00:00

You wanna know what I am pro?

You wanna know what I am pro?

00:02

A freak show. I love a good freak show. Like, when people

A freak show. I love a good freak show. Like, when people

00:06

start fighting in the middle of the street or there's a car wreck, you know, I'm stopping. I'm gonna ask him to to pull that wreck a little closer so I could see. Like, hey, please. Can you fill me in on the back story? What's going on? Like, I love this. Go on fellas. What what do we got here?

start fighting in the middle of the street or there's a car wreck, you know, I'm stopping. I'm gonna ask him to to pull that wreck a little closer so I could see. Like, hey, please. Can you fill me in on the back story? What's going on? Like, I love this. Go on fellas. What what do we got here?

00:28

We're live. What's going on? How are you? What do you think? I guess, is this the first time we've talked

We're live. What's going on? How are you? What do you think? I guess, is this the first time we've talked

00:34

Dear Dick. Since,

Dear Dick. Since,

00:35

since you moved into a a small woman's bedroom or something, what do you what is this? Where are you?

since you moved into a a small woman's bedroom or something, what do you what is this? Where are you?

00:41

I'm visiting

I'm visiting

00:43

family for a month in Brooklyn,

family for a month in Brooklyn,

00:45

and I've had a rent a place. It's impossible finding monthly rent, like, like, like a three month rental, very hard to find. So we used Airbnb and it's the best I can do. Alright. How's it look? Does it look like Victorian or something? Yeah. It looks like like my sister had this little princess bed growing up, so it reminds you that.

and I've had a rent a place. It's impossible finding monthly rent, like, like, like a three month rental, very hard to find. So we used Airbnb and it's the best I can do. Alright. How's it look? Does it look like Victorian or something? Yeah. It looks like like my sister had this little princess bed growing up, so it reminds you that.

01:03

What,

What,

01:04

what you got today? You gotta, I could see you're eager for something. What do you what do you have? I'm eager for something.

what you got today? You gotta, I could see you're eager for something. What do you what do you have? I'm eager for something.

01:12

let me preface this by saying, I'm not a political guy. I'm not really conservative. I'm not really liberal

let me preface this by saying, I'm not a political guy. I'm not really conservative. I'm not really liberal

01:19

I'm not pro vaccine. I'm not anti vaccine.

I'm not pro vaccine. I'm not anti vaccine.

01:22

Like, I'm not I'm not liberal, I'm not conservative. I'm best described as aggressive.

Like, I'm not I'm not liberal, I'm not conservative. I'm best described as aggressive.

01:28

I'm really I I, like, not only do I I I just don't care. It's the big, but you wanna know what I am pro

I'm really I I, like, not only do I I I just don't care. It's the big, but you wanna know what I am pro

01:35

a freak show. I love a good freak show. Like, when people

a freak show. I love a good freak show. Like, when people

01:53

When I yeah. When I flew here, I I flew here. I you know, when I download TV on my YouTube app, It was three episodes of Cox. That's the type of guy I am.

When I yeah. When I flew here, I I flew here. I you know, when I download TV on my YouTube app, It was three episodes of Cox. That's the type of guy I am.

02:05

So what's cut your eye? What's the freak show that's cut your eye? So, basically, this Joe rogan,

So what's cut your eye? What's the freak show that's cut your eye? So, basically, this Joe rogan,

02:10

Kennedy thing. So here's the background. Robert f Kennedy.

Kennedy thing. So here's the background. Robert f Kennedy.

02:15

You know, he's he's he's Kennedy junior. I don't I don't know what his acronym is. He needs a good, like r r f k junior RFKJ.

You know, he's he's he's Kennedy junior. I don't I don't know what his acronym is. He needs a good, like r r f k junior RFKJ.

02:21

Is that it?

Is that it?

