00:00

Alright. What's up, it's Shaan, and I'm gonna start by reading you a tweet that I did a year ago.

Alright. What's up, it's Shaan, and I'm gonna start by reading you a tweet that I did a year ago.

00:05

It says

It says

00:06

I have a new hero, and her name is Sarah Moore. And the reason that Sarah Moore is my hero and somebody that you've probably never heard of is because Sarah Moore

I have a new hero, and her name is Sarah Moore. And the reason that Sarah Moore is my hero and somebody that you've probably never heard of is because Sarah Moore

00:15

was

was

00:16

somebody who was a student in college

somebody who was a student in college

00:18

that, you know, she's in her young twenties. She has no money, no experience.

that, you know, she's in her young twenties. She has no money, no experience.

00:24

The only thing she owned in her life was her car, a rav4.

The only thing she owned in her life was her car, a rav4.

00:27

And

And

00:28

she hustled

she hustled

00:30

this crazy hustle story of how she basically decided I'm gonna buy a business, even though I got nothing nothing to my name. And she spends a year searching through a hundred thousand businesses, and she finds this niche business called egg cartons dot com.

this crazy hustle story of how she basically decided I'm gonna buy a business, even though I got nothing nothing to my name. And she spends a year searching through a hundred thousand businesses, and she finds this niche business called egg cartons dot com.

00:43

Literally, this guy sells the carton that your eggs come in. And she bought this million, you know, multimillion dollar business with all debt. So she put no money in because she didn't have anybody. And so And then she had grown it a bunch since then. And I just said, I think this is like a twenty million dollar business that this woman bought. And like, wow. What a hustler. So I told this hustle story on the podcast.

Literally, this guy sells the carton that your eggs come in. And she bought this million, you know, multimillion dollar business with all debt. So she put no money in because she didn't have anybody. And so And then she had grown it a bunch since then. And I just said, I think this is like a twenty million dollar business that this woman bought. And like, wow. What a hustler. So I told this hustle story on the podcast.

01:03

And it kinda went viral. It blew up. Nobody ever heard about this story before.

And it kinda went viral. It blew up. Nobody ever heard about this story before.

01:08

She has done no interviews. She has no social media. She was like a ghost. And I honestly, I didn't even know if it was true because it's one of these stories that's too good to be true. Here's this girl who comes from absolutely nothing. Talks about this in the interview. Like, she literally had no parents. She was in and out of jail as a kid. Like, she was just trouble.

She has done no interviews. She has no social media. She was like a ghost. And I honestly, I didn't even know if it was true because it's one of these stories that's too good to be true. Here's this girl who comes from absolutely nothing. Talks about this in the interview. Like, she literally had no parents. She was in and out of jail as a kid. Like, she was just trouble.

01:26

And then she has this turning point in her life that gave me goosebumps,

And then she has this turning point in her life that gave me goosebumps,

01:29

She ends up paying somebody to take the SAT so she gets into college. She hustles her way through college,

She ends up paying somebody to take the SAT so she gets into college. She hustles her way through college,

01:35

finds a way to buy this business.

finds a way to buy this business.

01:37

And it's this amazing success story. And

And it's this amazing success story. And

01:40

two things happen. One, the story kinda went viral. She said that, like, Netflix and others reached out to her after the episode went live. That people started showing up on her doorstep asking them asking her for advice on buying a business. And, like, honestly, it was kinda bad. Like, it was too much. And please don't do that again because like, dude, I'm trying to run a business. I don't even know you. You start telling my story, and this went crazy. And so a year later now, she's like, okay. First, I was kinda like, wow. This is crazy. Then I was kind of annoyed and scared. Like, is this gonna mess up my business? But then as she started to see, you know, the upside of telling her story, she was like, look,

two things happen. One, the story kinda went viral. She said that, like, Netflix and others reached out to her after the episode went live. That people started showing up on her doorstep asking them asking her for advice on buying a business. And, like, honestly, it was kinda bad. Like, it was too much. And please don't do that again because like, dude, I'm trying to run a business. I don't even know you. You start telling my story, and this went crazy. And so a year later now, she's like, okay. First, I was kinda like, wow. This is crazy. Then I was kind of annoyed and scared. Like, is this gonna mess up my business? But then as she started to see, you know, the upside of telling her story, she was like, look,

02:12

I still have no social media. I still do no interviews,

I still have no social media. I still do no interviews,

02:15

but you kind of you were very nice and you told my story. I will agree to come on and do one interview. And so she's like, After this, I'm one and done. I'm gonna come on and I'm gonna lay it all out there. I will tell you everything you wanna know about buying a business, how I did it, what I did, the good and the bad, all the mistakes that I made.

but you kind of you were very nice and you told my story. I will agree to come on and do one interview. And so she's like, After this, I'm one and done. I'm gonna come on and I'm gonna lay it all out there. I will tell you everything you wanna know about buying a business, how I did it, what I did, the good and the bad, all the mistakes that I made.

02:32

I'll tell my kind of the life story part two that's the sort of, you know, made for TVs. It's it's it's unbelievable her life story along the way. She's like, I'm doing one interview, and then that's it. I'm disappearing after that. And

I'll tell my kind of the life story part two that's the sort of, you know, made for TVs. It's it's it's unbelievable her life story along the way. She's like, I'm doing one interview, and then that's it. I'm disappearing after that. And

02:43

she did not disappoint. We just finished the recording.

she did not disappoint. We just finished the recording.

02:46

It's one of my favorite episodes we've ever done. She is somebody that I really admire, and I don't use that term lightly. Like, she is really a hustler, super genuine,

It's one of my favorite episodes we've ever done. She is somebody that I really admire, and I don't use that term lightly. Like, she is really a hustler, super genuine,

02:55

and her stories,

and her stories,

02:57

is frankly incredible. Like, it's not often I have goosebumps during an episode of a podcast.

is frankly incredible. Like, it's not often I have goosebumps during an episode of a podcast.

03:02

So enjoy this episode with Sarah Moore.

So enjoy this episode with Sarah Moore.

03:13

Alright. Today's episode is gonna be all about buying a business rather than starting a business. We usually talk about ideas that you should use to start a business But as you know,

Alright. Today's episode is gonna be all about buying a business rather than starting a business. We usually talk about ideas that you should use to start a business But as you know,

03:22

like, one of our best, friends of the house, Andrew Wilkinson has told us many times, buying a business could be a better path But, how the hell do you actually do it? That is the question, and we're gonna talk to somebody who not only has done it.

like, one of our best, friends of the house, Andrew Wilkinson has told us many times, buying a business could be a better path But, how the hell do you actually do it? That is the question, and we're gonna talk to somebody who not only has done it.

03:36

Not only has done it successfully,

Not only has done it successfully,

03:38

but

but

03:39

has really never told her story. You, Sarah Moore, you are basically not on the internet. Welcome to the internet because

has really never told her story. You, Sarah Moore, you are basically not on the internet. Welcome to the internet because

03:46

I first heard your story,

I first heard your story,

03:48

and then I went googling, and I couldn't find anything. You were a ghost,

and then I went googling, and I couldn't find anything. You were a ghost,

03:52

intentional or unintentional.

intentional or unintentional.

03:54

Very intentional. I'm a very private person, and I'm not a fan of public attention.

Very intentional. I'm a very private person, and I'm not a fan of public attention.

04:00

You kinda blew up my spot, though. So things have changed a bit. Yeah. Sorry about that. So we a long time ago. I don't know what how it was hundreds of episodes ago.

You kinda blew up my spot, though. So things have changed a bit. Yeah. Sorry about that. So we a long time ago. I don't know what how it was hundreds of episodes ago.

04:09

I came on the pod. I said, hey. I got a story for you. I said, I would love to have this person on it as a guest, but if you can't find him on the internet, I said, I think this is a kind of an incredible story. There's this woman who out of college,

I came on the pod. I said, hey. I got a story for you. I said, I would love to have this person on it as a guest, but if you can't find him on the internet, I said, I think this is a kind of an incredible story. There's this woman who out of college,

04:21

bought a

bought a

04:23

most boring sounding business you could think of, egg cartons dot com. And I called you, like, the queen of Queen of Cartons or something like that. And I was like, she's the the Queen of Eggs, and she

most boring sounding business you could think of, egg cartons dot com. And I called you, like, the queen of Queen of Cartons or something like that. And I was like, she's the the Queen of Eggs, and she

04:33

buys this business that some guy had been running for, like, twenty years.

buys this business that some guy had been running for, like, twenty years.

04:37

And,

And,

04:38

she's running it. She's growing it. And I was like, the way she did it with no money down. I was like, her story sounds really interesting. But again, there's literally one

she's running it. She's growing it. And I was like, the way she did it with no money down. I was like, her story sounds really interesting. But again, there's literally one

04:47

like, text interview of you on the whole internet. So then I I did I emailed you and I said, hey, I'd love to have you come on. I don't think I gotta reply or something. But then I sent you a Google doc. And I said, look. You're right. I just have to know. I gotta I I need answers to these questions just for my own personal curiosity. I sent you a Google Doc. I said, just can you just fill this out?

like, text interview of you on the whole internet. So then I I did I emailed you and I said, hey, I'd love to have you come on. I don't think I gotta reply or something. But then I sent you a Google doc. And I said, look. You're right. I just have to know. I gotta I I need answers to these questions just for my own personal curiosity. I sent you a Google Doc. I said, just can you just fill this out?

05:04

And to my surprise, you actually did. And so when I came on the pod and I told your story,

And to my surprise, you actually did. And so when I came on the pod and I told your story,

05:09

suddenly,

suddenly,

05:11

a bunch of people were were

a bunch of people were were

05:12

very interested. You get giving you a lot of attention and, correct me if I'm wrong. Sometimes in not the most nice

very interested. You get giving you a lot of attention and, correct me if I'm wrong. Sometimes in not the most nice

05:19

nice way. It wasn't all good. Is that right?

nice way. It wasn't all good. Is that right?

05:21

That's correct. I've I've come across quite the cast of characters.

That's correct. I've I've come across quite the cast of characters.

05:26

And why do you, what do you think that what do they say to you? Where where how are they finding you and what do they say to you? Some people beg me to talk to them for fifteen minutes. They'll offer someone specifically offered me five hundred dollars for five minutes of my time.

And why do you, what do you think that what do they say to you? Where where how are they finding you and what do they say to you? Some people beg me to talk to them for fifteen minutes. They'll offer someone specifically offered me five hundred dollars for five minutes of my time.

05:39

And it's crazy because I'm so irrelevant most days. I'm out in in Massachusetts.

And it's crazy because I'm so irrelevant most days. I'm out in in Massachusetts.

05:45

So there's not much happening here. I'm kind of under the radar.

So there's not much happening here. I'm kind of under the radar.

05:49

So all of a sudden, I've now gotten a ton of inquiries from people. And a lot of people want specific information.

So all of a sudden, I've now gotten a ton of inquiries from people. And a lot of people want specific information.

05:55

A lot of people or emailing to say, hey, I'm doing this exact thing. How do you get financing? Or can I get your opinion on this business deal? Or I'm about to close. How did you get a bank to actually do your deal without putting much or any money down?

A lot of people or emailing to say, hey, I'm doing this exact thing. How do you get financing? Or can I get your opinion on this business deal? Or I'm about to close. How did you get a bank to actually do your deal without putting much or any money down?

06:11

Right. Right. Well, hopefully, hopefully this podcast tells your story in a good way. Does not create even more,

Right. Right. Well, hopefully, hopefully this podcast tells your story in a good way. Does not create even more,

06:18

people chasing you down because we're just gonna tell all the answers right here so that people had everybody leave Sarah alone after this.

people chasing you down because we're just gonna tell all the answers right here so that people had everybody leave Sarah alone after this.

06:25

Yes. P I'm serious. Please do not contact my business. You can email me or or leave reach out to me on LinkedIn, but please do not contact my business or show up there for that matter. Yeah. Yeah. We've had a couple of those. A few stragglers.

Yes. P I'm serious. Please do not contact my business. You can email me or or leave reach out to me on LinkedIn, but please do not contact my business or show up there for that matter. Yeah. Yeah. We've had a couple of those. A few stragglers.

06:39

There's always a few stragglers. Unfortunately, there's always a few stragglers.

There's always a few stragglers. Unfortunately, there's always a few stragglers.

06:43

It doesn't help that your story is kinda unique because you didn't come from money.

It doesn't help that your story is kinda unique because you didn't come from money.

06:47

And we're gonna talk about that. You didn't know how to do this. It's not like you knew how to do this or you were an expert. You were a total beginner when you started. So that's a piece.

And we're gonna talk about that. You didn't know how to do this. It's not like you knew how to do this or you were an expert. You were a total beginner when you started. So that's a piece.

06:55

Yeah. It's your woman doing this. I think that's more unique.

Yeah. It's your woman doing this. I think that's more unique.

06:59

So there's, like, there's a whole bunch of, like, angles, and then you did it in a kind of a niche that sounds kind of like, you know, like boring businesses have become sexy now. And so you did it in a boring business. And so I think there's a bunch of reasons people are excited. But let's Let's start at the start. So Okay. Let's just start with the high level. What did you actually do? You,

So there's, like, there's a whole bunch of, like, angles, and then you did it in a kind of a niche that sounds kind of like, you know, like boring businesses have become sexy now. And so you did it in a boring business. And so I think there's a bunch of reasons people are excited. But let's Let's start at the start. So Okay. Let's just start with the high level. What did you actually do? You,

07:19

were in school and you decided I wanna buy a business. First, tell us, Why did you decide that? How did you even know that that was a path you could go down? Oh, boy. There's a lot of context here. So but to answer your question in the simplest of of ways, is I was between my first and second year business school, and I was talking to somebody about what they wanted to do afterwards and they mentioned something called a search fund, which is where you essentially can go out and buy some grungy business

were in school and you decided I wanna buy a business. First, tell us, Why did you decide that? How did you even know that that was a path you could go down? Oh, boy. There's a lot of context here. So but to answer your question in the simplest of of ways, is I was between my first and second year business school, and I was talking to somebody about what they wanted to do afterwards and they mentioned something called a search fund, which is where you essentially can go out and buy some grungy business

07:47

and become the CEO, basically overnight without any money or experience.

and become the CEO, basically overnight without any money or experience.

07:53

That was very appealing me.

That was very appealing me.

07:55

You're like, hey, I said that criteria. No money no experience. Absolutely. Brunchy businesses

You're like, hey, I said that criteria. No money no experience. Absolutely. Brunchy businesses

08:00

sign me up

sign me up

08:04

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

08:07

See, most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. I think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. Hubspot,

See, most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. I think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. Hubspot,

08:17

grow better.

grow better.

08:19

And so you hear this idea, and you're like, what was your plan before that? Were you did you have another plan? Or, like, did this replace something? Or you just put it in a in a vacant spot?

And so you hear this idea, and you're like, what was your plan before that? Were you did you have another plan? Or, like, did this replace something? Or you just put it in a in a vacant spot?

08:30

So okay. We'll do a bit of storytelling here. Yeah, please. When when I was in business school, there was a guy I was working on a project with. And he was incredibly responsive, almost annoyingly responsive, kind of one of those. And I asked

So okay. We'll do a bit of storytelling here. Yeah, please. When when I was in business school, there was a guy I was working on a project with. And he was incredibly responsive, almost annoyingly responsive, kind of one of those. And I asked

08:46

How are you so responsive

How are you so responsive

08:48

all the time? And he said Goldman, he's referring to Goldman Sachs. And he said, at Goldman Sachs, There was a rule of fifteen minutes, meaning you had to respond to whatever form you reach out to you in within fifteen minutes, twenty four hours a day, seventies a week. And I said, okay. So what if you're in the shower? Fifteen minutes? Right. What if you're running

all the time? And he said Goldman, he's referring to Goldman Sachs. And he said, at Goldman Sachs, There was a rule of fifteen minutes, meaning you had to respond to whatever form you reach out to you in within fifteen minutes, twenty four hours a day, seventies a week. And I said, okay. So what if you're in the shower? Fifteen minutes? Right. What if you're running

09:10

marathon, fifteen minutes, Christmas day, fifteen minutes. And my favorite, what if your wife is giving birth?

marathon, fifteen minutes, Christmas day, fifteen minutes. And my favorite, what if your wife is giving birth?

09:18

Fifteen fucking minutes.

Fifteen fucking minutes.

09:21

And, I mean, we laugh, but

And, I mean, we laugh, but

09:25

my I worked my ass off to get into biz to even graduate high school I worked my ass off to be frank.

my I worked my ass off to get into biz to even graduate high school I worked my ass off to be frank.

09:31

And I'm thinking you went to an Ivy League undergrad

And I'm thinking you went to an Ivy League undergrad

09:35

You're clearly

You're clearly

09:36

off the charts intelligent.

off the charts intelligent.

09:38

You have this amazing network of people. You come from money. You have everything that I don't

You have this amazing network of people. You come from money. You have everything that I don't

09:45

Why would you choose to essentially sign up to be Frank? Someone else's bitch. Like, I didn't say that to him. Right. But that was my thinking.

Why would you choose to essentially sign up to be Frank? Someone else's bitch. Like, I didn't say that to him. Right. But that was my thinking.

09:54

And so I had no idea what I wanted to do. But up until then, I was at HBS Harvard Business School trying to fit in with all of these people and sort of find my footing. And after that, I'm thinking I don't wanna be like these people. I don't want to do this. I don't wanna be a consultant. I don't wanna be a banker. This is so not me. And if I'm gonna be someone else's bitch, like, that's just not option for me. Right. I'm only gonna be one person's pitch, and that's my own. Yeah. Yeah. That's every entrepreneur ever. There was a guy who Truly.

