, cleared at this. I can't wait to read part two. And it was mind boggling. And then we were on Sunday, we were like,

44:54

We don't really wanna be in this business. Like, this doesn't really fit our interest.

We don't really wanna be in this business. Like, this doesn't really fit our interest.

44:59

I think he should still should have done it. But he he was going to. He he Ramon was gonna do this business. We we both invested in him. He was about to do this business, then one of his other businesses kinda took off. So that that Yeah. Dogims took off. But he was, like, really dead set on this. And I was like, I don't know. It seems like it could be pretty great. And this real short is proof.

I think he should still should have done it. But he he was going to. He he Ramon was gonna do this business. We we both invested in him. He was about to do this business, then one of his other businesses kinda took off. So that that Yeah. Dogims took off. But he was, like, really dead set on this. And I was like, I don't know. It seems like it could be pretty great. And this real short is proof.

45:18

That that that that that that idea, I think, was on to something. It's it's I was amazed at young women and what they wanted to buy. Being you were

That that that that that that idea, I think, was on to something. It's it's I was amazed at young women and what they wanted to buy. Being you were

45:27

undoubtedly.

undoubtedly.

45:29

You know,

You know,

45:30

we're trying hard with this channel. We go every every week. We work on this channel. We have We have YouTube and it's growing. We're doing we're doing great. Small and mighty, we've been climbing up the charts. And in about a year, we got to about three hundred fifty thousand subscribers. And when we really knock it out of the park with a great episode, we might get few hundred thousand views.

we're trying hard with this channel. We go every every week. We work on this channel. We have We have YouTube and it's growing. We're doing we're doing great. Small and mighty, we've been climbing up the charts. And in about a year, we got to about three hundred fifty thousand subscribers. And when we really knock it out of the park with a great episode, we might get few hundred thousand views.

45:49

Well, just go look at real short on YouTube. So somebody started uploading

Well, just go look at real short on YouTube. So somebody started uploading

45:53

the real short episodes, but, like, the, like, episodes one through twenty together. So real short romance,

the real short episodes, but, like, the, like, episodes one through twenty together. So real short romance,

46:00

Three hundred thirty thousand subscribers. They posted a video, like, two months ago, and it has, you know, it's it's a double life of my billionaire husband. Three point seven million views. You'll look at the comments. It's exactly what you're talking about. Christine Joy says, I hope there will be more video from these two. The chemistry they have, heart emoji,

Three hundred thirty thousand subscribers. They posted a video, like, two months ago, and it has, you know, it's it's a double life of my billionaire husband. Three point seven million views. You'll look at the comments. It's exactly what you're talking about. Christine Joy says, I hope there will be more video from these two. The chemistry they have, heart emoji,

46:17

prayer emoji, Dude, and they're not even optimized. They have a real short,

prayer emoji, Dude, and they're not even optimized. They have a real short,

46:22

watermark on them, and it's vertical video. Yeah. Exactly. And another person's, you know, Jolyn Bongo nine six nine nine six says, oh, I watched this on Facebook real, and I got hooked by it. I love the story and the cast. Good job guys. I can't wait for the next episodes. And there are thousands of comments.

watermark on them, and it's vertical video. Yeah. Exactly. And another person's, you know, Jolyn Bongo nine six nine nine six says, oh, I watched this on Facebook real, and I got hooked by it. I love the story and the cast. Good job guys. I can't wait for the next episodes. And there are thousands of comments.

46:36

In this comment thread that are all about. I can't wait for the next episodes. I love the story line. This is better than Hollywood. Oh my god. I'm hooked. This is working. And this is, you know, what is my take here? So my take is number one, interesting business that I'd never heard of. Good job, Trunk. I had I'd never heard about this. So I'm glad he put this on my radar. Second thing,

In this comment thread that are all about. I can't wait for the next episodes. I love the story line. This is better than Hollywood. Oh my god. I'm hooked. This is working. And this is, you know, what is my take here? So my take is number one, interesting business that I'd never heard of. Good job, Trunk. I had I'd never heard about this. So I'm glad he put this on my radar. Second thing,

46:54

The difference between a good idea and a bad idea is just a few small decisions.

The difference between a good idea and a bad idea is just a few small decisions.

46:59

Quibi gets made fun of as he classic

Quibi gets made fun of as he classic

47:02

Silicon Valley idiotic startup. It's like, oh, man. Remember Quibi? It's like a it's like the butt of a joke in Silicon Valley. Yeah, this will be as successful as Quibi.

Silicon Valley idiotic startup. It's like, oh, man. Remember Quibi? It's like a it's like the butt of a joke in Silicon Valley. Yeah, this will be as successful as Quibi.

47:12

Quibi, I think, was the right idea. Small micro content, like, you know, TV shows shrank down. I think can be really successful. The problem was they raised two billion dollars and spent it all on, like, really high production quality stuff that wasn't that juicy and never got people hooked.

Quibi, I think, was the right idea. Small micro content, like, you know, TV shows shrank down. I think can be really successful. The problem was they raised two billion dollars and spent it all on, like, really high production quality stuff that wasn't that juicy and never got people hooked.

47:26

Whereas real short is basically, like, starting with getting people hooked and then figuring out, you know, the rest as it goes.

Whereas real short is basically, like, starting with getting people hooked and then figuring out, you know, the rest as it goes.