02:23

So, basically, this guy, he I actually saw him talk a couple times because I, like, went through an obsession with the Kennedy family. But he's Robert Kennedy's,

So, basically, this guy, he I actually saw him talk a couple times because I, like, went through an obsession with the Kennedy family. But he's Robert Kennedy's,

02:31

who's JFK's brother, so he's JFK's nephew.

who's JFK's brother, so he's JFK's nephew.

02:35

He's running for president now, and he's been doing the pod circuit. He went on all in, and then he recently went on Joe rogan.

He's running for president now, and he's been doing the pod circuit. He went on all in, and then he recently went on Joe rogan.

02:41

And I don't even know all the things that he said

And I don't even know all the things that he said

02:46

I don't really care that much, but He said a lot of things that could be

I don't really care that much, but He said a lot of things that could be

02:51

categorized

categorized

02:52

as anti vaccine.

as anti vaccine.

02:54

So but and here's what happened. This is the the cool part.

So but and here's what happened. This is the the cool part.

02:58

There's this famous professor

There's this famous professor

03:01

kinda, famous vaccine guy who's been tweeting all of his opinions and everything. He tweeted out that he says Spotify has stopped even sort of trying to stem Joe Rogan's vaccine misinformation.

kinda, famous vaccine guy who's been tweeting all of his opinions and everything. He tweeted out that he says Spotify has stopped even sort of trying to stem Joe Rogan's vaccine misinformation.

03:13

It's really awful. And from all the online attacks I'm I'm receiving after this podcast. It just observed, and it's clear many people believe this nonsense.

It's really awful. And from all the online attacks I'm I'm receiving after this podcast. It just observed, and it's clear many people believe this nonsense.

03:21

Now here's where it gets interesting.

Now here's where it gets interesting.

03:23

Joe rogan is a type of guy who doesn't normally respond to this type of stuff. He kinda he he seems like he's got thick skin. He doesn't really get bothered by this, but the same, on the same day, he replied. And he goes, Peter, if you claim what r f j junior said is misinformation,

Joe rogan is a type of guy who doesn't normally respond to this type of stuff. He kinda he he seems like he's got thick skin. He doesn't really get bothered by this, but the same, on the same day, he replied. And he goes, Peter, if you claim what r f j junior said is misinformation,

03:37

I'm offering you hundred thousand dollars to the charity of your choice if you're willing to come onto the pod and debate him on my show with no time limit.

I'm offering you hundred thousand dollars to the charity of your choice if you're willing to come onto the pod and debate him on my show with no time limit.

03:46

From there,

From there,

03:49

It it's snowball. So now it's up to two point six million dollars of other people. So Bill Ackman put a hundred and fifty k. Dave Rubin rubin a hundred k. Patrick bay Patrick bet David, a hundred k. I think even, like, Andrew Tate is now offering five hundred days. So now at this point Jason Calicann is coming in with a hard ten k. Try to slip that in and say, I I'm with you.

It it's snowball. So now it's up to two point six million dollars of other people. So Bill Ackman put a hundred and fifty k. Dave Rubin rubin a hundred k. Patrick bay Patrick bet David, a hundred k. I think even, like, Andrew Tate is now offering five hundred days. So now at this point Jason Calicann is coming in with a hard ten k. Try to slip that in and say, I I'm with you.

04:13

Put me down for a put me down for a buck.

Put me down for a put me down for a buck.

04:17

Yeah. Well, here's the thing. I was, like, thinking about this. I'm, like, should I hop in on this? It just, like, say some number. Like, it's gonna collect. Can I get collecting from these people? No one's collecting.

Yeah. Well, here's the thing. I was, like, thinking about this. I'm, like, should I hop in on this? It just, like, say some number. Like, it's gonna collect. Can I get collecting from these people? No one's collecting.

04:27

Yeah. How can I insert this and how can I insert myself into this situation?

Yeah. How can I insert this and how can I insert myself into this situation?