And so I had no idea what I wanted to do. But up until then, I was at HBS Harvard Business School trying to fit in with all of these people and sort of find my footing. And after that, I'm thinking I don't wanna be like these people. I don't want to do this. I don't wanna be a consultant. I don't wanna be a banker. This is so not me. And if I'm gonna be someone else's bitch, like, that's just not option for me. Right. I'm only gonna be one person's pitch, and that's my own. Yeah. Yeah. That's every entrepreneur ever. There was a guy who Truly.

10:27

There's a guy who we went to college with. He was our next door neighbor in our dorms. Great guy, Sam Sully. And he went to work at, same Goldman or one of these one of these banks. I don't even know what the hell that was. That's just a foreign world to me. I don't know. Sam's gone, and he doesn't, you know, he's busy now. He works eighty hours a week. And he,

There's a guy who we went to college with. He was our next door neighbor in our dorms. Great guy, Sam Sully. And he went to work at, same Goldman or one of these one of these banks. I don't even know what the hell that was. That's just a foreign world to me. I don't know. Sam's gone, and he doesn't, you know, he's busy now. He works eighty hours a week. And he,

10:46

he read our blog. We used to blog about how we were building our company, and we'd be like, yeah. We woke up. We did the we had these calls that we were pitching this guy. Then we went for a hike because we lived in Boulder. We went for a hike in the middle of the day because that was awesome. Then we had an idea on the hike and we came back and did it. And it sounded so sexy in reality. Honestly pretty lame. But, you know, it was like blogging. It was like social media. It's like Instagram back then. You make it look good. And so Sam quits his job and he moves into our our bedroom or moves into our our living room, he lives on our couch. And he's like, I'm gonna do this. I'm like, dude, you're making six figures. You're making zero figures here. And he's like,

he read our blog. We used to blog about how we were building our company, and we'd be like, yeah. We woke up. We did the we had these calls that we were pitching this guy. Then we went for a hike because we lived in Boulder. We went for a hike in the middle of the day because that was awesome. Then we had an idea on the hike and we came back and did it. And it sounded so sexy in reality. Honestly pretty lame. But, you know, it was like blogging. It was like social media. It's like Instagram back then. You make it look good. And so Sam quits his job and he moves into our our bedroom or moves into our our living room, he lives on our couch. And he's like, I'm gonna do this. I'm like, dude, you're making six figures. You're making zero figures here. And he's like,

11:18

And he he's like, yeah, but it's better. And we're we couldn't really understand the culture. And then he sent an email, and we were like, hey, Sam, you said something in this email. I've never heard before.

And he he's like, yeah, but it's better. And we're we couldn't really understand the culture. And then he sent an email, and we were like, hey, Sam, you said something in this email. I've never heard before.

11:27

What you said, hey, can you get that to me ASAP or sooner?

What you said, hey, can you get that to me ASAP or sooner?

11:31

And I was like, hey, what'd it be ASAP or sooner? ASAP means as soon as possible. He's like, oh, that's a banking thing. It's ASAP for sooner. I'm like, what the fuck is sooner than ASAP? And I was like, that's the mentality. I was like, I get it. I get why you quit. I get while you're out of there because ASAP pursuinger is not a way to live. Not at all. And it honestly blows my mind. Again, given the pedigree of these people, You would think you would shoot for the moon year. You would wanna have this freedom in your life, but you're literally choosing a form of enslavement and sleeve met in my opinion. Right. Right. Right. Yeah. Anytime, you know, I think banking consulting, these are often brain drains. The talent is really talented people go there because it's sort of, safe.

And I was like, hey, what'd it be ASAP or sooner? ASAP means as soon as possible. He's like, oh, that's a banking thing. It's ASAP for sooner. I'm like, what the fuck is sooner than ASAP? And I was like, that's the mentality. I was like, I get it. I get why you quit. I get while you're out of there because ASAP pursuinger is not a way to live. Not at all. And it honestly blows my mind. Again, given the pedigree of these people, You would think you would shoot for the moon year. You would wanna have this freedom in your life, but you're literally choosing a form of enslavement and sleeve met in my opinion. Right. Right. Right. Yeah. Anytime, you know, I think banking consulting, these are often brain drains. The talent is really talented people go there because it's sort of, safe.

12:10

And and it's like a well respected path. But if you think about how much how many more cool, interesting things could be built or created if those same talented people went out and and and did more entrepreneurship, but, you know, whatever teach their own. So you hear that. You're like, alright. I'm not gonna do that.

And and it's like a well respected path. But if you think about how much how many more cool, interesting things could be built or created if those same talented people went out and and and did more entrepreneurship, but, you know, whatever teach their own. So you hear that. You're like, alright. I'm not gonna do that.

12:26

And now you're you hear this idea of buying a business. Okay. But where do you start? How do you even know how to start? And we're gonna go into your full story, but, like, the kind of the high school, how you even got to college, which is a crazy story in itself, we're gonna get to there. But first, you hear this idea about buying a business.

And now you're you hear this idea of buying a business. Okay. But where do you start? How do you even know how to start? And we're gonna go into your full story, but, like, the kind of the high school, how you even got to college, which is a crazy story in itself, we're gonna get to there. But first, you hear this idea about buying a business.

12:41

Okay, Sarah. Now what? What do you do?

Okay, Sarah. Now what? What do you do?

12:44

Great question. So I to your point in the beginning, I lacked the ability to evaluate businesses. I had no experience doing that prior to business school. I was in the steel industry.

Great question. So I to your point in the beginning, I lacked the ability to evaluate businesses. I had no experience doing that prior to business school. I was in the steel industry.

12:55

And I thought if I could get a business,

And I thought if I could get a business,

12:59

I was pretty comfortable with the idea that I could run it probably if I tried hard enough, but searching in itself I thought I need to have background in private equity. I have no idea what I'm doing, and people will say, you have a Harvard MBA, but

I was pretty comfortable with the idea that I could run it probably if I tried hard enough, but searching in itself I thought I need to have background in private equity. I have no idea what I'm doing, and people will say, you have a Harvard MBA, but

13:12

Harvard is very corporate. They don't teach you how to look at a corporate commercial window washing business

Harvard is very corporate. They don't teach you how to look at a corporate commercial window washing business

13:19

and evaluate their financials to see if you wanna buy it. Right. They're looking at very complicated financial models, which these are not at all.

and evaluate their financials to see if you wanna buy it. Right. They're looking at very complicated financial models, which these are not at all.

13:29

And so I thought I probably need to go the investor route because there are investors out there that will actually pay you to search. I'm thinking that's incredible.

And so I thought I probably need to go the investor route because there are investors out there that will actually pay you to search. I'm thinking that's incredible.

13:37

Someone's gonna pay me to look for this. And then They're gonna invest. This is amazing.

Someone's gonna pay me to look for this. And then They're gonna invest. This is amazing.

13:43

Look further into it and see that if you were to get an investor to back you, They'll give you a plenty of money. You can live a cushy life. You can do this in a fancy office. You can wine and dine these sellers.

Look further into it and see that if you were to get an investor to back you, They'll give you a plenty of money. You can live a cushy life. You can do this in a fancy office. You can wine and dine these sellers.

13:56

But you have to pay back one and a half times that. And so if they gave me the fifty percent increase, so if they had given me two hundred k to search, I'd have to pay it back three hundred k. So that in and of itself was absolutely ridiculous.

But you have to pay back one and a half times that. And so if they gave me the fifty percent increase, so if they had given me two hundred k to search, I'd have to pay it back three hundred k. So that in and of itself was absolutely ridiculous.

14:11

And so one of my friends actually sat me down and convinced me that if you it's similar to dating, you said. And if you get enough reps in, you cannot

And so one of my friends actually sat me down and convinced me that if you it's similar to dating, you said. And if you get enough reps in, you cannot

14:20

not recognize a good business when you see one.

not recognize a good business when you see one.

14:24

For whatever reason,

For whatever reason,

14:26

I figure I may as well just try and go out my own worst case scenario, literally worst case

I figure I may as well just try and go out my own worst case scenario, literally worst case

14:32

I bring someone in midway. But why not at least give it a go on my own? You see what happens. Right. So what so what did you do? You you decide to go on your own,

I bring someone in midway. But why not at least give it a go on my own? You see what happens. Right. So what so what did you do? You you decide to go on your own,

14:41

How do you go about it? What was your process?

How do you go about it? What was your process?

14:43

Okay. So step one for me, I'm not good with technology, and I didn't have any money. So step one is I'm gonna leverage what I've got around me, which is I'm now at a school with a bunch of smart people. So I had one of my smart friends scrape one of the databases with all the private companies within an hour and a half of my apartment in Boston. That's step one.

Okay. So step one for me, I'm not good with technology, and I didn't have any money. So step one is I'm gonna leverage what I've got around me, which is I'm now at a school with a bunch of smart people. So I had one of my smart friends scrape one of the databases with all the private companies within an hour and a half of my apartment in Boston. That's step one.

15:05

Yeah. You're like you're like my criteria is it's an hour and a half away. Tell me every private business in this area. Truly.

Yeah. You're like you're like my criteria is it's an hour and a half away. Tell me every private business in this area. Truly.

15:12

And the problem is with these databases,

And the problem is with these databases,

15:14

people think, oh, you've got all this great information.

people think, oh, you've got all this great information.

15:17

Not really. The

Not really. The

15:19

we estimated just by looking at some financials we actually knew about that the database was accurate about fifty percent of the time. Accurate meaning the owner's name is correct, the revenue is correct, the employee count, all of those metrics because they're all self reported. Right. So who's actually gonna give you accurate information knowing it could be public?

we estimated just by looking at some financials we actually knew about that the database was accurate about fifty percent of the time. Accurate meaning the owner's name is correct, the revenue is correct, the employee count, all of those metrics because they're all self reported. Right. So who's actually gonna give you accurate information knowing it could be public?

15:40

Right. And so we tried to pair down the list by revenue, but we did it by a multiple of, like, five x, meaning

Right. And so we tried to pair down the list by revenue, but we did it by a multiple of, like, five x, meaning

15:47

say a business. So for instance, the business I'd worked for previously, it said that business did a million dollars in revenue. The business is doing over a hundred million dollars in revenue. Right.

say a business. So for instance, the business I'd worked for previously, it said that business did a million dollars in revenue. The business is doing over a hundred million dollars in revenue. Right.

15:57

It there's all this misinformation, but we tried to narrow it down somewhat. Anything over, I think, a hundred thousand

It there's all this misinformation, but we tried to narrow it down somewhat. Anything over, I think, a hundred thousand

16:04

or I'm sorry, a hundred million dollars We took off the list.

or I'm sorry, a hundred million dollars We took off the list.

16:10

Revenue wise, it was fair game.

Revenue wise, it was fair game.

16:12

Yeah. After that, it was obvious things. And when I say obvious, I mean, it you have to be sure. So that would be a

Yeah. After that, it was obvious things. And when I say obvious, I mean, it you have to be sure. So that would be a

16:20

legal firm or an accounting firm

legal firm or an accounting firm

16:23

or seven eleven. Other than that, again, fair game because my business was actually under farming. So everything else, you don't know. It's itself selected the industry, we kept the rest there. So we were still up with a pretty massive list of companies. And you told me, by the way, you said one of your things is, like, you think industry is overrated. You think people over index on, I'm looking in this space. This is the niche. This is the industry I'm looking in. You don't believe in that, and you didn't do that. Why do you think that's the case? So initially, here's why. I I think that from experience. Initially, I did what I think most people do. What investors actually were acquire you to do.

or seven eleven. Other than that, again, fair game because my business was actually under farming. So everything else, you don't know. It's itself selected the industry, we kept the rest there. So we were still up with a pretty massive list of companies. And you told me, by the way, you said one of your things is, like, you think industry is overrated. You think people over index on, I'm looking in this space. This is the niche. This is the industry I'm looking in. You don't believe in that, and you didn't do that. Why do you think that's the case? So initially, here's why. I I think that from experience. Initially, I did what I think most people do. What investors actually were acquire you to do.

16:59

You sit there and you have thesis

You sit there and you have thesis

17:01

about the kind of industries that would be great businesses.

about the kind of industries that would be great businesses.

17:04

And usually those industries have characteristics that make them stable, which is why you're looking for when you're buying a business. Blah duh.

And usually those industries have characteristics that make them stable, which is why you're looking for when you're buying a business. Blah duh.

17:12

And what I found is that the industries were absolutely relevant.

And what I found is that the industries were absolutely relevant.

17:16

What matters is that you find a business that is established

What matters is that you find a business that is established

17:20

and has been consistently profitable for a number of years. Everything else garbage. There are so many businesses in amazing industries. Like, let's talk pest control. Right? Kuwait industry.

and has been consistently profitable for a number of years. Everything else garbage. There are so many businesses in amazing industries. Like, let's talk pest control. Right? Kuwait industry.

17:31

You've got people that I've passed. They're not gonna say, you know what? Not a great year for me this year. I'm just gonna let my house be infested. Like, that's not really a thing. Right. It almost gives you, I think, industries a false sense of security because you think, just because I'm in this pest control business,

You've got people that I've passed. They're not gonna say, you know what? Not a great year for me this year. I'm just gonna let my house be infested. Like, that's not really a thing. Right. It almost gives you, I think, industries a false sense of security because you think, just because I'm in this pest control business,

17:48

I'm good. When you're really not, there's way more to it than that. And so what I found is find a business that's established and consistently profitable

I'm good. When you're really not, there's way more to it than that. And so what I found is find a business that's established and consistently profitable

17:58

forget

forget

17:59

the industry because people could say I'm an e commerce.

the industry because people could say I'm an e commerce.

18:02

Right. So that's that's a this is an unstable industry. I worked in the steel industry. You would think that's an absolute hell no business I used to work for. It's a hell yeah. It's a great, great business.

Right. So that's that's a this is an unstable industry. I worked in the steel industry. You would think that's an absolute hell no business I used to work for. It's a hell yeah. It's a great, great business.

18:12

Right. But industries would tell you otherwise,

Right. But industries would tell you otherwise,

18:15

Gotcha. So you didn't look top down, industry instead. You were just like, okay. I have this. Yeah. This list. You've removed the obvious outliers, businesses that are way too big for you to buy. And now you have still an enormous list. And here you are, one person sitting on campus

Gotcha. So you didn't look top down, industry instead. You were just like, okay. I have this. Yeah. This list. You've removed the obvious outliers, businesses that are way too big for you to buy. And now you have still an enormous list. And here you are, one person sitting on campus

18:30

trying to sort through this,

trying to sort through this,

18:32

what was your approach? What'd you do? Well, I wasn't a one man show here. Thank god or I wouldn't have made it. I hired Helen interns.

what was your approach? What'd you do? Well, I wasn't a one man show here. Thank god or I wouldn't have made it. I hired Helen interns.

18:40

And it it I didn't mean for it to get as big as it did, but initially I add five interns that worked for me. And we actually did the industry approach. We did the painstaking process

And it it I didn't mean for it to get as big as it did, but initially I add five interns that worked for me. And we actually did the industry approach. We did the painstaking process

18:50

of look each internet to give me fifty companies a week with They were they met my criteria.

of look each internet to give me fifty companies a week with They were they met my criteria.

18:57

These companies,

These companies,

18:59

you found email addresses for, and then we contacted number five. You had five interns, but you're a college student. You're an intern. Well, how does you get it? How does an intern have interns? What what it would happen here? So I made quite the pitch and the truthfully here's what it is.

you found email addresses for, and then we contacted number five. You had five interns, but you're a college student. You're an intern. Well, how does you get it? How does an intern have interns? What what it would happen here? So I made quite the pitch and the truthfully here's what it is.

19:14

The oh, and I swear to you, like, I use what I learned searching every single day. And my interns tell me this all the time. We text each other about it all the time.

The oh, and I swear to you, like, I use what I learned searching every single day. And my interns tell me this all the time. We text each other about it all the time.

19:24

Private equity this is private equity, and private equity is an industry where they don't do free internships.

Private equity this is private equity, and private equity is an industry where they don't do free internships.

19:31

You're more of a liability waste of their time than the free internship. So you're not gonna get a free internship

You're more of a liability waste of their time than the free internship. So you're not gonna get a free internship

19:38

at a private equity form. You need to have actual skills. You need to have investment banking skills probably before you're even at their front door. And so this opportunity is Hey, you're gonna get private equity experience, and I'm gonna give you transparency into everything.

at a private equity form. You need to have actual skills. You need to have investment banking skills probably before you're even at their front door. And so this opportunity is Hey, you're gonna get private equity experience, and I'm gonna give you transparency into everything.

19:53

I'm huge on transparency, so I created a conference line and I said, I'm gonna let every single person listen in on these calls whenever they want. So those were calls with all the owners, brokers, accountants,

I'm huge on transparency, so I created a conference line and I said, I'm gonna let every single person listen in on these calls whenever they want. So those were calls with all the owners, brokers, accountants,

20:04

attorneys.

attorneys.

20:05

Anyone from HBS, anyone that I contacted, my phone was basically tapped twenty four seven If you're interested in finance, this is very helpful, actually. I mean, who wouldn't wanna it's like you, Shaan. I'm sure people would would is weirdly enough Once you listen in on your calls when you're talking business, when you're doing business deals, you would learn a lot. I'm sure.

Anyone from HBS, anyone that I contacted, my phone was basically tapped twenty four seven If you're interested in finance, this is very helpful, actually. I mean, who wouldn't wanna it's like you, Shaan. I'm sure people would would is weirdly enough Once you listen in on your calls when you're talking business, when you're doing business deals, you would learn a lot. I'm sure.