47:32

The third thing is the third takeaway is Why do I have so much faith in the Chinese? Like, when I even started to read his tweet, I was like, oh, Chinese companies trying to do Quibi, but better. And I was like, probably gonna work. I would bet more on this random Chinese company that I've never heard of than Jeffrey Katzenberg, the guy who created Quibi, that was, like, the creator of DreamWorks.

The third thing is the third takeaway is Why do I have so much faith in the Chinese? Like, when I even started to read his tweet, I was like, oh, Chinese companies trying to do Quibi, but better. And I was like, probably gonna work. I would bet more on this random Chinese company that I've never heard of than Jeffrey Katzenberg, the guy who created Quibi, that was, like, the creator of DreamWorks.

47:52

And why is that? I don't know. May maybe it's because through my e com brand, I, like, do business with, you know, Chinese companies. And

And why is that? I don't know. May maybe it's because through my e com brand, I, like, do business with, you know, Chinese companies. And

47:58

the way they run their businesses,

the way they run their businesses,

48:00

I mean, like, that's my real MBA is when I talk to, like, the factory owner in China about how he's running his business. And I watch how he moves And they came out here to meet us and we're talking to them. And, you know, just the the way they conduct themselves

I mean, like, that's my real MBA is when I talk to, like, the factory owner in China about how he's running his business. And I watch how he moves And they came out here to meet us and we're talking to them. And, you know, just the the way they conduct themselves

48:13

is awesome. The way they work is awesome. They're like, Level of complexity they can, like, handle is awesome, and it used to just be with manufacturing only.

is awesome. The way they work is awesome. They're like, Level of complexity they can, like, handle is awesome, and it used to just be with manufacturing only.

48:21

And then TikTok came and was a total narrative violation. It was, like, Oh, you think they could just, you know, make cheap plastic toys? No. No. No. Watch this. We'll make the hit social app that's all about cool and culture We'll appeal to the US team better than an American startup could. Now what it is. It's

And then TikTok came and was a total narrative violation. It was, like, Oh, you think they could just, you know, make cheap plastic toys? No. No. No. Watch this. We'll make the hit social app that's all about cool and culture We'll appeal to the US team better than an American startup could. Now what it is. It's

48:38

a lack of ego is what it is. So

a lack of ego is what it is. So

48:40

Quibi was this cool LA company. I think they even reached out to you and I. They're like, you guys wanna make a conference for this. Business law. Business law selected.

Quibi was this cool LA company. I think they even reached out to you and I. They're like, you guys wanna make a conference for this. Business law. Business law selected.

48:47

Yeah. I was like, I I I I don't know, but but not that we're quote cool guys, but we we are based in San Francisco,

Yeah. I was like, I I I I don't know, but but not that we're quote cool guys, but we we are based in San Francisco,

48:54

and we

and we

48:55

lived a on paper what seemed like an interesting life, like, people building startups. Whereas That's insane. If you're gonna spend money on us to start your platform, your platform's gonna fucking fail. Alright? Obviously.

lived a on paper what seemed like an interesting life, like, people building startups. Whereas That's insane. If you're gonna spend money on us to start your platform, your platform's gonna fucking fail. Alright? Obviously.

49:06

We we should not be part of your platform. But they went after, like, cool people. Like, you know, I'm I imagine they have, like, high, like, big time celebrities and shit like that. Whereas,

We we should not be part of your platform. But they went after, like, cool people. Like, you know, I'm I imagine they have, like, high, like, big time celebrities and shit like that. Whereas,

49:15

I think a lot of people in Silicon Valley in LA, I think they do the same thing. You know, if you look at a lot of DDC brands, it's like they spend most of their money on shit branding, some agency that was overpriced with lowercase letters based out of Brooklyn.

I think a lot of people in Silicon Valley in LA, I think they do the same thing. You know, if you look at a lot of DDC brands, it's like they spend most of their money on shit branding, some agency that was overpriced with lowercase letters based out of Brooklyn.

49:27

And in reality, like, this whole middle America, I think, particularly

And in reality, like, this whole middle America, I think, particularly

49:31

since a lot of entrepreneurs in the tech space are young men, they forget that

since a lot of entrepreneurs in the tech space are young men, they forget that

49:37

there's this whole contingency of a hundred and fifty million people who are at home, and they just wanna goof around and watch something like this. And their ego prevents them from creating something that's, quote, low quality, which

there's this whole contingency of a hundred and fifty million people who are at home, and they just wanna goof around and watch something like this. And their ego prevents them from creating something that's, quote, low quality, which

49:49

this fits that bill. You would see this and you're like, this is stupid. No one will watch this. Whereas, someone else who's just like, yeah, dude, I just wanna win. I just wanna do whatever it says. I'm gonna follow the numbers. And I think a lot of people would be embarrassed to create this thing. And I don't think they should be, but I think they feel that way, whereas whoever we're talking about these Chinese folks, they're just like, yeah, but we're just setting out to build a great company. Right. Supply and well, what is their demand for? We could be supply

this fits that bill. You would see this and you're like, this is stupid. No one will watch this. Whereas, someone else who's just like, yeah, dude, I just wanna win. I just wanna do whatever it says. I'm gonna follow the numbers. And I think a lot of people would be embarrassed to create this thing. And I don't think they should be, but I think they feel that way, whereas whoever we're talking about these Chinese folks, they're just like, yeah, but we're just setting out to build a great company. Right. Supply and well, what is their demand for? We could be supply