20:26

So that's a huge portion of it to learning. Ben Graham told Warren Buffett. Warren Buffett was he admired Benjamin Graham, and he wanted to go work for him. And he said, I'll work for you for Warren Buffett says, I'll work for you free.

So that's a huge portion of it to learning. Ben Graham told Warren Buffett. Warren Buffett was he admired Benjamin Graham, and he wanted to go work for him. And he said, I'll work for you for Warren Buffett says, I'll work for you free.

20:37

And Graham goes, your price is too high.

And Graham goes, your price is too high.

20:39

And, because it you're right. It's the time, the energy. So for for for a lot of people, they're not even they're gonna say no to a free,

And, because it you're right. It's the time, the energy. So for for for a lot of people, they're not even they're gonna say no to a free,

20:47

for to if somebody's willing to work for free because the time and energy it takes to train somebody and give them that access is too expensive.

for to if somebody's willing to work for free because the time and energy it takes to train somebody and give them that access is too expensive.

20:55

Relative to the free labor. But you

Relative to the free labor. But you

20:58

were smart. You made it a different you were in the opposite position. You're like, I do need help. I do need free labor. And,

were smart. You made it a different you were in the opposite position. You're like, I do need help. I do need free labor. And,

21:04

You rebranded yourself as private equity, which technically you were,

You rebranded yourself as private equity, which technically you were,

21:07

but Absolutely.

but Absolutely.

21:09

Private equity were short.

Private equity were short.

21:11

It's like, where is your office? It's like, it's in the cafeteria. We sit at this table, and that's my office.

It's like, where is your office? It's like, it's in the cafeteria. We sit at this table, and that's my office.

21:16

Alright. So you start works. Oh, and these were other Harvard students or these are just people on the in the area.

Alright. So you start works. Oh, and these were other Harvard students or these are just people on the in the area.

21:21

No. In fact, I initially used the student job boards, and they were actually the worst. You get these cookie cutter students

No. In fact, I initially used the student job boards, and they were actually the worst. You get these cookie cutter students

21:28

who think like everybody else, they were basic. The best interns I found came off Craigslist.

who think like everybody else, they were basic. The best interns I found came off Craigslist.

21:34

My one of my first interns

My one of my first interns

21:36

but was with that initial batch of five. He was with me from the entire duration of my search and he came off of Craigslist. Nice. It's people that aren't just thinking like every other college student. And by the way, a lot of these weren't college students. You told me something you were like, you know, initially we're going through this list of, like, four hundred thousand businesses that, like, you know, were in the criteria. And so even if you're doing fifty outreaches a day, and we have five, ten, fifteen interns doing this,

but was with that initial batch of five. He was with me from the entire duration of my search and he came off of Craigslist. Nice. It's people that aren't just thinking like every other college student. And by the way, a lot of these weren't college students. You told me something you were like, you know, initially we're going through this list of, like, four hundred thousand businesses that, like, you know, were in the criteria. And so even if you're doing fifty outreaches a day, and we have five, ten, fifteen interns doing this,

22:01

the math ain't math. It just doesn't work. You can't get through this list. So you changed your approach. What did you do? Absolutely.

the math ain't math. It just doesn't work. You can't get through this list. So you changed your approach. What did you do? Absolutely.

22:07

So we realized our response rate is awful. I you no matter how customized you get, you're reaching out to people, most of which aren't looking to sell their business. So it's a very low response rate. So if it's already this bad, we may as well just and we're already filtering in the wrong way. We made many mistakes. The interns would have all these false positives, false negatives.

So we realized our response rate is awful. I you no matter how customized you get, you're reaching out to people, most of which aren't looking to sell their business. So it's a very low response rate. So if it's already this bad, we may as well just and we're already filtering in the wrong way. We made many mistakes. The interns would have all these false positives, false negatives.

22:28

We decide we're just going to

We decide we're just going to

22:31

light everybody and their mother up.

light everybody and their mother up.

22:33

Because if you look at email addresses, they're all more or less the same. You start to see a pattern. If you're looking all day for an email address, You see, most emails are

Because if you look at email addresses, they're all more or less the same. You start to see a pattern. If you're looking all day for an email address, You see, most emails are

22:43

first name, last initial at domain,

first name, last initial at domain,

22:46

first initial, last name at this. It's the same four patterns. So we created a big Excel file,

first initial, last name at this. It's the same four patterns. So we created a big Excel file,

22:53

guessed the combinations,

guessed the combinations,

22:54

and then ran them through something. I think it was bulk email checker, to see whether or not they were actually like real addresses.

and then ran them through something. I think it was bulk email checker, to see whether or not they were actually like real addresses.

23:01

And so you you forget their contact info, and now you're gonna email all of them one generic email because you're like, fuck it. My response rate's bad anyways.

And so you you forget their contact info, and now you're gonna email all of them one generic email because you're like, fuck it. My response rate's bad anyways.

23:09

If it even if it gets cut in half, but I can email

If it even if it gets cut in half, but I can email

23:12

five times more or ten times more people Oh, yeah. That's a good trade.

five times more or ten times more people Oh, yeah. That's a good trade.

23:17

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

23:18

And what was interesting is, you know, we

And what was interesting is, you know, we

23:22

We had this huge list of people and we you'd think, oh, well, if somebody reaches back out to me, how am I gonna talk to them? You realize it's kinda the same conversations over and over. So we would do this approach where it's like bombs away. And I, after we'd send out an email, we'd be getting tons of phone calls from people. And we had sent the emails out in such a way that it looked like it

We had this huge list of people and we you'd think, oh, well, if somebody reaches back out to me, how am I gonna talk to them? You realize it's kinda the same conversations over and over. So we would do this approach where it's like bombs away. And I, after we'd send out an email, we'd be getting tons of phone calls from people. And we had sent the emails out in such a way that it looked like it

23:45

was done

was done

23:47

targeted.

targeted.

23:48

Like, it looked like we specifically did our research and said, Hey, I I'm looking for a business to buy and yours seems to perfect they fit the bill because it's within this revenue range. It's been around for a really long time and it's been profitable for a number of years.

Like, it looked like we specifically did our research and said, Hey, I I'm looking for a business to buy and yours seems to perfect they fit the bill because it's within this revenue range. It's been around for a really long time and it's been profitable for a number of years.

24:03

And the people that reached the that responded and said, actually, no, you idiot. That's not true. Great. Now we know. That's perfect. Right. Yeah. They filled out your survey, essentially. Yeah. They didn't, but they didn't realize that they thought they were telling us off. Yeah. And the best replies were the ones that were Wow. You really did your research here. This is great. They reach out to me. They're telling me how much research I've done. I have No idea who they are. I've got the intern scrambling figuring out what area code is this? Who is this? What could this possibly be? As I'm pretending to have spent this time researching

And the people that reached the that responded and said, actually, no, you idiot. That's not true. Great. Now we know. That's perfect. Right. Yeah. They filled out your survey, essentially. Yeah. They didn't, but they didn't realize that they thought they were telling us off. Yeah. And the best replies were the ones that were Wow. You really did your research here. This is great. They reach out to me. They're telling me how much research I've done. I have No idea who they are. I've got the intern scrambling figuring out what area code is this? Who is this? What could this possibly be? As I'm pretending to have spent this time researching

24:37

their business. I have no clue. Right. It's like being at a party and then somebody knows you, but you don't remember where they're at. So you have to say really generic things to, to keep the keep it going while your brain is, like, searching, searching, like, how do I know this person? What is their name?

their business. I have no clue. Right. It's like being at a party and then somebody knows you, but you don't remember where they're at. So you have to say really generic things to, to keep the keep it going while your brain is, like, searching, searching, like, how do I know this person? What is their name?

24:50

Exactly.

Exactly.

24:51

Exactly.

Exactly.

24:52

And so you, what was your specific criteria? Did you have, like, a revenue target, or did you have, like, a EBITDA target that you were using?

And so you, what was your specific criteria? Did you have, like, a revenue target, or did you have, like, a EBITDA target that you were using?

24:59

Initially, I looked at businesses

Initially, I looked at businesses

25:02

ideally between four million and twenty million in revenue.

ideally between four million and twenty million in revenue.

25:05

And I wanted something

And I wanted something

25:08

at or above

at or above

25:09

a million and a half in EBITDA. Okay. But over time, that's changed. Again, just like the industries, you realize, why does it need to be this way? I realized so much of what I was doing was just based off of what I had heard over and over. And so things got tweaked as I realized I didn't need to necessarily have that criteria.

a million and a half in EBITDA. Okay. But over time, that's changed. Again, just like the industries, you realize, why does it need to be this way? I realized so much of what I was doing was just based off of what I had heard over and over. And so things got tweaked as I realized I didn't need to necessarily have that criteria.

25:26

I actually lowered my expectations a lot in standards.

I actually lowered my expectations a lot in standards.

25:30

It worked out well, I think.

It worked out well, I think.

25:32

And so you, you lower you you widen your thing. You reach out to a bunch of people. And at what and one of them is this business,

And so you, you lower you you widen your thing. You reach out to a bunch of people. And at what and one of them is this business,

25:39

egg cartons,

egg cartons,

25:40

that the egg cartons dot com. So what stood out there and then tell the story about how you ended up buying that company? Okay. So I send out that email, which again looks like it's customized, but it's not. The owner sends back a very long email saying, wow, you've really done your research. I am so impressed.

that the egg cartons dot com. So what stood out there and then tell the story about how you ended up buying that company? Okay. So I send out that email, which again looks like it's customized, but it's not. The owner sends back a very long email saying, wow, you've really done your research. I am so impressed.

25:57

And he starts outlining the specifics of what I said in the email. You're right. We have been around for a while. We started in two thousand and one And this business has been to your point profitable ever since consistently.

And he starts outlining the specifics of what I said in the email. You're right. We have been around for a while. We started in two thousand and one And this business has been to your point profitable ever since consistently.

26:11

We have an amazing reputation.

We have an amazing reputation.

26:13

We have a very strong customer base.

We have a very strong customer base.

26:16

And

And

26:17

from there, I said, okay. This has my interests because at first, let me back up. I'm getting this email and I'm thinking,

from there, I said, okay. This has my interests because at first, let me back up. I'm getting this email and I'm thinking,

26:23

guys, we're reaching out to farms now because it looked like they were a farm feed store. It really did.

guys, we're reaching out to farms now because it looked like they were a farm feed store. It really did.

26:30

And so I the first thing I always wanted to know was, okay. Let's see the financials

And so I the first thing I always wanted to know was, okay. Let's see the financials

26:35

because if the numbers aren't there, numbers meaning you have actually been as you alleged consistently

because if the numbers aren't there, numbers meaning you have actually been as you alleged consistently

26:41

profitable for a number of years?

profitable for a number of years?

26:44

I'm not really interested.

I'm not really interested.

26:46

Right. But they were there. And so Anytime you see that, you know, because it is rare, by the way. I would say maybe five percent of the businesses we looked at were consistently profitable and established but that's few.

Right. But they were there. And so Anytime you see that, you know, because it is rare, by the way. I would say maybe five percent of the businesses we looked at were consistently profitable and established but that's few.

26:58

And so he had he met those parameters. I'm immediately interested. And so I started asking about the business and learning a little bit more like, okay. This is a commodity. Right? And he says, no, it's not. We actually have a lot of proprietary products. We have some patents. I don't know. Just explain, just explain what it is. It's literally carton that your eggs come in. You're you buy a dozen eggs.

And so he had he met those parameters. I'm immediately interested. And so I started asking about the business and learning a little bit more like, okay. This is a commodity. Right? And he says, no, it's not. We actually have a lot of proprietary products. We have some patents. I don't know. Just explain, just explain what it is. It's literally carton that your eggs come in. You're you buy a dozen eggs.

27:17

They have to be packages in something. Yes. This guy was making the packaging. He was manufacturing it or he was the middle man. He was a middle man. Yeah. I'll back up. So I found out what they're basically doing is they're a wholesale distributor

They have to be packages in something. Yes. This guy was making the packaging. He was manufacturing it or he was the middle man. He was a middle man. Yeah. I'll back up. So I found out what they're basically doing is they're a wholesale distributor

27:29

and they're buying

and they're buying

27:31

storing

storing

27:32

and selling a currency.

and selling a currency.

27:34

So I immediately think, okay, this is simple enough that an a person with average intelligence, me,

So I immediately think, okay, this is simple enough that an a person with average intelligence, me,

27:40

can do this. Like, I think I could sell an a card. I think I could buy one too.

can do this. Like, I think I could sell an a card. I think I could buy one too.

27:45

That was essentially what it was,

That was essentially what it was,

27:48

the business.

the business.

27:49

Of course, though again, there were proprietary products. There were a couple things that made it much more desirable. But at the end of the day, we're buying and selling eight cartons.

Of course, though again, there were proprietary products. There were a couple things that made it much more desirable. But at the end of the day, we're buying and selling eight cartons.

27:57

Right. Right. And the website, I went to it now, which is like, you know, after you took over. And it's so basic. And we've talked about this on the thing. The logo isn't even just the logo. It's egg cards dot com. So you you have the dot com in the logo, which is great. And then under it, attached to that in the same image is your one eight hundred number. It's like, you know, we call one eight eight, eight two five, whatever, whatever, whatever. And so this business is so simple and so old school looking But you weren't scared away by that. You actually

Right. Right. And the website, I went to it now, which is like, you know, after you took over. And it's so basic. And we've talked about this on the thing. The logo isn't even just the logo. It's egg cards dot com. So you you have the dot com in the logo, which is great. And then under it, attached to that in the same image is your one eight hundred number. It's like, you know, we call one eight eight, eight two five, whatever, whatever, whatever. And so this business is so simple and so old school looking But you weren't scared away by that. You actually

28:27

you wanted that. You didn't want some internet business. You didn't want something that was, like, kind of new and innovative. Is that right? That's correct.

you wanted that. You didn't want some internet business. You didn't want something that was, like, kind of new and innovative. Is that right? That's correct.

28:34

I think you have to play to your strengths here. This is where you it's not so general. You

I think you have to play to your strengths here. This is where you it's not so general. You

28:40

you can buy a business that suits

you can buy a business that suits

28:43

your abilities.

your abilities.

28:44

Mine were honestly kinda limited. I'm not handy. I'm not good with technology.

Mine were honestly kinda limited. I'm not handy. I'm not good with technology.

28:49

Anything with engineering is over my head. So I figured the simpler for me, the better. I didn't wanna rely on anybody going in there for the first couple months to just learn the basics. This was a business you could walk into, and day one, more or less get it. And so you,

Anything with engineering is over my head. So I figured the simpler for me, the better. I didn't wanna rely on anybody going in there for the first couple months to just learn the basics. This was a business you could walk into, and day one, more or less get it. And so you,

29:07

what happens? You make them an offer. You meet them for lunch. How do you how do you actually get this deal done? So for me, I stopped going anywhere until we spoke about a tentative price range. So I would always throw out a number very quickly because they were kinda going between three to four times. So I think, okay. If you're above the average business, I've looked at this month, You you're closer to four. If you're below that, you're closer to three, maybe closer to two. Profits or revenue. Prof profits. I immediately got down to that on the phone. It was gray. You're in this range.

what happens? You make them an offer. You meet them for lunch. How do you how do you actually get this deal done? So for me, I stopped going anywhere until we spoke about a tentative price range. So I would always throw out a number very quickly because they were kinda going between three to four times. So I think, okay. If you're above the average business, I've looked at this month, You you're closer to four. If you're below that, you're closer to three, maybe closer to two. Profits or revenue. Prof profits. I immediately got down to that on the phone. It was gray. You're in this range.

29:38

They didn't really understand terminology. I wanted to keep it very simple. So I'd say, okay. What's your income looking like? What are you guys averaging each year? And they'd see the numbers.

They didn't really understand terminology. I wanted to keep it very simple. So I'd say, okay. What's your income looking like? What are you guys averaging each year? And they'd see the numbers.

29:47

And so

And so

29:48

the I immediately was thinking, you know, this is this is worth three and a half times. I always went a little bit up because I always knew there'd be more in the numbers

the I immediately was thinking, you know, this is this is worth three and a half times. I always went a little bit up because I always knew there'd be more in the numbers

29:57

to bring it down. Right. But you wanna be a little optimistic, but you're not ripping them off. You're not being dishonest. You're being in best case scenario. It's probably around here. Right. So I threw out a number and I go, is your is your price anywhere within that range? Because a lot of people, the combo ends because they think their business is worth ten and it's just not. Right. So I give out the number and he goes, okay. Yeah. I think I can work somewhere with net range.

to bring it down. Right. But you wanna be a little optimistic, but you're not ripping them off. You're not being dishonest. You're being in best case scenario. It's probably around here. Right. So I threw out a number and I go, is your is your price anywhere within that range? Because a lot of people, the combo ends because they think their business is worth ten and it's just not. Right. So I give out the number and he goes, okay. Yeah. I think I can work somewhere with net range.

30:22

He had looked into selling his business previously, so he was a lot more aware of what these small businesses are actually worth. A lot of ownership. Realistic about his baby versus say Exactly. This is the best thing ever. It's it's worth twenty times profit.

He had looked into selling his business previously, so he was a lot more aware of what these small businesses are actually worth. A lot of ownership. Realistic about his baby versus say Exactly. This is the best thing ever. It's it's worth twenty times profit.

30:35

Right. The second thing for me was a seller's note. That was a non negotiable for me. Because a seller's note to me was a substitute for getting equity, and I didn't

Right. The second thing for me was a seller's note. That was a non negotiable for me. Because a seller's note to me was a substitute for getting equity, and I didn't

30:47

wanna any investors involved. So the next step was, okay, are you willing to do a seller's note? And I I phrased it a different way to make sure he understood it, but he actually did.

wanna any investors involved. So the next step was, okay, are you willing to do a seller's note? And I I phrased it a different way to make sure he understood it, but he actually did.