50:15

versus,

versus,

50:16

you know, we hired, you know, if your company has twenty percent of people, then wear nonprescription glasses. Like, it's you're not gonna make it in this game because you just have too much, you know, sort of like hipster in you that's not actually gonna focus on what the market wants. You're gonna try to sell them what they should want rather than what they actually do want. Someone tagged us in this picture of a Thai restaurant, and it was called Thai Near Me. Thai food near me. Yeah. Thai Thai food near me, where it was clearly someone was just naming the restaurant, you know, triple a locksmith in order to rank high on Yelp. Yeah. And that's that immigrant hustle that I appreciate and I respect. And they actually made their branding cute. It was like a a cute sign, and it was clearly a joke.

you know, we hired, you know, if your company has twenty percent of people, then wear nonprescription glasses. Like, it's you're not gonna make it in this game because you just have too much, you know, sort of like hipster in you that's not actually gonna focus on what the market wants. You're gonna try to sell them what they should want rather than what they actually do want. Someone tagged us in this picture of a Thai restaurant, and it was called Thai Near Me. Thai food near me. Yeah. Thai Thai food near me, where it was clearly someone was just naming the restaurant, you know, triple a locksmith in order to rank high on Yelp. Yeah. And that's that immigrant hustle that I appreciate and I respect. And they actually made their branding cute. It was like a a cute sign, and it was clearly a joke.

50:54

But that is lacking, I think, in a lot of our circles and this app real short.

But that is lacking, I think, in a lot of our circles and this app real short.

51:00

They don't have that.

They don't have that.

51:01

Yeah. It's Thaiu near me. They they've got they they're just a they own a store and they're like, oh, it looks like people buy a lot of vapes. Looks like we're in the vape business. You know what I mean?

Yeah. It's Thaiu near me. They they've got they they're just a they own a store and they're like, oh, it looks like people buy a lot of vapes. Looks like we're in the vape business. You know what I mean?

51:12

And I appreciate that.

And I appreciate that.

51:14

Like, man, these kids love this great flavored

Like, man, these kids love this great flavored

51:17

smoke. Right.

smoke. Right.

51:19

We're gonna start selling more of that. Even though I don't always agree with it, I appreciate the mentality.

We're gonna start selling more of that. Even though I don't always agree with it, I appreciate the mentality.

51:24

So you you weren't there for this one, but I did an episode with Jess Mod heard heard it again. Yeah. I started watching this morning. I love Jessma.

So you you weren't there for this one, but I did an episode with Jess Mod heard heard it again. Yeah. I started watching this morning. I love Jessma.

51:31

Do you know her besides, like, the episode? Like, had you met her? Because she's friends. Well, so Jess Mah was,

Do you know her besides, like, the episode? Like, had you met her? Because she's friends. Well, so Jess Mah was,

51:36

I I was gonna ask you all about her. But Jess Mah, I know her as, like, she was the prodigy. So she was, like, on the cover magazines at the age of nineteen or twenty for starting Indinero and accounting software. She was, like, the the person on the cover of ink before right? The month before me was Elizabeth Holmes.

I I was gonna ask you all about her. But Jess Mah, I know her as, like, she was the prodigy. So she was, like, on the cover magazines at the age of nineteen or twenty for starting Indinero and accounting software. She was, like, the the person on the cover of ink before right? The month before me was Elizabeth Holmes.

51:50

Yeah. And so she was, like, be a person for a minute But then over the last, like, six years, she's went silent, which in my head, that either means you've done something bad, or you're just quietly killing it. And you just don't wanna talk about it. And it sounds like the second one was definitely the answer. And Indinero

Yeah. And so she was, like, be a person for a minute But then over the last, like, six years, she's went silent, which in my head, that either means you've done something bad, or you're just quietly killing it. And you just don't wanna talk about it. And it sounds like the second one was definitely the answer. And Indinero

52:06

has been crushing it, and she's been taking the profits or money from that and doing more things. Is that right? Yeah. Pretty much. Exactly. So she was like, alright. Indinero was a good business. It's not gonna be a monster business. She had, like, a crazy life experience where her boyfriend died suddenly, and then she was like, just kinda depressed. Didn't wanna even go into work. And was just like, alright. What do I wanna do with my life? Like, you know, reminder, life is short. Nothing is guaranteed. But she didn't say how big Indinero was though. Did she? It's overnight it's nine figures and it's profitable is what she had said. So it's over a hundred million in revenue profitable.

has been crushing it, and she's been taking the profits or money from that and doing more things. Is that right? Yeah. Pretty much. Exactly. So she was like, alright. Indinero was a good business. It's not gonna be a monster business. She had, like, a crazy life experience where her boyfriend died suddenly, and then she was like, just kinda depressed. Didn't wanna even go into work. And was just like, alright. What do I wanna do with my life? Like, you know, reminder, life is short. Nothing is guaranteed. But she didn't say how big Indinero was though. Did she? It's overnight it's nine figures and it's profitable is what she had said. So it's over a hundred million in revenue profitable.