30:56

And he was willing to do that. And so then I said, okay.

And he was willing to do that. And so then I said, okay.

31:00

Let's talk now. And just to define I got the numbers. What a what a seller's note is? So define what is a seller's note for everybody who doesn't know? Absolutely.

Let's talk now. And just to define I got the numbers. What a what a seller's note is? So define what is a seller's note for everybody who doesn't know? Absolutely.

31:07

I'll use an example. Let's say you're buying a house for a million dollars rather than giving the seller a million dollars up front,

I'll use an example. Let's say you're buying a house for a million dollars rather than giving the seller a million dollars up front,

31:15

This let's say you have a twenty five percent seller's note, you would give that seller at close seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars And then they would get paid the remaining

This let's say you have a twenty five percent seller's note, you would give that seller at close seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars And then they would get paid the remaining

31:25

two hundred and fifty thousand dollars over time. And whatever you define those terms at, whatever interest rate you decide on, and time horizon. Yeah. The seller becomes the bank. They're sort of financing you to be able to purchase the rest of the business. Exactly. And it was also great because the argument there is Oh, because some sellers didn't wanna do it. And the argument is, well, you're telling me how great your business is. You're telling me that it's simple enough for me to operate.

two hundred and fifty thousand dollars over time. And whatever you define those terms at, whatever interest rate you decide on, and time horizon. Yeah. The seller becomes the bank. They're sort of financing you to be able to purchase the rest of the business. Exactly. And it was also great because the argument there is Oh, because some sellers didn't wanna do it. And the argument is, well, you're telling me how great your business is. You're telling me that it's simple enough for me to operate.

31:51

If those things are true, why would you have an issue doing a seller's note? Right. Right. The state's stable. Right? Exactly.

If those things are true, why would you have an issue doing a seller's note? Right. Right. The state's stable. Right? Exactly.

31:59

And, my friend, I hope my friend just buy a business actually kinda similar to yours, recently. And he did a good thing, which was in the seller's note. He said, look, here's the purchase price. Here's the seller's note. But if EBITDA

And, my friend, I hope my friend just buy a business actually kinda similar to yours, recently. And he did a good thing, which was in the seller's note. He said, look, here's the purchase price. Here's the seller's note. But if EBITDA

32:09

was to drop way below where it is today, because, you know, I find some skeletons at the closet or this thing turns out to have been built on some quicksand, we're gonna forgive the rest of that seller's note. Right? And then he was able to structure it accordingly. So so it's a it's a good mechanism for for any buyer,

was to drop way below where it is today, because, you know, I find some skeletons at the closet or this thing turns out to have been built on some quicksand, we're gonna forgive the rest of that seller's note. Right? And then he was able to structure it accordingly. So so it's a it's a good mechanism for for any buyer,

32:25

doing. And I don't I I I don't know. Did you do that, or did you just do a solution as is?

doing. And I don't I I I don't know. Did you do that, or did you just do a solution as is?

32:30

I did it as is. There is something called earn out, which similar to what you're saying, and it's based on the performance of the business, and you choose, am I gonna do it on revenue or profits?

I did it as is. There is something called earn out, which similar to what you're saying, and it's based on the performance of the business, and you choose, am I gonna do it on revenue or profits?

32:39

For me, I tried to keep this extremely simple because The devil really is in the details here. And these sellers, a lot of them don't even have high school degrees,

For me, I tried to keep this extremely simple because The devil really is in the details here. And these sellers, a lot of them don't even have high school degrees,

32:48

but they're very good at business. They've been very successful. So I'm trying to do a deal here

but they're very good at business. They've been very successful. So I'm trying to do a deal here

32:54

where

where

32:55

these terms are extremely straightforward. And when you start doing terms like that, the seller freaks out because then it's Wait. I may not get this money. I don't even know you. All of a sudden, he's skeptical of you. So I'm not a big fan of those. Yeah. That was that was the other thing. One one of your point of view was, like, you know, industry is overrated. I like that point. Why? You know, because you're really looking for just actually just this rare, beautiful business that's stable and profitable.

these terms are extremely straightforward. And when you start doing terms like that, the seller freaks out because then it's Wait. I may not get this money. I don't even know you. All of a sudden, he's skeptical of you. So I'm not a big fan of those. Yeah. That was that was the other thing. One one of your point of view was, like, you know, industry is overrated. I like that point. Why? You know, because you're really looking for just actually just this rare, beautiful business that's stable and profitable.

33:19

And you shouldn't, like, use industry filters for that necessarily.

And you shouldn't, like, use industry filters for that necessarily.

33:22

Or have have the thesis and walk in as this genius who has a thesis up front you know Right. Be open minded at the at the start. And then the second part is you were like, I try not to use any jargon. Like, no bit even though you were at Harvard Business School, you weren't saying EBITDA, you would say, how much money are you making or income?

Or have have the thesis and walk in as this genius who has a thesis up front you know Right. Be open minded at the at the start. And then the second part is you were like, I try not to use any jargon. Like, no bit even though you were at Harvard Business School, you weren't saying EBITDA, you would say, how much money are you making or income?

33:39

You know, you were not trying to or even in the structure, you were not trying to get super fancy in the structure because

You know, you were not trying to or even in the structure, you were not trying to get super fancy in the structure because

33:45

If you don't understand it, they're not gonna understand it, essentially. Right? Yes.

If you don't understand it, they're not gonna understand it, essentially. Right? Yes.

33:49

And that's the biggest mistake too because people think, well, I don't have a Harvard MBA or I don't know any of this. I honestly think ignorance truly is bliss here because the less you know, it's kind of better because you can keep things extremely simple.

And that's the biggest mistake too because people think, well, I don't have a Harvard MBA or I don't know any of this. I honestly think ignorance truly is bliss here because the less you know, it's kind of better because you can keep things extremely simple.

34:03

For the seller. And I think that breeds trust.

For the seller. And I think that breeds trust.

34:06

And so you, buy this business, how much cash did you put into the business to buy it? You don't need to put any cash down, and I didn't have to because of the sellers' note. So I did a twenty five percent sellers' note and a seventy five percent bank note.

And so you, buy this business, how much cash did you put into the business to buy it? You don't need to put any cash down, and I didn't have to because of the sellers' note. So I did a twenty five percent sellers' note and a seventy five percent bank note.

34:19

And the idea there was when shopping around for a bank to do the deal, it was all about and it took me, you know, twenty plus banks to figure this out. It was all about How did they view the seller's note? Banks said, viewed that seller's note, which very few did as equity.

And the idea there was when shopping around for a bank to do the deal, it was all about and it took me, you know, twenty plus banks to figure this out. It was all about How did they view the seller's note? Banks said, viewed that seller's note, which very few did as equity.

34:35

I could

I could

34:36

I could work with. The ones that didn't Not so much. Because if they viewed it as equity, it's like, well, you're okay. There's twenty five percent equity. We'll loan you the other seventy five percent.

I could work with. The ones that didn't Not so much. Because if they viewed it as equity, it's like, well, you're okay. There's twenty five percent equity. We'll loan you the other seventy five percent.

34:44

Exactly.

Exactly.

34:45

Exactly. And how'd you get him to think that that was equity? Because it's not

Exactly. And how'd you get him to think that that was equity? Because it's not

34:49

it's kind of not equity.

it's kind of not equity.

34:51

I'd say I wish I could have some, like, really savvy answer here, but

I'd say I wish I could have some, like, really savvy answer here, but

34:55

To be frank, and I'm not trying to say this about all banks, but most bankers have no idea what they're doing or what they're talking about. Truly. I had to learn this the hard way They think they can finance the deal. They have no idea how to finance the deal. They have no idea what these structures look what the details are of these structures So a lot of it I'm sorry. It's just ignorance of them and their board. Right. So you say here's the purchase price and then here's how much we need from the bank. And then they're like, oh, the rest is accurate.

To be frank, and I'm not trying to say this about all banks, but most bankers have no idea what they're doing or what they're talking about. Truly. I had to learn this the hard way They think they can finance the deal. They have no idea how to finance the deal. They have no idea what these structures look what the details are of these structures So a lot of it I'm sorry. It's just ignorance of them and their board. Right. So you say here's the purchase price and then here's how much we need from the bank. And then they're like, oh, the rest is accurate.

35:24

And they didn't call it equity. They knew it was debt. They called it debt, but the way they reviewed it, like, when they're looking at their ratios for these these banks. They have all these rules. It was whatever internal rules they were using to evaluate the debt ratio.

And they didn't call it equity. They knew it was debt. They called it debt, but the way they reviewed it, like, when they're looking at their ratios for these these banks. They have all these rules. It was whatever internal rules they were using to evaluate the debt ratio.

35:38

And and one big thing is this the bank had priority over everyone else. Right. So the bank was gonna be paid before this seller's note. And the business had many, many years of

And and one big thing is this the bank had priority over everyone else. Right. So the bank was gonna be paid before this seller's note. And the business had many, many years of

35:48

a track record of profitability.

a track record of profitability.

35:50

Yes.

Yes.

35:50

That's why that that is so important. You have to you they're really

That's why that that is so important. You have to you they're really

35:55

banking on that business's track record. And then a little bit with you. It's a question of, okay, it's on well for twenty years.

banking on that business's track record. And then a little bit with you. It's a question of, okay, it's on well for twenty years.

36:02

What could you do to make it not do so well? Right. Right. And so you,

What could you do to make it not do so well? Right. Right. And so you,

36:07

you buy this thing. You told me, you know, the only asset I had at the time. I had no money, no experience, no whatever. I only owned my my my car. I had a rav for And that's literally like all I had to my name. And you were able to buy a multi million dollar business and then walk in and be the owner of just by really hustle and a a kind of a numbers game. So the we didn't even talk to some of the hustle of this. So some of the hustle of this was scraping the database. Somebody else was getting people off Craigslist to be interns to sift through the database, then it was, well, those interns need a place to work. So you got fake IDs to get them into the library. Is Right? Like, tell the fake IDs. Absolutely.

you buy this thing. You told me, you know, the only asset I had at the time. I had no money, no experience, no whatever. I only owned my my my car. I had a rav for And that's literally like all I had to my name. And you were able to buy a multi million dollar business and then walk in and be the owner of just by really hustle and a a kind of a numbers game. So the we didn't even talk to some of the hustle of this. So some of the hustle of this was scraping the database. Somebody else was getting people off Craigslist to be interns to sift through the database, then it was, well, those interns need a place to work. So you got fake IDs to get them into the library. Is Right? Like, tell the fake IDs. Absolutely.

36:44

We hustled for those IDs too. We hustled for those. That was hard work.

We hustled for those IDs too. We hustled for those. That was hard work.

36:49

You said you, was it you, like, went to alumni? You, like, you're, like, looking at the intern, and you're, like, alright. Which alum

You said you, was it you, like, went to alumni? You, like, you're, like, looking at the intern, and you're, like, alright. Which alum

36:55

looks like this intern, and then can elast them for their student ID

looks like this intern, and then can elast them for their student ID

36:59

hours of that truly hours. We reached out to hundreds and hundreds of people.

hours of that truly hours. We reached out to hundreds and hundreds of people.

37:03

Hundreds. And so you've got these interns, then you realize, hey, we need to just be black this kind of like fake it till you make it email where it looks like we've researched them specifically and they'll sort of self select. You end up doing this deal where you don't put any money down because you were able to shop forty banks or something like that to get them to to give you the financing for it. A lot of this, to me, the story here is like,

Hundreds. And so you've got these interns, then you realize, hey, we need to just be black this kind of like fake it till you make it email where it looks like we've researched them specifically and they'll sort of self select. You end up doing this deal where you don't put any money down because you were able to shop forty banks or something like that to get them to to give you the financing for it. A lot of this, to me, the story here is like,

37:25

not counting yourself out.

not counting yourself out.

37:27

Because Yes. A lot of people all somewhere along that way would have counted themselves out. I don't know how to do this. I, you know, this is un uncertain. I don't have the money. I don't have the experience. I don't have time, they would find a way to count themselves out. You didn't do that.

Because Yes. A lot of people all somewhere along that way would have counted themselves out. I don't know how to do this. I, you know, this is un uncertain. I don't have the money. I don't have the experience. I don't have time, they would find a way to count themselves out. You didn't do that.

37:41

Figure out a way to get it done. So, like, you know, don't all the rules are sort of imaginary. You can you can sort of work around them. And the last one is it's just a numbers game. Like you said, it's like it's like dating. We're just gonna need to look at a lot of businesses gonna need to get a bunch of interns to find the good ones. We're gonna look at a bunch of businesses to find the good ones. We're gonna talk to a bunch of banks to find the one that will do this deal. Is that accurate because that's what I'm hearing. Yes.

Figure out a way to get it done. So, like, you know, don't all the rules are sort of imaginary. You can you can sort of work around them. And the last one is it's just a numbers game. Like you said, it's like it's like dating. We're just gonna need to look at a lot of businesses gonna need to get a bunch of interns to find the good ones. We're gonna look at a bunch of businesses to find the good ones. We're gonna talk to a bunch of banks to find the one that will do this deal. Is that accurate because that's what I'm hearing. Yes.

38:02

If there are two things I am very passionate about in this world, it's obviously a occurrence, But also it's this concept of spreading the good news, which is that anyone

If there are two things I am very passionate about in this world, it's obviously a occurrence, But also it's this concept of spreading the good news, which is that anyone

38:12

who wants to buy, I really mean anyone who wants to buy and operate a small business can do so. It is not a matter of can or can't. It's a matter of will or won't. That's a fact. Because this is an industry where you can choose any type of business you want, any size business you want, you could be a cleaner,

who wants to buy, I really mean anyone who wants to buy and operate a small business can do so. It is not a matter of can or can't. It's a matter of will or won't. That's a fact. Because this is an industry where you can choose any type of business you want, any size business you want, you could be a cleaner,

38:32

Looking to buy another really small cleaning business from a guy or gal that's looking to retire. You can buy dog walking company. There is truly

Looking to buy another really small cleaning business from a guy or gal that's looking to retire. You can buy dog walking company. There is truly

38:41

no limit here. And that's what I love about it because to me, it's one of the few areas left of the American dream where you can go out and just put in a ton of effort and elbow grease and make something of your life and actually

no limit here. And that's what I love about it because to me, it's one of the few areas left of the American dream where you can go out and just put in a ton of effort and elbow grease and make something of your life and actually

38:54

make good money without killing yourself. Not having to work, you know, three jobs.

make good money without killing yourself. Not having to work, you know, three jobs.

38:59

Right. And so you since you took over the business, you don't have to share the exact numbers. But let's just say if the business was making a hundred dollars before,

Right. And so you since you took over the business, you don't have to share the exact numbers. But let's just say if the business was making a hundred dollars before,

39:07

in the years since you've bought the business, what have you been able to do? Like, how have you grown the bit how much have you grown the business? And How would you do to actually grow the business? Because the guy had been operating for, whatever, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen years, something like that. You come in as a beginner, but you've been able to grow the business. So I wanna know kind of roughly, like, how much value were you able to create? How many multiples of what you bought for? And then also,

in the years since you've bought the business, what have you been able to do? Like, how have you grown the bit how much have you grown the business? And How would you do to actually grow the business? Because the guy had been operating for, whatever, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen years, something like that. You come in as a beginner, but you've been able to grow the business. So I wanna know kind of roughly, like, how much value were you able to create? How many multiples of what you bought for? And then also,

39:30

what did you do? What what were the new insights or speaks or or operational things that you put in place to create that value.

what did you do? What what were the new insights or speaks or or operational things that you put in place to create that value.

39:36

Great questions here. So

Great questions here. So

39:38

when I first bought the business, the first couple of years, Things may have been on the decline a little bit. I may have made quite a few mistakes.

when I first bought the business, the first couple of years, Things may have been on the decline a little bit. I may have made quite a few mistakes.

39:45

And so once I'm looking too too promising, You're not getting invited on podcasts for that story at that time.

And so once I'm looking too too promising, You're not getting invited on podcasts for that story at that time.

39:51

No. Sarah, you bought a business and you are driving it straight into the ground. How does it feel? Tell us for it. What what's your secret?

No. Sarah, you bought a business and you are driving it straight into the ground. How does it feel? Tell us for it. What what's your secret?

39:58

I probably would've been fired or kicked off as CEO.

I probably would've been fired or kicked off as CEO.

40:01

But what happened was, so when I first put this business, I'm just gonna back up really fast. I really thought I'm in the egg industry. So I'm looking. What's the duck egg market like? What's the chicken egg market? You know, these things? And really, again, market's kind of b s

But what happened was, so when I first put this business, I'm just gonna back up really fast. I really thought I'm in the egg industry. So I'm looking. What's the duck egg market like? What's the chicken egg market? You know, these things? And really, again, market's kind of b s

40:17

it's all a bunch of crap, these frameworks and stuff because you don't really, really know until you're in it. And I realized while I got in it, I'm not really in the egg industry. I'm in specialty packaging.

it's all a bunch of crap, these frameworks and stuff because you don't really, really know until you're in it. And I realized while I got in it, I'm not really in the egg industry. I'm in specialty packaging.

40:28

And so it actually was a lot more of an opportunity than I ever realized. And I wasn't some genius figuring this out. I just looked at our order history. We were getting orders from people that were

And so it actually was a lot more of an opportunity than I ever realized. And I wasn't some genius figuring this out. I just looked at our order history. We were getting orders from people that were

40:39

selling crickets and Dubai roaches

selling crickets and Dubai roaches

40:41

and people that were using

and people that were using

40:43

the egg cartons for,

the egg cartons for,

40:45

small parts, people that were using them for bath bombs, cupcakes,

small parts, people that were using them for bath bombs, cupcakes,

40:49

I estimate now that forty percent of our revenue has nothing to do with eggs.

I estimate now that forty percent of our revenue has nothing to do with eggs.

40:53

And so when I realized that there was a lot of potential there, and I realized that our specialty was really also these proprietary products.

And so when I realized that there was a lot of potential there, and I realized that our specialty was really also these proprietary products.

41:01

I spent most of my time focusing on that. Not this really amazing modern website

I spent most of my time focusing on that. Not this really amazing modern website

41:07

But focusing on these products that I call really sticky, kind of a silly jargon term here, but these products were were making a custom mold for a customer.

But focusing on these products that I call really sticky, kind of a silly jargon term here, but these products were were making a custom mold for a customer.

41:16

That they then are gonna keep buying from us, assuming we don't rip them off or totally botch it. Right. And so from that and then COVID,

That they then are gonna keep buying from us, assuming we don't rip them off or totally botch it. Right. And so from that and then COVID,

41:24

COVID was like cheating because we, five, six acts during COVID to answer your question on the numbers, we really blew up So it was a combination of recognizing how big our market really was and then recognizing

COVID was like cheating because we, five, six acts during COVID to answer your question on the numbers, we really blew up So it was a combination of recognizing how big our market really was and then recognizing

41:38

that COVID was an incredible opportunity

that COVID was an incredible opportunity

41:40

for us to take all of our capabilities

for us to take all of our capabilities

41:42

and run with it. Right. I like that. And when you when you talked about, specialty packaging, you you said something to me. You go in that Google doc, you go. We're not we're not about egg cartons. Anything that needs sep what is it separation and what did you call it separation and protection? Protect. I always say anything requiring protection and separation is fair game. And I stand by that one hundred percent. It's true. Anything. And you think about how massive that market is, it's enormous.

and run with it. Right. I like that. And when you when you talked about, specialty packaging, you you said something to me. You go in that Google doc, you go. We're not we're not about egg cartons. Anything that needs sep what is it separation and what did you call it separation and protection? Protect. I always say anything requiring protection and separation is fair game. And I stand by that one hundred percent. It's true. Anything. And you think about how massive that market is, it's enormous.

42:08

Right. Yeah. You could be making bras with that definition. I love it. This is this could be anything. This is we're talking cups. We're talking whatever you want.

Right. Yeah. You could be making bras with that definition. I love it. This is this could be anything. This is we're talking cups. We're talking whatever you want.

42:17

So you, Truly.

So you, Truly.

42:19

And so are you, like, reaching out, by the way? Because, like, you your website still egg cartons dot com And I'm not trying to Sean park with you, but, like, drop the eggs. Just cartons dot com. That's the way to go here. If you're making forty percent off of non egg, stuff. Why don't you kinda rebrand it?

And so are you, like, reaching out, by the way? Because, like, you your website still egg cartons dot com And I'm not trying to Sean park with you, but, like, drop the eggs. Just cartons dot com. That's the way to go here. If you're making forty percent off of non egg, stuff. Why don't you kinda rebrand it?

42:35

So it's funny. We are actually in the process of doing a little bit of that, and I've continued to buy a bunch of domain names So things like machine shop trays or bath bomb car ins,

So it's funny. We are actually in the process of doing a little bit of that, and I've continued to buy a bunch of domain names So things like machine shop trays or bath bomb car ins,

42:46

any variations of that. I'm just buying domains left to right. Who knows whether they'll stick? But that's that's a huge portion of it. It but it's it's very challenging to figure out how to do that without

any variations of that. I'm just buying domains left to right. Who knows whether they'll stick? But that's that's a huge portion of it. It but it's it's very challenging to figure out how to do that without

42:57

compromising

compromising

42:58

other important variables, other important revenue drivers. It's a lot more challenging than you'd think, but we are to your point looking into that. I'm always like, stop with the eggs that everyone at the company's like, we sell a carpet. It's taken me years to really get people to understand.

other important variables, other important revenue drivers. It's a lot more challenging than you'd think, but we are to your point looking into that. I'm always like, stop with the eggs that everyone at the company's like, we sell a carpet. It's taken me years to really get people to understand.

43:14

This is bigger than eggs. We're not abandoning the farms. We're not abandoning the chickens, you guys. It's just way bigger than that. So, like, stop talking about the chickens and the ducks and whatever Hagice.

This is bigger than eggs. We're not abandoning the farms. We're not abandoning the chickens, you guys. It's just way bigger than that. So, like, stop talking about the chickens and the ducks and whatever Hagice.

43:25

I'm so jealous of you because I feel like if I ran an egg carton company, I could fulfill my dream of being Michael Scott at Thunder Mifflin,

I'm so jealous of you because I feel like if I ran an egg carton company, I could fulfill my dream of being Michael Scott at Thunder Mifflin,

43:33

and, like, just come into the warehouse. I just imagine that this is like a Dunder Mifflin style business and you could come in and, like, you know,

and, like, just come into the warehouse. I just imagine that this is like a Dunder Mifflin style business and you could come in and, like, you know,

43:39

you know, just have be the crazy boss every day. Do you you look back now at what you did, because again, we talked about starting as a rookie.

you know, just have be the crazy boss every day. Do you you look back now at what you did, because again, we talked about starting as a rookie.

43:48

If you could go back and I gave you an hour that you could, spend with you know, younger you. Either during the search process or during the early days of of the business,

If you could go back and I gave you an hour that you could, spend with you know, younger you. Either during the search process or during the early days of of the business,

43:57

what would what would you I could give you that time, when would you go back to? And what would you tell yourself as advice,

what would what would you I could give you that time, when would you go back to? And what would you tell yourself as advice,

44:04

with the wisdom and the the benefit of hindsight?

with the wisdom and the the benefit of hindsight?

44:08

So I would actually just borrow the advice I got from my mentor, but I'd actually follow it, which would there were two pieces. It was higher and fire fast. Didn't do that huge mistake

So I would actually just borrow the advice I got from my mentor, but I'd actually follow it, which would there were two pieces. It was higher and fire fast. Didn't do that huge mistake

44:19

and do not change anything big or really anything at all the first year.

and do not change anything big or really anything at all the first year.

44:24

Both of those things cost me a lot

Both of those things cost me a lot

44:27

What what about that that second one? Tell me more about that. So there's obviously a temptation. You come in. You're so excited. You've been searching. You've been searching. You finally find the thing. You close the deal after painful. You know, you don't know. It will it go through well and go through? It finally closes. And now the keys are yours. It's gotta be tempting to go play with the toys.

What what about that that second one? Tell me more about that. So there's obviously a temptation. You come in. You're so excited. You've been searching. You've been searching. You finally find the thing. You close the deal after painful. You know, you don't know. It will it go through well and go through? It finally closes. And now the keys are yours. It's gotta be tempting to go play with the toys.

44:46

What what's the what's the wrong way to do that? What's the right way to do that?

What what's the what's the wrong way to do that? What's the right way to do that?

44:51

Yeah. So let's get in today, actually.

Yeah. So let's get in today, actually.

44:54

When I come in, I'm thinking, okay. I knew I didn't know much. Truly. I didn't think I was gonna reorganize the warehouse or start changing anything

When I come in, I'm thinking, okay. I knew I didn't know much. Truly. I didn't think I was gonna reorganize the warehouse or start changing anything

45:03

seemingly big But there were things that I thought were really simple, like the phones. We had hard wired phones

seemingly big But there were things that I thought were really simple, like the phones. We had hard wired phones

45:11

in our office, and there were cables

in our office, and there were cables

45:14

everywhere because we've got all these offices and conference rooms. I'm thinking,

everywhere because we've got all these offices and conference rooms. I'm thinking,

45:18

too, this is like twenty whatever. Like, we're almost in twenty twenty here. What are we doing with this? We should just change our phones to VoIP phones

too, this is like twenty whatever. Like, we're almost in twenty twenty here. What are we doing with this? We should just change our phones to VoIP phones

45:26

so that I can see everything remotely where there's not phones ringing. Let's get, you know, into the modern age here. Seems like not a big thing.

so that I can see everything remotely where there's not phones ringing. Let's get, you know, into the modern age here. Seems like not a big thing.

45:35

No. That was one of the biggest mistakes I made because you called and our phone number is actually extremely important. People look at the domain, that's great. But our number is used by our biggest customers,

No. That was one of the biggest mistakes I made because you called and our phone number is actually extremely important. People look at the domain, that's great. But our number is used by our biggest customers,

45:45

by the the new customers. It's everything to us. And we actually have multiple phone numbers but that one eight hundred numbers forwarded to, like, ten, twelve lines. And so it's very important. And

by the the new customers. It's everything to us. And we actually have multiple phone numbers but that one eight hundred numbers forwarded to, like, ten, twelve lines. And so it's very important. And

45:57

Spectrum may have

Spectrum may have

45:59

lost our phone lines mid porting. And so our phones were down for almost a week. And it was a huge deal because it was a new owner, and people are thinking, did they go out of business? Right. What is going on here? Because you're not their phones are gone. They're they're dead now. And it was a huge so it's like, maybe just do,

lost our phone lines mid porting. And so our phones were down for almost a week. And it was a huge deal because it was a new owner, and people are thinking, did they go out of business? Right. What is going on here? Because you're not their phones are gone. They're they're dead now. And it was a huge so it's like, maybe just do,

46:17

first off, I wouldn't do anything with myself. I'm I'm to this day. I will not change our phone lines because I've been so traumatized by the experience. But if you were Maybe you just, like, change one phone line into

first off, I wouldn't do anything with myself. I'm I'm to this day. I will not change our phone lines because I've been so traumatized by the experience. But if you were Maybe you just, like, change one phone line into

46:30

maybe not all of them, but something like that that you think is small can actually be pretty big.

maybe not all of them, but something like that that you think is small can actually be pretty big.

46:35

I like that. And you you said, like, we kinda hinted at this earlier, but,

I like that. And you you said, like, we kinda hinted at this earlier, but,

46:41

I wanna make this point, which is

I wanna make this point, which is

46:44

I've,

I've,

46:45

you know, I said one thing you didn't do is you didn't count yourself out. And that's important. I think one of the reasons people count themselves out almost subconsciously

you know, I said one thing you didn't do is you didn't count yourself out. And that's important. I think one of the reasons people count themselves out almost subconsciously

46:52

is that they,

is that they,

46:55

they don't see themselves a certain way. They've never done that. Their family didn't do this. And so they just sort of are like, I don't know. I guess That's just something other people do. And that's even if you hear something, you're like, that sounds like a cool idea, but, like, we're we're good. I I have no I have no foothold here to do that. And you have a pretty unique background that I think

they don't see themselves a certain way. They've never done that. Their family didn't do this. And so they just sort of are like, I don't know. I guess That's just something other people do. And that's even if you hear something, you're like, that sounds like a cool idea, but, like, we're we're good. I I have no I have no foothold here to do that. And you have a pretty unique background that I think

47:15

should, you know, debunk that idea of of of kind of like

should, you know, debunk that idea of of of kind of like

47:20

even if you're not from that track, you can sort of get on that track at any time. And so,

even if you're not from that track, you can sort of get on that track at any time. And so,

47:25

when I first was talking to you, I was like, Wow. This is some whip smart, you know, Harvard per it's like, basically,

when I first was talking to you, I was like, Wow. This is some whip smart, you know, Harvard per it's like, basically,

47:31

you take the Harvard pedigree, but then she added some some street smart some hustle. And I thought that that's what I thought when I met you in. And then you were like, you said something like, you know, like, I didn't even take the SATs. And I was like, wait, how'd you get into Harvard Business School? Tell the story of your background because I think it's kind of amazing.

you take the Harvard pedigree, but then she added some some street smart some hustle. And I thought that that's what I thought when I met you in. And then you were like, you said something like, you know, like, I didn't even take the SATs. And I was like, wait, how'd you get into Harvard Business School? Tell the story of your background because I think it's kind of amazing.

47:49

Okay. Yeah. This is a little detail here. So we're gonna go way back

Okay. Yeah. This is a little detail here. So we're gonna go way back

47:53

I'm one of three.

I'm one of three.

47:55

And my sisters and I would say sort of had a subpar

And my sisters and I would say sort of had a subpar

47:59

upbringing

upbringing

48:00

in that we didn't really have parents

in that we didn't really have parents

48:02

and we were split up and we bounced around and living in a lot of different homes.

and we were split up and we bounced around and living in a lot of different homes.

48:08

My two older sisters, they made the most of it. They got really into academics and sports.

My two older sisters, they made the most of it. They got really into academics and sports.

48:13

I

I

48:14

made the worst of it, I would say. And I became somebody that you would not want your kids hanging out with. Okay. I was partying all the time, I had a I wouldn't go to school, so I had a truancy officer.

made the worst of it, I would say. And I became somebody that you would not want your kids hanging out with. Okay. I was partying all the time, I had a I wouldn't go to school, so I had a truancy officer.

48:27

I went to jail.

I went to jail.

48:29

I

I

48:29

I was just so disrespectful to everyone I got away with it because people felt sorry for me.

I was just so disrespectful to everyone I got away with it because people felt sorry for me.

48:35

And the beginning of high school, I was living with a woman that was an alcoholic

And the beginning of high school, I was living with a woman that was an alcoholic

48:40

And her favorite thing when she got drunk was to take all my items and throw them out to the front lawn and just tell me to leave.

And her favorite thing when she got drunk was to take all my items and throw them out to the front lawn and just tell me to leave.

48:47

I didn't really have anywhere to go. I was a kid.

I didn't really have anywhere to go. I was a kid.

48:50

And so there was a woman named Natalie Bracken

And so there was a woman named Natalie Bracken

48:54

who used to pick me up and take me to our house. And she let me stay there until this woman inevitably,

who used to pick me up and take me to our house. And she let me stay there until this woman inevitably,

49:01

you know, came back to earth and said, where did you go? And called the police. And so I was constantly going back and forth between

you know, came back to earth and said, where did you go? And called the police. And so I was constantly going back and forth between

49:09

Natalie's the Bracken's house and this other household that I was being transported by the police and no one to really do any about it. Nobody seemed to really care.

Natalie's the Bracken's house and this other household that I was being transported by the police and no one to really do any about it. Nobody seemed to really care.

49:18

And one day, just she just got so fed up and she said, I'm gonna adopt you.

And one day, just she just got so fed up and she said, I'm gonna adopt you.

49:24

Obviously, it was pretty transformational.

Obviously, it was pretty transformational.

49:26

So I'm living in her home with with her family and her daughter I was actually friends with.

So I'm living in her home with with her family and her daughter I was actually friends with.

49:31

So her husband one day kinda let me have it because I was trying to skip school, like, the first week living there.

So her husband one day kinda let me have it because I was trying to skip school, like, the first week living there.

49:37

And he sat me down and he he literally explained

And he sat me down and he he literally explained

49:40

it sounds it's embarrassing almost to say that he literally explained how life works to me. The basics of you don't lie. You don't just skip things when you don't wanna show up That's not how this isn't reality.

it sounds it's embarrassing almost to say that he literally explained how life works to me. The basics of you don't lie. You don't just skip things when you don't wanna show up That's not how this isn't reality.

49:53

And he explained where my life was going, which was basically absolutely nowhere.

And he explained where my life was going, which was basically absolutely nowhere.

49:59

And it was very emotional for me because up until that time, a lot of people had given me lectures, but it felt like it came from this place of

And it was very emotional for me because up until that time, a lot of people had given me lectures, but it felt like it came from this place of

50:08

you're bothering me or this is really inconveniencing

you're bothering me or this is really inconveniencing

50:10

me. So can you just stop your crap

me. So can you just stop your crap

50:14

where he

where he

50:15

came from this place I could tell he really cared. And up until then, I didn't really feel like anybody did care.

came from this place I could tell he really cared. And up until then, I didn't really feel like anybody did care.

50:22

And so I got my shit together very quickly after that. I really did. I was so nervous about, like, being, like, sent back or

And so I got my shit together very quickly after that. I really did. I was so nervous about, like, being, like, sent back or

50:29

them regretting their decision because up until that time,

them regretting their decision because up until that time,

50:33

no one And I mean, no one was looking to invest in me. I was, like, a junk bond investment wise. This is not a safe investment.

no one And I mean, no one was looking to invest in me. I was, like, a junk bond investment wise. This is not a safe investment.

50:40

I was not a good kid. I didn't do myself any favors.

I was not a good kid. I didn't do myself any favors.

50:44

And so

And so

50:46

after that

after that

50:47

and getting my shit together, step one was getting a job. So the first time I'd ever remember studying truly in my life was with missus Bracken when I was learning a menu

and getting my shit together, step one was getting a job. So the first time I'd ever remember studying truly in my life was with missus Bracken when I was learning a menu

50:56

to get a job at a diner.

to get a job at a diner.

50:58

And then from there, I applied those new study skills I had to school. Mister Breckett explained, like, listen, you gotta to a point o here kid, you're not getting anywhere but community college with that. So you need to, like, get your act together. And so from there, I got all a's because I wanted to boost my average at least to a three point o.

And then from there, I applied those new study skills I had to school. Mister Breckett explained, like, listen, you gotta to a point o here kid, you're not getting anywhere but community college with that. So you need to, like, get your act together. And so from there, I got all a's because I wanted to boost my average at least to a three point o.