52:37

So she was like,

So she was like,

52:38

Alright. I don't wanna run this company anymore. I'm hiring somebody to run that, and I'm gonna do whatever's most interesting to me. And so her bets were kinda like she wanted to, like she's like, well,

Alright. I don't wanna run this company anymore. I'm hiring somebody to run that, and I'm gonna do whatever's most interesting to me. And so her bets were kinda like she wanted to, like she's like, well,

52:47

You know, like, what am I, like, what if I wasn't afraid of failure? What would I go do? So she had a couple things in the episode. I think we're gonna get lost in there. But the big thing that I took away that I went and, like, basically after every episode, I send a voice memo to Ben about, like, here's the three things that, like, really, like, that that are my notes from this episode.

You know, like, what am I, like, what if I wasn't afraid of failure? What would I go do? So she had a couple things in the episode. I think we're gonna get lost in there. But the big thing that I took away that I went and, like, basically after every episode, I send a voice memo to Ben about, like, here's the three things that, like, really, like, that that are my notes from this episode.

53:05

I keep my notebook right here. But basically, the thing I wrote, I was like, she had, like, three or four golden questions. One of them was, what would I do if I wasn't afraid to fail?

I keep my notebook right here. But basically, the thing I wrote, I was like, she had, like, three or four golden questions. One of them was, what would I do if I wasn't afraid to fail?

53:14

The other one was, what was the other one? Wasn't it, like, what would I do if I was a billionaire? Yeah. If I had, you know, if I had five hundred million dollars in the bank, what would I do with my time? And she had another one which was how will I deal with being an absolute beginner?

The other one was, what was the other one? Wasn't it, like, what would I do if I was a billionaire? Yeah. If I had, you know, if I had five hundred million dollars in the bank, what would I do with my time? And she had another one which was how will I deal with being an absolute beginner?

53:28

Because if I'm gonna go do something new, By definition, I'm gonna be a beginner and suck at it, and I know I'm scared of that feeling. And I know that feeling is uncomfortable, especially now that I have a little bit of an ego I've been on the cover of magazines. People think highly of me, How will I how will I deal with being at the bottom again?

Because if I'm gonna go do something new, By definition, I'm gonna be a beginner and suck at it, and I know I'm scared of that feeling. And I know that feeling is uncomfortable, especially now that I have a little bit of an ego I've been on the cover of magazines. People think highly of me, How will I how will I deal with being at the bottom again?

53:43

And just asking that sort of acknowledges that, and then it kinda takes the power away

And just asking that sort of acknowledges that, and then it kinda takes the power away

53:47

from, like, that insecurity.

from, like, that insecurity.

53:49

I thought she had some, like, golden questions. And then one of them was, like, she's, like, yeah, like, because I was, I was, like, dude, you're building these, like, biotech companies. You're telling me about these technologies that I can barely even understand. You even understand these? Like, is this your background? Are you just a science genius? And she was like, no. Like, I was a C student

I thought she had some, like, golden questions. And then one of them was, like, she's, like, yeah, like, because I was, I was, like, dude, you're building these, like, biotech companies. You're telling me about these technologies that I can barely even understand. You even understand these? Like, is this your background? Are you just a science genius? And she was like, no. Like, I was a C student

54:05

in biology. Like, you know, now I have a biology company that's valued over a hundred million dollars. Like, there's some irony there. And I was like, you know, so what is it? Are you just, like, making it till you make it? Or did you, like, get really good, really fast. She's like, well, no. Like, I partnered with people who are experts, and I do the stuff that they're not experts at, like, commercializing

in biology. Like, you know, now I have a biology company that's valued over a hundred million dollars. Like, there's some irony there. And I was like, you know, so what is it? Are you just, like, making it till you make it? Or did you, like, get really good, really fast. She's like, well, no. Like, I partnered with people who are experts, and I do the stuff that they're not experts at, like, commercializing

54:21

it. She's like, but also

it. She's like, but also

54:22

I just started as a beginner. She's like, I literally hired a biology tutor. And I started watching podcasts and TED talks, and I would go meet the people, and I would ask them, like, a thousand questions, and I would go to after they answer those, and I would ask them ten more questions after that. I would just keep doing that until, like, I felt like I had a handle on things. It's amazing. And I was like, oh, well, it's simple. When you say it like that, And so similarly,

I just started as a beginner. She's like, I literally hired a biology tutor. And I started watching podcasts and TED talks, and I would go meet the people, and I would ask them, like, a thousand questions, and I would go to after they answer those, and I would ask them ten more questions after that. I would just keep doing that until, like, I felt like I had a handle on things. It's amazing. And I was like, oh, well, it's simple. When you say it like that, And so similarly,

54:42

I don't know about you, but every day I go on Twitter,

I don't know about you, but every day I go on Twitter,

54:45

and I see AI magic in my feed.

and I see AI magic in my feed.

54:47

And

And

54:48

AI is the best

AI is the best

54:51

magic trick, like, awesome cool demo.

magic trick, like, awesome cool demo.

54:54

Product that I've ever seen in my life is just like an endless supply of awesome cool ten second demos. I don't know if those will all become big companies, but they're amazing demos. I needed a tutor thing. So I did a two thing. I was like, oh, yeah. She just hired somebody who because I was like, either I'm gonna drop everything that I'm doing and, like, go learn about AI from as a beginner.

Product that I've ever seen in my life is just like an endless supply of awesome cool ten second demos. I don't know if those will all become big companies, but they're amazing demos. I needed a tutor thing. So I did a two thing. I was like, oh, yeah. She just hired somebody who because I was like, either I'm gonna drop everything that I'm doing and, like, go learn about AI from as a beginner.