51:17

I'm working at this diner,

I'm working at this diner,

51:19

and this couple would come in all the time. And they never had kids,

and this couple would come in all the time. And they never had kids,

51:24

And we just got along. That's the best way to explain it.

And we just got along. That's the best way to explain it.

51:27

I never told them about my upbringing really initially. I think my coworkers probably did or days I probably weren't there, and they probably could just tell.

I never told them about my upbringing really initially. I think my coworkers probably did or days I probably weren't there, and they probably could just tell.

51:36

And so they offered me a job with their company probably initially out of sympathy out of the kindness of their heart, and I started working there. And

And so they offered me a job with their company probably initially out of sympathy out of the kindness of their heart, and I started working there. And

51:45

it just it just seemed to fit

it just it just seemed to fit

51:48

And so when I was working there, I got wait listed from North Easter and ran out of going to college. And when I was wait listed,

And so when I was working there, I got wait listed from North Easter and ran out of going to college. And when I was wait listed,

51:56

the owner of the So these two, I'm sorry, backing up. This couple, I had no idea they were extremely wealthy.

the owner of the So these two, I'm sorry, backing up. This couple, I had no idea they were extremely wealthy.

52:02

I always thought rich people were at fancy restaurants, but this couple's coming in

I always thought rich people were at fancy restaurants, but this couple's coming in

52:06

going to a diner, getting cheeseburgers each week. I had no idea, like, they're worth a lot of money.

going to a diner, getting cheeseburgers each week. I had no idea, like, they're worth a lot of money.

52:12

And

And

52:13

when I was wait listed,

when I was wait listed,

52:15

Steve said, you need to take yourself off of financial aid because of these schools, especially a school like North Easter without a big endowment. They're gonna take that into consideration.

Steve said, you need to take yourself off of financial aid because of these schools, especially a school like North Easter without a big endowment. They're gonna take that into consideration.

52:25

When evaluating your candidacy.

When evaluating your candidacy.

52:27

And I said, how am I gonna take myself up? Eight. I have no money and this school is so expensive.

And I said, how am I gonna take myself up? Eight. I have no money and this school is so expensive.

52:33

And he said, we're gonna pay for your school.

And he said, we're gonna pay for your school.

52:35

Wow.

Wow.

52:36

And so, yeah, I mean, it's I it's very it's hard for me to not get emotional talking about because it's

And so, yeah, I mean, it's I it's very it's hard for me to not get emotional talking about because it's

52:41

so

so

52:43

Between these two couples, I mean, they changed my entire life.

Between these two couples, I mean, they changed my entire life.

52:47

They

They

52:48

it wasn't just the money too. It wasn't just the home. It was these people changed the way I viewed my self,

it wasn't just the money too. It wasn't just the home. It was these people changed the way I viewed my self,

52:53

they invested me when I was truly the world's worst investment.

they invested me when I was truly the world's worst investment.

52:57

I mean, who takes the kid like me, what I was like and say, you know what? I'm gonna go all in on this. Like, they put their ass out on the line for me on multiple occasions

I mean, who takes the kid like me, what I was like and say, you know what? I'm gonna go all in on this. Like, they put their ass out on the line for me on multiple occasions

53:06

with the worst track record

with the worst track record

53:08

you can possibly manage like, truly possibly imagine.

you can possibly manage like, truly possibly imagine.

53:13

And from these two these two families, I had this whole concept in my head of just wanna be that one person for one person

And from these two these two families, I had this whole concept in my head of just wanna be that one person for one person

53:21

because for me, I literally begged when I was a kid sometimes for people to help me. I would beg judges. I would beg attorneys. I would beg social workers to, like, put me in better circumstances or help me with x and y. Nobody helped me at all. They felt sorry for me, but nobody took action. So this concept of being that one person for one person carried over into college,

because for me, I literally begged when I was a kid sometimes for people to help me. I would beg judges. I would beg attorneys. I would beg social workers to, like, put me in better circumstances or help me with x and y. Nobody helped me at all. They felt sorry for me, but nobody took action. So this concept of being that one person for one person carried over into college,

53:42

because I went to northeastern

because I went to northeastern

53:44

to be a social worker initially.

to be a social worker initially.

53:47

And that was way too kumbaya for me, but you can probably tell I'm not, like, that's just not me.

And that was way too kumbaya for me, but you can probably tell I'm not, like, that's just not me.

53:53

And so from there, I said, okay. Something a little bit more aggressive, more me could be law. I was watching CSI,

And so from there, I said, okay. Something a little bit more aggressive, more me could be law. I was watching CSI,

54:00

but I thought of law. So I think I'm gonna be in juvenile justice. I I can be I I can be the attorney I wanted to have. I can be the social worker. I wanna have But again, it was I I just realized these professions were just not me. So one day, I called Steve, the owner of this company I worked for. I I call him boss. And I said, hey, boss. Like, I don't know what I'm gonna do here. I'm now a junior in college,

but I thought of law. So I think I'm gonna be in juvenile justice. I I can be I I can be the attorney I wanted to have. I can be the social worker. I wanna have But again, it was I I just realized these professions were just not me. So one day, I called Steve, the owner of this company I worked for. I I call him boss. And I said, hey, boss. Like, I don't know what I'm gonna do here. I'm now a junior in college,

54:22

and I've worked for you, but that's kind of my only work experience.

and I've worked for you, but that's kind of my only work experience.

54:26

And I have no

And I have no

54:28

I have no experience in anything, but criminal justice now and social work and I don't wanna do these professions.

I have no experience in anything, but criminal justice now and social work and I don't wanna do these professions.

54:33

And he said,

And he said,

54:35

You are not an academic.

You are not an academic.

54:37

You're

You're

54:38

you're geared for business. It comes naturally to you. And he said, and you can have a way bigger impact in business than, like, criminal justice or social work.

you're geared for business. It comes naturally to you. And he said, and you can have a way bigger impact in business than, like, criminal justice or social work.

54:47

And so I said, okay. Well, what am I gonna do now though? Because I'm in my junior year, I don't have anything to show for this. I can't just go and get a I can't just go into a business who's gonna want me. And he said, you need to do a business school. Because he had gone I didn't even know it. He had gone to stand for business school. And back in the day, they went right after school, but now the average age of business school candidates, at least at the Ivy League like Harvard is twenty eight. And when we were talking about this, I was, like, twenty one. I was about to graduate.

And so I said, okay. Well, what am I gonna do now though? Because I'm in my junior year, I don't have anything to show for this. I can't just go and get a I can't just go into a business who's gonna want me. And he said, you need to do a business school. Because he had gone I didn't even know it. He had gone to stand for business school. And back in the day, they went right after school, but now the average age of business school candidates, at least at the Ivy League like Harvard is twenty eight. And when we were talking about this, I was, like, twenty one. I was about to graduate.

55:16

And,

And,

55:16

I said

I said

55:18

There's no way I'm gonna get into a business school.

There's no way I'm gonna get into a business school.

55:21

He didn't know I had paid my sister to take my SAT for me. Because I had confidence. I can study hard enough, but I'm not gonna get caught up enough. I don't even know what's on the SAT. I imagine it's all the subjects, but I just had no

He didn't know I had paid my sister to take my SAT for me. Because I had confidence. I can study hard enough, but I'm not gonna get caught up enough. I don't even know what's on the SAT. I imagine it's all the subjects, but I just had no

55:34

confidence in myself. Like, when I got to college, I was at a thirty three percent reading level. What does that mean? I I went off campus one day. I, like, I, like, it was horrible. Went off campus one day because I was convinced this is horrible. I was really convinced I was mentally handicapped when I got to college because I just did not understand anything.

confidence in myself. Like, when I got to college, I was at a thirty three percent reading level. What does that mean? I I went off campus one day. I, like, I, like, it was horrible. Went off campus one day because I was convinced this is horrible. I was really convinced I was mentally handicapped when I got to college because I just did not understand anything.

55:51

And I got this test done, and then he said there's really nothing wrong with. You're just, like, at a low level here. Right. And they did say my intelligence was below average at that time. And so

And I got this test done, and then he said there's really nothing wrong with. You're just, like, at a low level here. Right. And they did say my intelligence was below average at that time. And so

56:03

it was it was horrible because it was a factual evidence. Hey. You're not so bright. And by the way, you're we You're at the thirty three percentile. Like, oh, that's fucking great. Like,

it was it was horrible because it was a factual evidence. Hey. You're not so bright. And by the way, you're we You're at the thirty three percentile. Like, oh, that's fucking great. Like,

56:12

it basically put into pay onto paper that I'm an idiot, and it was heartbreaking for me. But I was so embarrassed and I didn't want anyone to know. And so the only thing I really knew at that point was to just try really hard. Again, I didn't wanna disappoint, like, my biggest fear to this day would be to disappoint the back ends or the greens, like, ever. And I just

it basically put into pay onto paper that I'm an idiot, and it was heartbreaking for me. But I was so embarrassed and I didn't want anyone to know. And so the only thing I really knew at that point was to just try really hard. Again, I didn't wanna disappoint, like, my biggest fear to this day would be to disappoint the back ends or the greens, like, ever. And I just

56:32

I figure if they've gotten me here, I have to make this work. And so I I studied, like, you wouldn't believe. Like, nobody knows the Northeast Train University Library, like, I do.

I figure if they've gotten me here, I have to make this work. And so I I studied, like, you wouldn't believe. Like, nobody knows the Northeast Train University Library, like, I do.

56:41

So I studied my ass off, and I my biggest fear was even getting a b. That's so much about that that part.

So I studied my ass off, and I my biggest fear was even getting a b. That's so much about that that part.

56:47

I've met a couple of people in my life who have had that sort of, like, I don't know, come to Jesus moment or the but but I call it, like, the conversation with yourself.

I've met a couple of people in my life who have had that sort of, like, I don't know, come to Jesus moment or the but but I call it, like, the conversation with yourself.

56:55

It's, like, there's a day where you have a conversation with yourself. You're like, look, it's this is either gonna go one of two either

It's, like, there's a day where you have a conversation with yourself. You're like, look, it's this is either gonna go one of two either

57:00

this is what it is, and it'll just be what it's gonna be, or, like, I'm gonna change it. And I always ask them because I I I think these

this is what it is, and it'll just be what it's gonna be, or, like, I'm gonna change it. And I always ask them because I I I think these

57:08

There's a few moments in your life where, like, decades are are sort of decided. And it's some converse should you have with yourself? This is my theory. I don't know. You tell me. Was there a conversation you had with yourself at that time to be like, okay. I'm just gonna apply my I'm gonna go and bury myself in this library until I come out with a ninety nine percent reading level or what what happened there?

There's a few moments in your life where, like, decades are are sort of decided. And it's some converse should you have with yourself? This is my theory. I don't know. You tell me. Was there a conversation you had with yourself at that time to be like, okay. I'm just gonna apply my I'm gonna go and bury myself in this library until I come out with a ninety nine percent reading level or what what happened there?

57:29

I've never been one of those, like, long term planners. It was for me, it's more of a day by day week by week thing, but I did have this mentality. I remember of I'm gonna give this literally everything that I have, everything that I have. Like, every day, I really mean that because I will I had a mentality of I will not disappoint these people.

I've never been one of those, like, long term planners. It was for me, it's more of a day by day week by week thing, but I did have this mentality. I remember of I'm gonna give this literally everything that I have, everything that I have. Like, every day, I really mean that because I will I had a mentality of I will not disappoint these people.

57:50

I will not disappoint them. So if that means I studied round the clock, it still wasn't good enough. At least I can say, I gave this literally everything, and I'm sorry. That was kind of my thinking. That was it. A lot of people think that it's you know, the hardest thing is when nobody believes in you. Actually, the most pressure is when almost nobody believes in you, but a couple people do. And when a couple people do, it adds a whole different level of emotional pressure

I will not disappoint them. So if that means I studied round the clock, it still wasn't good enough. At least I can say, I gave this literally everything, and I'm sorry. That was kind of my thinking. That was it. A lot of people think that it's you know, the hardest thing is when nobody believes in you. Actually, the most pressure is when almost nobody believes in you, but a couple people do. And when a couple people do, it adds a whole different level of emotional pressure

58:16

to the situation more so than what nobody believes in you. Yes. It's funny. I I it's rare. I I don't ever mind actually anybody that gets that, but that's exactly how I felt. I wanted to live I felt like what they believed in me wasn't true.

to the situation more so than what nobody believes in you. Yes. It's funny. I I it's rare. I I don't ever mind actually anybody that gets that, but that's exactly how I felt. I wanted to live I felt like what they believed in me wasn't true.

58:30

And so I wanted to live up to who they thought I was, who I didn't think I was. So that's I mean, I didn't come from the situation you came from. I was luckier than that. You'll just be born into the right sort of family in circumstances,

And so I wanted to live up to who they thought I was, who I didn't think I was. So that's I mean, I didn't come from the situation you came from. I was luckier than that. You'll just be born into the right sort of family in circumstances,

58:44

but,

but,

58:45

yeah, the the Birch family here in San Francisco, they're the ones who were that for me. We're, you know, I'm twenty four years old, and they They invested in me, and they they sat they literally sat me down and said, I think you're gonna do special things. They go, we've met a lot of people at Silicon Valley. Think you're gonna do special things. You're gonna go on to do special things. We want you to do them, you know,

yeah, the the Birch family here in San Francisco, they're the ones who were that for me. We're, you know, I'm twenty four years old, and they They invested in me, and they they sat they literally sat me down and said, I think you're gonna do special things. They go, we've met a lot of people at Silicon Valley. Think you're gonna do special things. You're gonna go on to do special things. We want you to do them, you know,

59:04

we just think

we just think

59:06

they named me CEO of the company. They were, like, here's the keys. We think you should do them here. You're you're gonna do them at some point. And at that time, I didn't really view myself as special in any way.

they named me CEO of the company. They were, like, here's the keys. We think you should do them here. You're you're gonna do them at some point. And at that time, I didn't really view myself as special in any way.

59:14

It was kind of the first time that somebody had ever really

It was kind of the first time that somebody had ever really

59:17

said something like that, but also put their money where their mouth was. That wasn't maybe my parent. Where my parents, like,

said something like that, but also put their money where their mouth was. That wasn't maybe my parent. Where my parents, like,

59:23

in in a way, you sort of take that for granted, unfortunately. And so I took that for granted when my parents would say, oh, you're so great. It's like, yeah, just like every mom, you know, thinks their kid's so great, you know, That's how I felt at the time.

in in a way, you sort of take that for granted, unfortunately. And so I took that for granted when my parents would say, oh, you're so great. It's like, yeah, just like every mom, you know, thinks their kid's so great, you know, That's how I felt at the time.

59:34

And hearing a total outsider, you know, this billionaire say, no. No. No. I believe in you. And then the and then for me, it was soul crushing the next six years. I, like, didn't succeed, but I was trying really hard, but I wasn't succeeding. And I remember feeling that pressure of, like, I was I remember everything, like, I wish nobody believed in me. That would be easier,

And hearing a total outsider, you know, this billionaire say, no. No. No. I believe in you. And then the and then for me, it was soul crushing the next six years. I, like, didn't succeed, but I was trying really hard, but I wasn't succeeding. And I remember feeling that pressure of, like, I was I remember everything, like, I wish nobody believed in me. That would be easier,

59:52

than somebody really believing you and you're not wanting to disappoint them.

than somebody really believing you and you're not wanting to disappoint them.

59:57

That was I remember just feeling that day by day. So I I definitely at least resonate with that part of your story.

That was I remember just feeling that day by day. So I I definitely at least resonate with that part of your story.

01:00:02

Yeah. No. That's that's really re that's that's very real. Funny. A lot of people say, oh, I didn't have it as bad as you, but it's all I've learned a lot of the same and you adapt to what you're going through. I'm sure the feelings in a lot of ways were actually almost the same. Right. But the externals just looked a little bit differently.

Yeah. No. That's that's really re that's that's very real. Funny. A lot of people say, oh, I didn't have it as bad as you, but it's all I've learned a lot of the same and you adapt to what you're going through. I'm sure the feelings in a lot of ways were actually almost the same. Right. But the externals just looked a little bit differently.

01:00:18

Yeah. Yeah. Your life is a movie.

Yeah. Yeah. Your life is a movie.

01:00:21

And my life is, you know, like, you know, the the the the the normal thing. But, like, your life is literally I told you this on the phone. Your life is literally the plot of the movie blind side. Like,

And my life is, you know, like, you know, the the the the the normal thing. But, like, your life is literally I told you this on the phone. Your life is literally the plot of the movie blind side. Like,

01:00:30

you're just not this, like, huge football player. Instead, you, you know, you're you wouldn't bought a business instead, but, like, same sort of idea where people, you know, took a took a chance on you. Have you,

you're just not this, like, huge football player. Instead, you, you know, you're you wouldn't bought a business instead, but, like, same sort of idea where people, you know, took a took a chance on you. Have you,

01:00:40

taken that mentality of, like, be one person was it be one person for one be that person for one person person. Yeah. Be that one person for one person. I love that. That's kind of amazing. Is that from something or did you invent that?

taken that mentality of, like, be one person was it be one person for one be that person for one person person. Yeah. Be that one person for one person. I love that. That's kind of amazing. Is that from something or did you invent that?

01:00:51

It just, like, it just came to me don't know. I it was just something I thought of one day. Have you done that? Do you feel like you've been able to do that?

It just, like, it just came to me don't know. I it was just something I thought of one day. Have you done that? Do you feel like you've been able to do that?

01:01:00

Do I feel like I've been able to do That I do, actually. And that's

Do I feel like I've been able to do That I do, actually. And that's

01:01:05

truly one of the most rewarding things about my job now. You know, I try and keep my circle very small. I'm really big on doing what these families did for me as much as possible, which is a lot of one on one mentorship

truly one of the most rewarding things about my job now. You know, I try and keep my circle very small. I'm really big on doing what these families did for me as much as possible, which is a lot of one on one mentorship

01:01:16

because I can only do so much on a mass scale. But one on one, I can really

because I can only do so much on a mass scale. But one on one, I can really

01:01:23

bring people to the next level, whatever that level is. And I'm huge on and I have no tolerance for people self doubting. I'll say, nope. You can do it. Like, do it again. We're doing this again, and I will sit there and every one of the business I used to say, I will come any day, any time. I will sit with you for as long as it takes. If you try and you're honest with me, I'm not gonna give up on you. And I I really mean that. If somebody tries and they're honest with me, I'm not giving up on them. Right.

bring people to the next level, whatever that level is. And I'm huge on and I have no tolerance for people self doubting. I'll say, nope. You can do it. Like, do it again. We're doing this again, and I will sit there and every one of the business I used to say, I will come any day, any time. I will sit with you for as long as it takes. If you try and you're honest with me, I'm not gonna give up on you. And I I really mean that. If somebody tries and they're honest with me, I'm not giving up on them. Right.

01:01:49

When you were talking, I was getting goosebumps,

When you were talking, I was getting goosebumps,

01:01:52

on my arm here because I I mean, I love the story, but also,

on my arm here because I I mean, I love the story, but also,

01:01:57

I think that coming on a podcast like this and telling your story

I think that coming on a podcast like this and telling your story

01:02:01

is gonna do that for someone somewhere that you don't even know. It's a different way of doing it. But, like, somebody out there is gonna hear this, or they're gonna forward it to somebody who's a and say, Listen, I don't even know if you know what the podcast app is, but you need to hear this because, you know, something in there is gonna resonate with somebody. And so,

is gonna do that for someone somewhere that you don't even know. It's a different way of doing it. But, like, somebody out there is gonna hear this, or they're gonna forward it to somebody who's a and say, Listen, I don't even know if you know what the podcast app is, but you need to hear this because, you know, something in there is gonna resonate with somebody. And so,

01:02:18

why I was getting goosebumps because there's a way to kinda like

why I was getting goosebumps because there's a way to kinda like

01:02:21

the egg carton story and buying a business is cool. That was kind of the bait. But the the real kind of like the real story here is is kind of just the the mentality and also,

the egg carton story and buying a business is cool. That was kind of the bait. But the the real kind of like the real story here is is kind of just the the mentality and also,

01:02:34

those families that did that for you, you know, I think that's a

those families that did that for you, you know, I think that's a

01:02:38

it's not as flashy as, you know, creating a foundation and giving away a billion dollars or whatever, but, like, it is it is a version of, like, you know, philanthropy or or should be giving back or contributing

it's not as flashy as, you know, creating a foundation and giving away a billion dollars or whatever, but, like, it is it is a version of, like, you know, philanthropy or or should be giving back or contributing

01:02:49

that is, you know, can change change somebody's life in a mean in a huge way versus a lot of people's lives in a small way. Right. And I think that's what's way more important to me. And seeing it helps me a lot, it keeps me motivated.

that is, you know, can change change somebody's life in a mean in a huge way versus a lot of people's lives in a small way. Right. And I think that's what's way more important to me. And seeing it helps me a lot, it keeps me motivated.

01:03:01

Because unfortunately, the farther removed you get from it, the harder it is to remember

Because unfortunately, the farther removed you get from it, the harder it is to remember

01:03:06

What did you have to do when you kind of rewired yourself? Like, what was the,

What did you have to do when you kind of rewired yourself? Like, what was the,

01:03:11

when you did try to that's a big shift. Right? You basically changed all your habits.

when you did try to that's a big shift. Right? You basically changed all your habits.

01:03:15

Maybe not overnight, but, like, you changed all the shit you were doing that was getting you the bad results into things that started to get you good results.

Maybe not overnight, but, like, you changed all the shit you were doing that was getting you the bad results into things that started to get you good results.

01:03:24

Was it, like, what what was what was that like? How did you do that?

Was it, like, what what was what was that like? How did you do that?

01:03:29

I wish it was deep, and I had, like, steps for you, but It was a it was a lot of fear. I was really scared of being anything like what I was. I was scared of what I would be in the future. Kinda like a drug addict that nearly dies from an overdose and they are just scared straight. I was kinda scared straight. And so

I wish it was deep, and I had, like, steps for you, but It was a it was a lot of fear. I was really scared of being anything like what I was. I was scared of what I would be in the future. Kinda like a drug addict that nearly dies from an overdose and they are just scared straight. I was kinda scared straight. And so

01:03:50

I also honestly lost interest in a lot of things I used to be interested in. I used again to fights.

I also honestly lost interest in a lot of things I used to be interested in. I used again to fights.

01:03:56

I used to gossip. I used to there was this golf course I used to get drunk, passed out on the golf course, wake up to the sprinklers. No joke. And I was just disgusted by it afterwards

I used to gossip. I used to there was this golf course I used to get drunk, passed out on the golf course, wake up to the sprinklers. No joke. And I was just disgusted by it afterwards

01:04:06

thinking about it, like, who is that? I don't even wanna be around that. It was like the idea of the taste or the smell bothering somebody. It was like that.

thinking about it, like, who is that? I don't even wanna be around that. It was like the idea of the taste or the smell bothering somebody. It was like that.

01:04:14

But from there, it was hard because I didn't know. I didn't have any of the tools. Like, I never I did not read a single book in high school, not one book.

But from there, it was hard because I didn't know. I didn't have any of the tools. Like, I never I did not read a single book in high school, not one book.

01:04:23

Right. You

Right. You

01:04:25

I have a couple of docs here that I wanna share. One is,

I have a couple of docs here that I wanna share. One is,

01:04:29

I because I think it's cool to see the actual screenshots. You you shared with me because, the funny thing is when you told the story that when when we told the story the first time on the podcast, There was two reactions. One is wow. That's an incredible story because here's what I tweeted out. So I said, I have a new hero and and her name is Sarah Moore. At under thirty years old, she had no money, no experience, and the biggest asset was her car of RAV four. She spent one year hunting through, like, a hundred thousand businesses to find one to buy. And she bought a, guest at the time. I didn't know if this was true, but I she bought a, you know, multi million dollar business called egg cartons dot com with all debt, no no cash down. And so I told that story, and I told him the podcast. And, basically, the two reactions were,

I because I think it's cool to see the actual screenshots. You you shared with me because, the funny thing is when you told the story that when when we told the story the first time on the podcast, There was two reactions. One is wow. That's an incredible story because here's what I tweeted out. So I said, I have a new hero and and her name is Sarah Moore. At under thirty years old, she had no money, no experience, and the biggest asset was her car of RAV four. She spent one year hunting through, like, a hundred thousand businesses to find one to buy. And she bought a, guest at the time. I didn't know if this was true, but I she bought a, you know, multi million dollar business called egg cartons dot com with all debt, no no cash down. And so I told that story, and I told him the podcast. And, basically, the two reactions were,

01:05:08

wow. That's incredible. So awesome. You know, you go girl. And on the other side, it was

wow. That's incredible. So awesome. You know, you go girl. And on the other side, it was

01:05:14

I'm calling bullshit. No way. And people were like, that's that's not, you know, you can't buy it all debt. Nobody could sift through a hundred thousand businesses.

I'm calling bullshit. No way. And people were like, that's that's not, you know, you can't buy it all debt. Nobody could sift through a hundred thousand businesses.

01:05:23

Do you go to Harvard and not have anything, not not have any money? And honestly, I started to and when I saw those tweets, I was like, damn, that never occurred to me, actually. Like, Yeah. You're right. She was saying she kind of came from nothing and blah blah blah, but she's at Harvard Business School. Like, and I was like, am I getting fucking Berenos right now? Is this Elizabeth Holmes that I'm just getting duped?

Do you go to Harvard and not have anything, not not have any money? And honestly, I started to and when I saw those tweets, I was like, damn, that never occurred to me, actually. Like, Yeah. You're right. She was saying she kind of came from nothing and blah blah blah, but she's at Harvard Business School. Like, and I was like, am I getting fucking Berenos right now? Is this Elizabeth Holmes that I'm just getting duped?

01:05:43

And so so that happened. And then we have this researcher. The researcher

And so so that happened. And then we have this researcher. The researcher

01:05:48

you you text us the other day. You were like, hey, somebody's like contacting a bunch of my old interns. And it was like, our researcher fact checking just to make sure we don't look like idiots that, like, we're putting somebody on who did this actually happen.

you you text us the other day. You were like, hey, somebody's like contacting a bunch of my old interns. And it was like, our researcher fact checking just to make sure we don't look like idiots that, like, we're putting somebody on who did this actually happen.

01:05:59

But I think that's kind of a cool thing that your story was literally too good to be true. That people just started calling bullshit. And I remember you didn't have any social media, so there was no way for you to explain or tell your side of the story. And then I think your sister

But I think that's kind of a cool thing that your story was literally too good to be true. That people just started calling bullshit. And I remember you didn't have any social media, so there was no way for you to explain or tell your side of the story. And then I think your sister

01:06:13

like, created a Twitter account or something. It started, like, that day, she was, like, tweeting, like, no. I'm in the car with her right now. Yeah. We grew up broke and, like, we didn't have a family at, like, all this stuff. And I was like, wow. I don't know what's happening right now, but this is fascinating. Do you remember that?

like, created a Twitter account or something. It started, like, that day, she was, like, tweeting, like, no. I'm in the car with her right now. Yeah. We grew up broke and, like, we didn't have a family at, like, all this stuff. And I was like, wow. I don't know what's happening right now, but this is fascinating. Do you remember that?

01:06:28

That is so, yes, it started blowing up on Twitter, and everyone in my company was talking about it, and my interns were talking about it. And they're like, Sarah, You need to go out there and defend yourself. Like, we're gonna defend you when I was worried about I know the internet can be vicious, and I was worried about anybody getting any of that

That is so, yes, it started blowing up on Twitter, and everyone in my company was talking about it, and my interns were talking about it. And they're like, Sarah, You need to go out there and defend yourself. Like, we're gonna defend you when I was worried about I know the internet can be vicious, and I was worried about anybody getting any of that

01:06:45

Like, you know, pointed at them. And then I started worrying about my company.

Like, you know, pointed at them. And then I started worrying about my company.

01:06:50

So my sister got out of Mary and she was were very protective of each other.

So my sister got out of Mary and she was were very protective of each other.

01:06:54

She was she created a Twitter just to go on there and defend me. Was this the SAT sister or the other sister? This is the SAT. This is the Bright. Well, they're both exceptionally bright. But she's actually the director of HR for Avacrombie and Fitch, like corporate level. So she goes, so we're,

She was she created a Twitter just to go on there and defend me. Was this the SAT sister or the other sister? This is the SAT. This is the Bright. Well, they're both exceptionally bright. But she's actually the director of HR for Avacrombie and Fitch, like corporate level. So she goes, so we're,

01:07:11

husband now, but fiancee, the time goes You need to delete this, Jane. Like, you're You have something to lose. Yeah. It is a lose situation. Like, you guys are idiots. Why are you trying to defend yourself on one like people online were like, it's getting out of hand.

husband now, but fiancee, the time goes You need to delete this, Jane. Like, you're You have something to lose. Yeah. It is a lose situation. Like, you guys are idiots. Why are you trying to defend yourself on one like people online were like, it's getting out of hand.

01:07:24

So we had no I just that was my concern that people were gonna think this speak, and this was somehow gonna snowball in a negative direction. And all I cared about was preserve the business.

So we had no I just that was my concern that people were gonna think this speak, and this was somehow gonna snowball in a negative direction. And all I cared about was preserve the business.

01:07:35

Like, don't fuck. They card exec.

Like, don't fuck. They card exec.

01:07:37

Done with this random dude on the internet, blow this whole blow your spot up. Alright. So then you shared with us a bunch of the things. So you shared with us the Craig's we'll put this on on YouTube so people can actually see the the Craigslist Post. But you wrote,

Done with this random dude on the internet, blow this whole blow your spot up. Alright. So then you shared with us a bunch of the things. So you shared with us the Craig's we'll put this on on YouTube so people can actually see the the Craigslist Post. But you wrote,

01:07:50

Kingston Green. What's Kenzie? That's what you named your thing?

Kingston Green. What's Kenzie? That's what you named your thing?

01:07:53

I'd a mentor recommended to make the name of the company name that would have a story to it. And so I deliberately said, I wanted to say I'm from Cleveland, and I worked in the steel business. I wanna say I'm a blue collar gal like you. And so Kenston was named my high school in Cleveland, I'd say. And Green was the name of the family I had worked for in the steel industry. Right. So when they would ask immediately, what I don't no one wants an intro. Right? Hey, I'm they don't care. But when they say what's Kenson Green, it was my way of giving an intro without giving an intro. That's amazing. Also, it sounds kind of powerful and old money, sounding, something like that. Mean for that, but yeah. No. They works.

I'd a mentor recommended to make the name of the company name that would have a story to it. And so I deliberately said, I wanted to say I'm from Cleveland, and I worked in the steel business. I wanna say I'm a blue collar gal like you. And so Kenston was named my high school in Cleveland, I'd say. And Green was the name of the family I had worked for in the steel industry. Right. So when they would ask immediately, what I don't no one wants an intro. Right? Hey, I'm they don't care. But when they say what's Kenson Green, it was my way of giving an intro without giving an intro. That's amazing. Also, it sounds kind of powerful and old money, sounding, something like that. Mean for that, but yeah. No. They works.

01:08:28

So you wrote, it's a small unorthodox private equity firm.

So you wrote, it's a small unorthodox private equity firm.

01:08:31

Accurate unorthodox for sure.

Accurate unorthodox for sure.

01:08:35

Very private.

Very private.

01:08:37

It's just me.

It's just me.

01:08:39

And you said unlike a traditional private equity firm, we will acquire just one business, and the principal will operate upon acquisition. Alright. No lies are told. I said you will be working for an eccentric, unpretentious Harvard NBA. Alright? I like it. And exposed to live M and A deals, interactions with brokers, accountants, and attorneys, and due diligence, negotiations

And you said unlike a traditional private equity firm, we will acquire just one business, and the principal will operate upon acquisition. Alright. No lies are told. I said you will be working for an eccentric, unpretentious Harvard NBA. Alright? I like it. And exposed to live M and A deals, interactions with brokers, accountants, and attorneys, and due diligence, negotiations

01:08:59

of various sorts every day. That's awesome. You're you're saying, I like the value you're gonna get out of this unique experience.

of various sorts every day. That's awesome. You're you're saying, I like the value you're gonna get out of this unique experience.

01:09:06

We're looking for interest to help manage our multistage high volume funnel, high in all caps.

We're looking for interest to help manage our multistage high volume funnel, high in all caps.

01:09:10

In the most efficient way possible. It includes blah blah blah blah blah. And you said, you know,

In the most efficient way possible. It includes blah blah blah blah blah. And you said, you know,

01:09:16

I like this work will not include financial modeling, sophisticated analysis,

I like this work will not include financial modeling, sophisticated analysis,

01:09:20

or anything that you or anyone else thinks is a waste of time. Tell me about that because that is Beautiful. Love that in a in in a, job bust.

or anything that you or anyone else thinks is a waste of time. Tell me about that because that is Beautiful. Love that in a in in a, job bust.

01:09:29

I hate wasting people's time. One of my biggest pet peeves are these jobs. People have to sit there until five six, whatever, o'clock

I hate wasting people's time. One of my biggest pet peeves are these jobs. People have to sit there until five six, whatever, o'clock

01:09:36

and rub their fingers to leave. It's like Right. When your work is done, just leave. And don't pretend to be busy. Don't pretend like you're not on your cell phone. So I'm not gonna ask them to do anything that's not gonna be important, very important.

and rub their fingers to leave. It's like Right. When your work is done, just leave. And don't pretend to be busy. Don't pretend like you're not on your cell phone. So I'm not gonna ask them to do anything that's not gonna be important, very important.

01:09:50

Right. And they're not doing some this isn't Harvard. We're not gonna be doing these crazy financial analysis.

Right. And they're not doing some this isn't Harvard. We're not gonna be doing these crazy financial analysis.

01:09:56

Right. It's really simple. It can be done on the back of a piece of paper. Yeah. Because most of the time when you call these businesses, you're like, so what's your profit for the year. And they're like, I think it's, like, one point four.

Right. It's really simple. It can be done on the back of a piece of paper. Yeah. Because most of the time when you call these businesses, you're like, so what's your profit for the year. And they're like, I think it's, like, one point four.

01:10:06

Now let me one point six. I don't have my numbers in front of me. I either, like, And then you look and it's like, actually, you made nine hundred k last year. And they're like, yeah. I don't know what's I gotta ask my guy about that.

Now let me one point six. I don't have my numbers in front of me. I either, like, And then you look and it's like, actually, you made nine hundred k last year. And they're like, yeah. I don't know what's I gotta ask my guy about that.

01:10:17

Like, it's not like you're doing, you know, the diligence. It's like, they don't know their business. It's not like they're hiding something from you. They don't know it themselves.

Like, it's not like you're doing, you know, the diligence. It's like, they don't know their business. It's not like they're hiding something from you. They don't know it themselves.

01:10:25

It's so so common.

It's so so common.

01:10:27

Alright. So then you said a bunch of other things. You look for somebody hungry, hungry, comfortable with chaos.

Alright. So then you said a bunch of other things. You look for somebody hungry, hungry, comfortable with chaos.

01:10:33

Then here's compensation.

Then here's compensation.