55:14

Or I'm just gonna sip this one out because I don't know. It's just this fast moving thing that the kids are doing, and I I guess I'll just kind of catch up later. That doesn't feel right either. I was like, why don't I do this? I was like, I put out a tweet that was like, well,

Or I'm just gonna sip this one out because I don't know. It's just this fast moving thing that the kids are doing, and I I guess I'll just kind of catch up later. That doesn't feel right either. I was like, why don't I do this? I was like, I put out a tweet that was like, well,

55:25

if you're somebody who plays around with all these tools knows how to use them, I will pay you five hundred dollars an hour. I'll pay you whatever. Five hundred plus an hour. So just sit with me a couple times a week and just show me. Just teach me. About these tools to save me the kinda, like, ten hours of fumbling around I would be doing myself. How many emails did you get?

if you're somebody who plays around with all these tools knows how to use them, I will pay you five hundred dollars an hour. I'll pay you whatever. Five hundred plus an hour. So just sit with me a couple times a week and just show me. Just teach me. About these tools to save me the kinda, like, ten hours of fumbling around I would be doing myself. How many emails did you get?

55:44

I got, like, over a hundred replies from, like, interest like, really interesting people. So it's gonna be hard to kinda pick. I might pick a couple people, actually, instead of just one because there's so many good ones. And I might publish this. So I'm thinking about creating a side channel. This is, like, Sean's playground, my little YouTube channel, while I'll actually just publish the call so that even if somebody's not paying five hundred dollars an hour for this, get the benefit from it.

I got, like, over a hundred replies from, like, interest like, really interesting people. So it's gonna be hard to kinda pick. I might pick a couple people, actually, instead of just one because there's so many good ones. And I might publish this. So I'm thinking about creating a side channel. This is, like, Sean's playground, my little YouTube channel, while I'll actually just publish the call so that even if somebody's not paying five hundred dollars an hour for this, get the benefit from it.

56:04

Because I I don't need to hold this close to my vest or anything.

Because I I don't need to hold this close to my vest or anything.

56:09

But I think this is great. And I give myself a little pat on the back, but I really wanna say it out loud because there's probably a lot of things like this. Like, I know you're taking a finance course right now. And that's, like, the same version that's, like, the same thing. Like,

But I think this is great. And I give myself a little pat on the back, but I really wanna say it out loud because there's probably a lot of things like this. Like, I know you're taking a finance course right now. And that's, like, the same version that's, like, the same thing. Like,

56:21

like, don't be afraid to go be a beginner. You're supposed to be Sampar, business podcast, sold a business,

like, don't be afraid to go be a beginner. You're supposed to be Sampar, business podcast, sold a business,

56:26

You know, you you're supposed to be the guy who knows a bunch of stuff, and you you came out and you're like, I feel like an idiot when it comes to finance, like corporate finance. I just really don't know what the hell I'm doing. What's the best course in this place in this thing I could take in your I think you spent, like, five grand on a course. Right? How's that gonna be? It's called, the four day NBA with Keith Cunningham.

You know, you you're supposed to be the guy who knows a bunch of stuff, and you you came out and you're like, I feel like an idiot when it comes to finance, like corporate finance. I just really don't know what the hell I'm doing. What's the best course in this place in this thing I could take in your I think you spent, like, five grand on a course. Right? How's that gonna be? It's called, the four day NBA with Keith Cunningham.

56:44

And, yeah, I'm trying to learn how to do all the stuff. It coincidentally,

And, yeah, I'm trying to learn how to do all the stuff. It coincidentally,

56:47

someone did a video some billionaire guy did a video, and he's like, don't get an MBA. Just go take this course. I don't a huge endorsement. I like, I saw it when you said that with the website website, website sucks. And I was like, this sucks. Why did Sam do this? And there was a clip, and I was like, okay. That's now two people that said this is awesome. I will now go do this thing. It's a great course. It's a great course. And I think I think my opinion

someone did a video some billionaire guy did a video, and he's like, don't get an MBA. Just go take this course. I don't a huge endorsement. I like, I saw it when you said that with the website website, website sucks. And I was like, this sucks. Why did Sam do this? And there was a clip, and I was like, okay. That's now two people that said this is awesome. I will now go do this thing. It's a great course. It's a great course. And I think I think my opinion

57:09

How do I say this without sounding like a huge douche? Once I got a little bit of success,

How do I say this without sounding like a huge douche? Once I got a little bit of success,

57:14

I got way less nervous

I got way less nervous

57:16

about hiring people to teach me how to do things.

about hiring people to teach me how to do things.

57:20

Additionally,

Additionally,

57:22

I mean, I we talked about a ton. My body tutors or in hiring a fitness coach, hiring coaches and things like that kinda changed my perspective of of the whole quote coaching industry, which I used to think was bullshit.

I mean, I we talked about a ton. My body tutors or in hiring a fitness coach, hiring coaches and things like that kinda changed my perspective of of the whole quote coaching industry, which I used to think was bullshit.

57:32

No. Like, teaching having people teach me how to do stuff has kinda changed my life a little bit.

No. Like, teaching having people teach me how to do stuff has kinda changed my life a little bit.

57:38

And this course is awesome. I have nothing to do with it. I I posted that link and people thought that I I was like, no. I I just think it's cool.

And this course is awesome. I have nothing to do with it. I I posted that link and people thought that I I was like, no. I I just think it's cool.

57:46

It it's changed my life, to be honest. Like, going back to school and, like, learning and having people just teach me things, I think it's gonna be really smart for you to do it this way. I also think that if you promote it, it will,

It it's changed my life, to be honest. Like, going back to school and, like, learning and having people just teach me things, I think it's gonna be really smart for you to do it this way. I also think that if you promote it, it will,

57:59

pay for itself. So that's always fun.

pay for itself. So that's always fun.

58:01

But I think you're gonna have a life changing next two months if you follow through with this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm already, you know, the the ROI

But I think you're gonna have a life changing next two months if you follow through with this. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm already, you know, the the ROI

58:09

is is is baked in in into this because because of it. But I guess, like, I wanna say it because

is is is baked in in into this because because of it. But I guess, like, I wanna say it because

58:14

I wouldn't have thought to do this unless Jess Moss, she said she just said that thing in passing. Like, I hired a biology tutor, and I my mind, I was like, tutors or something that end when you're twenty years old. There is no more tutoring. After that end, I was like, why? Why is that the case?

I wouldn't have thought to do this unless Jess Moss, she said she just said that thing in passing. Like, I hired a biology tutor, and I my mind, I was like, tutors or something that end when you're twenty years old. There is no more tutoring. After that end, I was like, why? Why is that the case?

58:27

Hold on. There's no rule about that.

Hold on. There's no rule about that.

58:30

And there's probably other people out there who kind of could do something similar. So anyways, I sent it out loud mostly because

And there's probably other people out there who kind of could do something similar. So anyways, I sent it out loud mostly because

58:35

if you're

if you're

58:36

well, the one percent of people that

well, the one percent of people that

58:39

hadn't really thought about this, but could benefit from it, like, do it. Do you know really what I wanna do is what I wanted to do was I wanted to take a, like, one of those two week MBA courses at columbia or Stanford or something like that. That was that's my goal for next year to do it. And I went and I looked at, like, the list of topics that they're gonna cover. And I was like, I don't don't even know what those topics mean. So I gotta go take this online one person pair for this in person one because I was so embarrassed to to, like, this. And I used to make fun of these people that would put, like, Stanford,

hadn't really thought about this, but could benefit from it, like, do it. Do you know really what I wanna do is what I wanted to do was I wanted to take a, like, one of those two week MBA courses at columbia or Stanford or something like that. That was that's my goal for next year to do it. And I went and I looked at, like, the list of topics that they're gonna cover. And I was like, I don't don't even know what those topics mean. So I gotta go take this online one person pair for this in person one because I was so embarrassed to to, like, this. And I used to make fun of these people that would put, like, Stanford,

59:05

you know, like, two week course.

you know, like, two week course.

59:07

One warning, though. So I took a a similar, like, a finance thing last year, I think. And it was good. There's nothing like, it was a good course. There's nothing wrong with the course. What you did it in person?

One warning, though. So I took a a similar, like, a finance thing last year, I think. And it was good. There's nothing like, it was a good course. There's nothing wrong with the course. What you did it in person?

59:17

No. It's a online online thing. But I intended it and I paid attention. I was like, if I'm doing this, I'm gonna do it. Where'd you do it at? What's what's cool? It was on Maven. So it was a Maven finance course.

No. It's a online online thing. But I intended it and I paid attention. I was like, if I'm doing this, I'm gonna do it. Where'd you do it at? What's what's cool? It was on Maven. So it was a Maven finance course.

59:27

And so it was a really good course. There was one thing that I'll say out loud, which is before you go drop thousands of dollars because of Sam Parr said this course is great, make sure that, like, to me, the way the analogy is

And so it was a really good course. There was one thing that I'll say out loud, which is before you go drop thousands of dollars because of Sam Parr said this course is great, make sure that, like, to me, the way the analogy is

59:38

Like, these are all

Like, these are all

59:39

clothes on a hanger, but you need a hook to hang things on. And, like, if you don't have a hook, the hook would be, like, a business you're currently running or, like,

clothes on a hanger, but you need a hook to hang things on. And, like, if you don't have a hook, the hook would be, like, a business you're currently running or, like,

59:49

a a place you can go apply these learnings,

a a place you can go apply these learnings,

59:52

then I think they can be kind of, like, fancy procrastination

then I think they can be kind of, like, fancy procrastination

59:56

or just, like, not worth the the time of the money. So you have to have enough

or just, like, not worth the the time of the money. So you have to have enough

01:00:00

either battle scars or, like, a place to go apply these that's actually gonna be, like, relevant for you. Otherwise,

either battle scars or, like, a place to go apply these that's actually gonna be, like, relevant for you. Otherwise,

01:00:07

it's very easy to just, like, intellectually sit there and be, like, yeah, cool.

it's very easy to just, like, intellectually sit there and be, like, yeah, cool.

01:00:11

Alright. Well, I hope I keep that in mind one day when this becomes relevant. Like, you're better off, like, building the business and then learning the things just in time that you need to know you need to, like, when you need to know them versus trying to learn everything in advance and then be like, now I'm prepared to go do the sport of business. Well, the reason I'm doing it is because when I was selling the hustle, we like, this whole thing came at the end called networking capital.