01:10:34

Because some people are also like, oh, unpaid interns. That's crazy. And it's like, dude, I don't have any money. And, like, this is a these are willing and able people choosing to do this because they see some value in it for them. You said this is an unpaid internship. If you're looking for a glamorous internship in a formal prestigious work environment, this job is not for you. We are operating out of an unassuming spot in a library. I will provide letters of recommendations as well as introductions to anyone in consulting firms, banks, or private equity firms. Should you perform well?

Because some people are also like, oh, unpaid interns. That's crazy. And it's like, dude, I don't have any money. And, like, this is a these are willing and able people choosing to do this because they see some value in it for them. You said this is an unpaid internship. If you're looking for a glamorous internship in a formal prestigious work environment, this job is not for you. We are operating out of an unassuming spot in a library. I will provide letters of recommendations as well as introductions to anyone in consulting firms, banks, or private equity firms. Should you perform well?

01:11:00

Should you perform well? Yeah. Good good qualifier. Will also help you with recruiting, interviewing, and grad school prep if you want me to.

Should you perform well? Yeah. Good good qualifier. Will also help you with recruiting, interviewing, and grad school prep if you want me to.

01:11:07

Wonderful. This is wonderful. This is so good. I love seeing this.

Wonderful. This is wonderful. This is so good. I love seeing this.

01:11:10

I also have here an email you sent.

I also have here an email you sent.

01:11:14

I think you were maybe sending this to a broker.

I think you were maybe sending this to a broker.

01:11:18

But just very clear and direct to the point, you were like, hey, my name's Sarah Moore. I'm a recent business school grad living in Boston. I wanna buy a small business. That means this criteria.

But just very clear and direct to the point, you were like, hey, my name's Sarah Moore. I'm a recent business school grad living in Boston. I wanna buy a small business. That means this criteria.

01:11:26

Hundred percent of the businesses for sale. The EBITDA or seller seller earnings are one to two million. It's been profitable the last three years, and seller financing is available.

Hundred percent of the businesses for sale. The EBITDA or seller seller earnings are one to two million. It's been profitable the last three years, and seller financing is available.

01:11:35

I have preference of b I have a preference for b to b service, but this is not a requirement. I'm able to finance acquisitions below twenty five million. Please let me know if you have any listings. Like,

I have preference of b I have a preference for b to b service, but this is not a requirement. I'm able to finance acquisitions below twenty five million. Please let me know if you have any listings. Like,

01:11:43

very direct,

very direct,

01:11:44

clear. And were things like, like, how did you increase your luck? So, like, how did you put things out there to increase the amount of good things that would come inbound to you.

clear. And were things like, like, how did you increase your luck? So, like, how did you put things out there to increase the amount of good things that would come inbound to you.

01:11:54

Let's go there, actually. I I have something for you guys. I put to the side here. Okay. So People talk all the time about this industry and being a woman, and they think that it's a disadvantage.

Let's go there, actually. I I have something for you guys. I put to the side here. Okay. So People talk all the time about this industry and being a woman, and they think that it's a disadvantage.

01:12:04

Well, that's a matter of perspective.

Well, that's a matter of perspective.

01:12:06

I deliberately wanted to leverage my gender. And so

I deliberately wanted to leverage my gender. And so

01:12:09

part of that was within the broker community, it's all men usually. So I'm five nine. And I would go to only free broker events, but I would go to them in five inch heels. So I'm walking around as this six foot to Amazon. And I'd always wear like a ridiculous outfit too, like, a loud color. So when I'd call the brokers, I'd say, because they never remember They'd say who are you again? I'd say I'm that extremely

part of that was within the broker community, it's all men usually. So I'm five nine. And I would go to only free broker events, but I would go to them in five inch heels. So I'm walking around as this six foot to Amazon. And I'd always wear like a ridiculous outfit too, like, a loud color. So when I'd call the brokers, I'd say, because they never remember They'd say who are you again? I'd say I'm that extremely

01:12:32

tall chick that introduced myself to you looking for a business. There wasn't a single person that didn't remember.

tall chick that introduced myself to you looking for a business. There wasn't a single person that didn't remember.

01:12:39

That's for the brokers, but then I'm very active. So I'd be going around Boston on these blue bikes, which are free, of course. And I would be running or doing whatever. And I wore this sweatshirt

That's for the brokers, but then I'm very active. So I'd be going around Boston on these blue bikes, which are free, of course. And I would be running or doing whatever. And I wore this sweatshirt

01:12:48

a version of this too, like, every day.

a version of this too, like, every day.

01:12:51

I wanna buy your business.

I wanna buy your business.

01:12:53

And then the back was my number. I it was an interesting experience with this. Yeah. Anywhere? You were born. Anything to get your site? Was anything free where I can I wanted the world to know I am looking to buy in business? I don't even serious.

And then the back was my number. I it was an interesting experience with this. Yeah. Anywhere? You were born. Anything to get your site? Was anything free where I can I wanted the world to know I am looking to buy in business? I don't even serious.

01:13:07

Did you,

Did you,

01:13:09

get any good inbound from this? Was that, like, did somebody call you? Being like, hey. I just saw you ride by me on a bike, I think I caught this number. Correct? I'd like to sell you my business.

get any good inbound from this? Was that, like, did somebody call you? Being like, hey. I just saw you ride by me on a bike, I think I caught this number. Correct? I'd like to sell you my business.

01:13:18

It's funny. I I didn't think it was working, but you'd be amazed at what comes out of the woodwork.

It's funny. I I didn't think it was working, but you'd be amazed at what comes out of the woodwork.

01:13:23

There's actually somebody that came over and said, you know what? My my dad asked me about whether or not this was actually a legitimate business. Like, are you actually looking to buy something?

There's actually somebody that came over and said, you know what? My my dad asked me about whether or not this was actually a legitimate business. Like, are you actually looking to buy something?

01:13:33

And that worked out. And then I faxed

And that worked out. And then I faxed

01:13:36

everybody.

everybody.

01:13:37

That was one of the interns idea to send out mass faxes

That was one of the interns idea to send out mass faxes

01:13:41

And part of the faxing campaign was just putting anything that will get their attention. So part of it, I did put my picture hunt there. And I'd say we wanna buy your business And I told you this to this day, I have people that recognize me from those taxes.

And part of the faxing campaign was just putting anything that will get their attention. So part of it, I did put my picture hunt there. And I'd say we wanna buy your business And I told you this to this day, I have people that recognize me from those taxes.

01:13:56

People in the mail that I work in said, wait a second. I was wondering why you so familiar. Did you try to buy my business? Like, people on my street to this day in downtown Boston will say, You're that girl that was wearing that sweatshirt or you're that girl that was faxing me all the time. That's what I wanted. Unfortunately,

People in the mail that I work in said, wait a second. I was wondering why you so familiar. Did you try to buy my business? Like, people on my street to this day in downtown Boston will say, You're that girl that was wearing that sweatshirt or you're that girl that was faxing me all the time. That's what I wanted. Unfortunately,

01:14:16

I I I a lot of those,

I I I a lot of those,

01:14:18

replies came back after I bought a business, but I was just that was what I was really hoping for somebody to see it and know I was serious. Well, that's brilliant because you're looking for these kind of,

replies came back after I bought a business, but I was just that was what I was really hoping for somebody to see it and know I was serious. Well, that's brilliant because you're looking for these kind of,

01:14:28

long standing,

long standing,

01:14:29

sort of boring, b to b service businesses, They have fax machines. Yes. Nothing interesting is coming through the fax machine. So it's a completely untapped

sort of boring, b to b service businesses, They have fax machines. Yes. Nothing interesting is coming through the fax machine. So it's a completely untapped

01:14:37

unsaturated

unsaturated

01:14:38

channel.

channel.

01:14:39

You're like and I'm gonna turn my disadvantages into advantages. Okay. People say the disadvantage to be a woman. You're not gonna be taken seriously blah blah blah. You're you're not gonna be included in whatever. Well, I'm also gonna stand out if I'm the minority. Right? Like, I'm gonna be different than everybody else, and I'm gonna use the sort of psychology to my favor here. And I love that you did that or not, like, shy about that because I think a lot of people are very shy about things like this. And, I love that you did that. You faxing a picture

You're like and I'm gonna turn my disadvantages into advantages. Okay. People say the disadvantage to be a woman. You're not gonna be taken seriously blah blah blah. You're you're not gonna be included in whatever. Well, I'm also gonna stand out if I'm the minority. Right? Like, I'm gonna be different than everybody else, and I'm gonna use the sort of psychology to my favor here. And I love that you did that or not, like, shy about that because I think a lot of people are very shy about things like this. And, I love that you did that. You faxing a picture

01:15:06

is to me, like, it's in the all time

is to me, like, it's in the all time

01:15:08

hustle moves. And I'll also say it doesn't matter if some of this stuff works because one

hustle moves. And I'll also say it doesn't matter if some of this stuff works because one

01:15:16

life motto, do it for the story. I think that's that's a that's an already just like a winning thing to do. It's just do things for the story. And two is There's something that comes with the mentality of nothing is off limits. I will do anything. I am all fucking in, and it's a signal to yourself. It's a signal to your interns and your team. It's a signal to everybody in the world that I am all fucking in and

life motto, do it for the story. I think that's that's a that's an already just like a winning thing to do. It's just do things for the story. And two is There's something that comes with the mentality of nothing is off limits. I will do anything. I am all fucking in, and it's a signal to yourself. It's a signal to your interns and your team. It's a signal to everybody in the world that I am all fucking in and

01:15:40

no idea is off limits. No idea is too dumb. No idea is too too out there too too, you know, too loud. No. No. We are everything's on the table as as a thing that we might do. And I think that is the value of some of these things, whether it's the lead that actually brings in the business or not is kinda secondary. And I love that you did that. Anything, Sean. Truly, I was shameless.

no idea is off limits. No idea is too dumb. No idea is too too out there too too, you know, too loud. No. No. We are everything's on the table as as a thing that we might do. And I think that is the value of some of these things, whether it's the lead that actually brings in the business or not is kinda secondary. And I love that you did that. Anything, Sean. Truly, I was shameless.

01:16:04

If I had anything I could throw out there, I was throwing it out there. Whatever stuck, I was okay with. Hey. I'm Sarah Sarah Moore. Five foot nine, brunette, if that's your thing. Yeah. I would love to buy your pest control business.

If I had anything I could throw out there, I was throwing it out there. Whatever stuck, I was okay with. Hey. I'm Sarah Sarah Moore. Five foot nine, brunette, if that's your thing. Yeah. I would love to buy your pest control business.

01:16:16

Truly. Whatever it takes And if I could find out maybe the profits of your business, I'd be happy to join you for a coffee. Let's let's do this. That's so, so funny. Yeah. And if you could leave

Truly. Whatever it takes And if I could find out maybe the profits of your business, I'd be happy to join you for a coffee. Let's let's do this. That's so, so funny. Yeah. And if you could leave

01:16:27

any listeners of this with one, I don't know, message or takeaway. What's what's your kind of what's your message? What's your

any listeners of this with one, I don't know, message or takeaway. What's what's your kind of what's your message? What's your

01:16:34

What's the last thing you want us to relieve in people's minds here? So my biggest value is freedom.

What's the last thing you want us to relieve in people's minds here? So my biggest value is freedom.

01:16:41

This country was not founded on quality despite how things seem now with the culture. It was founded on freedom, and part of freedom is using everything

This country was not founded on quality despite how things seem now with the culture. It was founded on freedom, and part of freedom is using everything

01:16:51

at your disposal. So gender, sex, age, whatever makes you you,

at your disposal. So gender, sex, age, whatever makes you you,

01:16:56

you can use any of those things to Literally pull yourself up by your bootstraps and make your life while you want it. This industry I can promise you is one of those industries You don't have to have Harvard MBA. What made me successful at this, I really think was largely my upbringing.

you can use any of those things to Literally pull yourself up by your bootstraps and make your life while you want it. This industry I can promise you is one of those industries You don't have to have Harvard MBA. What made me successful at this, I really think was largely my upbringing.

01:17:13

Those things weren't taught to me at Harvard to get a business. The things I do day to day were not taught to me at Harvard. They were taught at the cliche school of hard knocks. So if you wanna be free,

Those things weren't taught to me at Harvard to get a business. The things I do day to day were not taught to me at Harvard. They were taught at the cliche school of hard knocks. So if you wanna be free,

01:17:24

pursue this route, freedom is not free. It's gonna cost you time. It's gonna cost you like a lot of effort, but I can promise you that anyone that wants to do this can do this if they really put their all into it.

pursue this route, freedom is not free. It's gonna cost you time. It's gonna cost you like a lot of effort, but I can promise you that anyone that wants to do this can do this if they really put their all into it.

01:17:37

And normally, I say at the end, how should people follow you or reach you? But you don't really have social media. And I think we may not want people to be reaching you after this. So, like, what's your message? Is it

And normally, I say at the end, how should people follow you or reach you? But you don't really have social media. And I think we may not want people to be reaching you after this. So, like, what's your message? Is it

01:17:48

leaving the fuck alone? Is it stay away?

leaving the fuck alone? Is it stay away?

01:17:52

Yeah. Do you want to be contacted from this? What what what would you like? My biggest thing, I I've said what I want is for anyone who wants to pursue this career path. I want everyone to have a fair opportunity to do so, which is why I'm talking about it. I'm going to give people within a q and a type format detailed information to answer all the questions I get, but we have truly experienced

Yeah. Do you want to be contacted from this? What what what would you like? My biggest thing, I I've said what I want is for anyone who wants to pursue this career path. I want everyone to have a fair opportunity to do so, which is why I'm talking about it. I'm going to give people within a q and a type format detailed information to answer all the questions I get, but we have truly experienced

01:18:12

this crazy amount of volume on my in my inbox, on my LinkedIn of messages like thousands.

this crazy amount of volume on my in my inbox, on my LinkedIn of messages like thousands.

01:18:18

And it really breaks my heart not being able to get back to all of them. So I'm doing a mass reply. That's that's the idea here. We're gonna give you as much information as we possibly can. But please understand that I cannot respond to all these inquiries. Like, I have a full time job. Like, I own other companies too. We're very busy. So the biggest thing is please do not contact our business. Please do not show up at the business. We're gonna create a Google doc. Something for you guys to fill out. If you want information, we'll send it to you. But I I just can't get pecked everybody. Like, yeah, I'm not used to this. I went I'm like a nobody. So I'm not used to all this attention and all these inbound inquiries. I can't I can't respond to them all. I love to. I really would, but I can't we're gonna put a form in the description here that'll be, like, people could fill that in. You'll send them a blast. And Amazing. If there are people who fill out that form,

And it really breaks my heart not being able to get back to all of them. So I'm doing a mass reply. That's that's the idea here. We're gonna give you as much information as we possibly can. But please understand that I cannot respond to all these inquiries. Like, I have a full time job. Like, I own other companies too. We're very busy. So the biggest thing is please do not contact our business. Please do not show up at the business. We're gonna create a Google doc. Something for you guys to fill out. If you want information, we'll send it to you. But I I just can't get pecked everybody. Like, yeah, I'm not used to this. I went I'm like a nobody. So I'm not used to all this attention and all these inbound inquiries. I can't I can't respond to them all. I love to. I really would, but I can't we're gonna put a form in the description here that'll be, like, people could fill that in. You'll send them a blast. And Amazing. If there are people who fill out that form,

01:19:07

I might cherry pick a couple of people and be like, hey, if you're serious about this, like, I'll help you do it. Like, I Yes. I don't I I'm I'm taking a break from running companies,

I might cherry pick a couple of people and be like, hey, if you're serious about this, like, I'll help you do it. Like, I Yes. I don't I I'm I'm taking a break from running companies,

01:19:16

you know, sold our last company last year. I don't wanna start a new company right now, but I do wanna do fun fun projects. So one of the fun things is helping people buy businesses. That's, one of the things that is pretty pretty dope because you learn about all these niche businesses. You get, like, the free MBA.

you know, sold our last company last year. I don't wanna start a new company right now, but I do wanna do fun fun projects. So one of the fun things is helping people buy businesses. That's, one of the things that is pretty pretty dope because you learn about all these niche businesses. You get, like, the free MBA.

01:19:30

Right.

Right.

01:19:31

Yeah. So so I think it's a good time. You learn so much searching when I hear about people failing at this. It's like you really can't fail unless you get investors, of course, but you really can't. I I mean, The amount, we still laugh at some of the businesses out there and you view the world differently. You view. Like, I think of the freeway now and the the lines on the freeway and the signs on the freeway. Somebody made all of that. Right. Like, these Christians come in like, wow. God made this and I'm thinking that and all these businesses made, like, all this stuff that we're looking at and using. It's kinda wild. Right. You're like, no. That's Trent in Cincinnati. He does that. He what do you mean?

Yeah. So so I think it's a good time. You learn so much searching when I hear about people failing at this. It's like you really can't fail unless you get investors, of course, but you really can't. I I mean, The amount, we still laugh at some of the businesses out there and you view the world differently. You view. Like, I think of the freeway now and the the lines on the freeway and the signs on the freeway. Somebody made all of that. Right. Like, these Christians come in like, wow. God made this and I'm thinking that and all these businesses made, like, all this stuff that we're looking at and using. It's kinda wild. Right. You're like, no. That's Trent in Cincinnati. He does that. He what do you mean?

01:20:07

This he has a name.

This he has a name.

01:20:09

Alright. Sarah, thanks so much for coming on. I really appreciate it. And, really inspired by your story. So thank you for coming and telling Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

Alright. Sarah, thanks so much for coming on. I really appreciate it. And, really inspired by your story. So thank you for coming and telling Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

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