Alright. Well, I hope I keep that in mind one day when this becomes relevant. Like, you're better off, like, building the business and then learning the things just in time that you need to know you need to, like, when you need to know them versus trying to learn everything in advance and then be like, now I'm prepared to go do the sport of business. Well, the reason I'm doing it is because when I was selling the hustle, we like, this whole thing came at the end called networking capital.

01:00:32

And I I was like, I just don't know what this means. Right. And I optimized my business in one way But then I I didn't know what this term was. And I there was many things that I could have done differently that would have helped. And, like, I felt so emasculated

And I I was like, I just don't know what this means. Right. And I optimized my business in one way But then I I didn't know what this term was. And I there was many things that I could have done differently that would have helped. And, like, I felt so emasculated

01:00:45

in stupid when these people were talking to me about networking capital. And I'm like, I just can't figure this out when you're explaining it to me. I don't wanna experience that pain again. And, also,

in stupid when these people were talking to me about networking capital. And I'm like, I just can't figure this out when you're explaining it to me. I don't wanna experience that pain again. And, also,

01:00:54

I'm getting my balance sheet and my income statement and cash flow statements every month from my accountant, but I'm like, I I don't know if this is good. Your account typically tell you facts. And I'm like, but I don't know how to interpret it. I need to know how to interpret this to spot strengths and weaknesses.

I'm getting my balance sheet and my income statement and cash flow statements every month from my accountant, but I'm like, I I don't know if this is good. Your account typically tell you facts. And I'm like, but I don't know how to interpret it. I need to know how to interpret this to spot strengths and weaknesses.

01:01:07

And I just remembered when I was selling my company of not I'm like, well, I know I kinda know how to make the money, but I don't know what don't know how to optimize any of these equations, and I don't know what they mean. And I felt so stupid during that.

And I just remembered when I was selling my company of not I'm like, well, I know I kinda know how to make the money, but I don't know what don't know how to optimize any of these equations, and I don't know what they mean. And I felt so stupid during that.

01:01:20

It was just so challenging to figure out. Can I tell you one lesson I learned from that thing that was probably the one thing I remember that I didn't know going in?

It was just so challenging to figure out. Can I tell you one lesson I learned from that thing that was probably the one thing I remember that I didn't know going in?

01:01:30

I I just never even thought about, which was the course, I think it's called good business, bad business, or something like that. And,

I I just never even thought about, which was the course, I think it's called good business, bad business, or something like that. And,

01:01:36

one of the things it's talking about when you differentiate between a good and bad business financially is your reinvestment runway. So I don't know if you've ever heard this term or thought about this, but it's essentially the idea that every business will say, you know, hundred dollars comes in and you get twenty dollars out out at the bottom Right? You have twenty dollar net profit.

one of the things it's talking about when you differentiate between a good and bad business financially is your reinvestment runway. So I don't know if you've ever heard this term or thought about this, but it's essentially the idea that every business will say, you know, hundred dollars comes in and you get twenty dollars out out at the bottom Right? You have twenty dollar net profit.

01:01:53

What do you do with that net profit? So

What do you do with that net profit? So

01:01:56

idiots like us, you know, I think you probably ran your business there, what I did. I don't know. It just sits in the bank account. I don't even think about it really. Like,

idiots like us, you know, I think you probably ran your business there, what I did. I don't know. It just sits in the bank account. I don't even think about it really. Like,

01:02:03

it's there.

it's there.

01:02:04

I I hope one day to take this out, or maybe I'll I'll I'll use it to spend if we need if we have some expense or rainy day. I don't know. Let's think I won't even think about it. And then you, start to realize okay, the best business is they can either reinvest into the business itself.

I I hope one day to take this out, or maybe I'll I'll I'll use it to spend if we need if we have some expense or rainy day. I don't know. Let's think I won't even think about it. And then you, start to realize okay, the best business is they can either reinvest into the business itself.

01:02:18

So that, like, when a dollar profit comes out, you can reinvest it back to the top and get more than another another dollar out.

So that, like, when a dollar profit comes out, you can reinvest it back to the top and get more than another another dollar out.

01:02:24

And so he broke down, like, some of Warren Buffett's businesses that had no reinvestment

And so he broke down, like, some of Warren Buffett's businesses that had no reinvestment

01:02:29

potential. So, like, basically, profit comes out, and that's why Buffet would take it to the headquarters, the hold co, and just say,

potential. So, like, basically, profit comes out, and that's why Buffet would take it to the headquarters, the hold co, and just say,

01:02:35

you the the best optimization he could do was when he bought a business, he's like, you're reinvesting capital poorly.

you the the best optimization he could do was when he bought a business, he's like, you're reinvesting capital poorly.

01:02:41

I'll take that money. I'll reinvest it in a whole different business.

I'll take that money. I'll reinvest it in a whole different business.

01:02:45

And you will be a little cash cow, but I'm not gonna keep investing back for more organic growth into this business. Which in our case would be like

And you will be a little cash cow, but I'm not gonna keep investing back for more organic growth into this business. Which in our case would be like

01:02:53

would be like,

would be like,

01:02:54

maybe like a course business or maybe even this podcast, like, this podcast, like, grows, like, mostly organically. We don't need to spend more money in order to grow. Great. Spending more money is not gonna create more money out of this business. The best thing we could do is take the profits from this bad business and invest it in a better business that actually can do that. And so, you know, that that was in the what he talks about is, like, every business over time, like, you start out being able to reinvest, but you hit a certain point where a certain dollar threshold where now you can't reinvest more than that into this business at an efficient rate. So you have to identify that point And no, and then you could judge the business based on that. So similarly, you know, the best business like constellation software or Berkshire, they're famous for basically taking profits from one one bad business, you know, bad defined as, like, it's a normal cash cup business, but you're not investing it back in that one. You're investing it to buy another one of those. And you invest that to buy another one of those. And that way, that's the whole point of this book. Good profit or profit first.

maybe like a course business or maybe even this podcast, like, this podcast, like, grows, like, mostly organically. We don't need to spend more money in order to grow. Great. Spending more money is not gonna create more money out of this business. The best thing we could do is take the profits from this bad business and invest it in a better business that actually can do that. And so, you know, that that was in the what he talks about is, like, every business over time, like, you start out being able to reinvest, but you hit a certain point where a certain dollar threshold where now you can't reinvest more than that into this business at an efficient rate. So you have to identify that point And no, and then you could judge the business based on that. So similarly, you know, the best business like constellation software or Berkshire, they're famous for basically taking profits from one one bad business, you know, bad defined as, like, it's a normal cash cup business, but you're not investing it back in that one. You're investing it to buy another one of those. And you invest that to buy another one of those. And that way, that's the whole point of this book. Good profit or profit first.

01:03:50

Andrew recommended. I read it this weekend. Recommended the same thing was take money out of the business at least and put it into a different bank account and then redeploy it into the your fast growing business if it if it warrants it. Or if you have a business that can take the reinvestment, then you know that that business is actually even better than you than it looks on paper because it has this extra capability that most businesses don't have.

Andrew recommended. I read it this weekend. Recommended the same thing was take money out of the business at least and put it into a different bank account and then redeploy it into the your fast growing business if it if it warrants it. Or if you have a business that can take the reinvestment, then you know that that business is actually even better than you than it looks on paper because it has this extra capability that most businesses don't have.

01:04:12

Which is what Cole punches All of us sounds pretty beginner for, like, anybody in, like, private

Which is what Cole punches All of us sounds pretty beginner for, like, anybody in, like, private

01:04:16

equity or whatever. That's not where we came from. Right? Like, we're basically, like, dorks on the internet, we then start creating internet companies, and then, like, try to get rich off internet companies. And now, you know, like, we're starting to wrap our heads around, like, a lot of the, like, you know, one one zero one type of concept. Which, by the way, I think it's better to go that route. I think it's harder to start things from scratch and then learn how to optimize eventually

equity or whatever. That's not where we came from. Right? Like, we're basically, like, dorks on the internet, we then start creating internet companies, and then, like, try to get rich off internet companies. And now, you know, like, we're starting to wrap our heads around, like, a lot of the, like, you know, one one zero one type of concept. Which, by the way, I think it's better to go that route. I think it's harder to start things from scratch and then learn how to optimize eventually

01:04:35

versus

versus

01:04:36

you optimize you're a good optimizer, but you don't know how to start things from scratch. Like, just creating a widget that someone wants, I think, is more challenging.

you optimize you're a good optimizer, but you don't know how to start things from scratch. Like, just creating a widget that someone wants, I think, is more challenging.

01:04:42

A hundred percent. Plus it makes me feel good that that's true. But, like, YC did the same thing. He's like, it's gonna be easier for me to take bad ass engineers

A hundred percent. Plus it makes me feel good that that's true. But, like, YC did the same thing. He's like, it's gonna be easier for me to take bad ass engineers

01:04:50

and teach them the basics of fundraising

and teach them the basics of fundraising

01:04:52

at hiring and firing than to take an MBA who knows everything about fundraising and hiring firing, but can't build shit. And that was, like, the core bet of YC was we don't need

at hiring and firing than to take an MBA who knows everything about fundraising and hiring firing, but can't build shit. And that was, like, the core bet of YC was we don't need

01:05:02

start these companies with MBAs. We could start these companies with engineers so we could it's easy to teach them that. It's impossible to teach the other way.

start these companies with MBAs. We could start these companies with engineers so we could it's easy to teach them that. It's impossible to teach the other way.

01:05:08

Yeah. I I and I completely agree with that. And, yeah, it makes me feel better that way. So, therefore, it is true. In summary,

Yeah. I I and I completely agree with that. And, yeah, it makes me feel better that way. So, therefore, it is true. In summary,

01:05:15

we're the best.

we're the best.

01:05:17

Yeah. We bragged a lot in this episode. Maybe we'll have another episode where we'll just make fun of each other.

Yeah. We bragged a lot in this episode. Maybe we'll have another episode where we'll just make fun of each other.

01:05:23

No. The comments will do that for us. Here. Let me move the microphone so you get a good look.

No. The comments will do that for us. Here. Let me move the microphone so you get a good look.

01:05:28

Here's my face. Here's my hair. Here's my body.

Here's my face. Here's my hair. Here's my body.

01:05:31

You can hear my voice. I I I stutter sometimes. What whatever you got. Go ahead. Hit us in the comments.

You can hear my voice. I I I stutter sometimes. What whatever you got. Go ahead. Hit us in the comments.

01:05:36

Alright. That's the pod.

Alright. That's the pod.

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