04:31

But now it's two point six million dollars

But now it's two point six million dollars

04:35

to get this guy on the show. And I'm I'm I think he's said so far that he's not going to do it. And I just thought,

to get this guy on the show. And I'm I'm I think he's said so far that he's not going to do it. And I just thought,

04:42

this is awesome. I love a good freak show. I love, like, I think that, the we actually have a presidential candidate coming in our pod soon. I don't know if you know this yet, but I've I've set it up. Don't tell me. I'd love to be surprised.

this is awesome. I love a good freak show. I love, like, I think that, the we actually have a presidential candidate coming in our pod soon. I don't know if you know this yet, but I've I've set it up. Don't tell me. I'd love to be surprised.

04:55

Yeah. I love a good surprise. He

Yeah. I love a good surprise. He

04:58

he he he,

he he he,

04:59

he started a pharmaceutical company. He got his name's Vivec. And, he, like, he he dm ed me, like, six or twelve months ago saying he's gonna run for president,

he started a pharmaceutical company. He got his name's Vivec. And, he, like, he he dm ed me, like, six or twelve months ago saying he's gonna run for president,

05:08

and I, like, laughed at it. I didn't laugh at it. I just didn't even respond, which is worse. You know what I'd love to do? Because,

and I, like, laughed at it. I didn't laugh at it. I just didn't even respond, which is worse. You know what I'd love to do? Because,

05:14

I think that guy's kinda interesting,

I think that guy's kinda interesting,

05:16

but I think what would be more interesting is if we have because he's kind of, let's say, a,

but I think what would be more interesting is if we have because he's kind of, let's say, a,

05:21

you know, an upstart candidate or whatever. Like, he's, like, you know, not the favorite. He's not the leading guy.

you know, an upstart candidate or whatever. Like, he's, like, you know, not the favorite. He's not the leading guy.

05:26

I would it would be great if we had two

I would it would be great if we had two

05:29

of the Upstart candidates come on at the same time.

of the Upstart candidates come on at the same time.

05:32

And so we could debate them because it's actually kinda boring when you have one candidate come on, and,

And so we could debate them because it's actually kinda boring when you have one candidate come on, and,

05:37

They just kinda monologue their piece for for for a very long time. Like, I've seen a bunch of these guys go on podcasts, and frankly, it's kind of boring when that happens.

They just kinda monologue their piece for for for a very long time. Like, I've seen a bunch of these guys go on podcasts, and frankly, it's kind of boring when that happens.

05:46

I would love to have, like, the most Pipsqueak debate of all time.

I would love to have, like, the most Pipsqueak debate of all time.

05:52

It's, like,

It's, like,

05:53

us moderating who don't know anything about politics. The two candidates that only, like, half I'm half a percent in the polls.

us moderating who don't know anything about politics. The two candidates that only, like, half I'm half a percent in the polls.

06:00

And we're just, like, it's this is the showdown. Hundreds of dollars donated to charity.

And we're just, like, it's this is the showdown. Hundreds of dollars donated to charity.

06:06

What's the question gonna be? Like, what's your opinion on car crashes? Like, we don't know anything. Like,

What's the question gonna be? Like, what's your opinion on car crashes? Like, we don't know anything. Like,

06:13

do you like websites? Ending of breaking bad. Good

do you like websites? Ending of breaking bad. Good

06:16

or a little underwhelming.

or a little underwhelming.

06:22

Call your wife right now. I wanna talk to her. I wanna see what she's gotta say about you.

Call your wife right now. I wanna talk to her. I wanna see what she's gotta say about you.

06:28

Dude, like, we don't know anything. But last time, what was the Asian guy who ran last year who, like, said he loved math? Andrea.

Dude, like, we don't know anything. But last time, what was the Asian guy who ran last year who, like, said he loved math? Andrea.

06:35

Yeah, dude.

Yeah, dude.

06:36

Andrew just

Andrew just

06:38

did he run and say, I love math? I mean, that's just like

did he run and say, I love math? I mean, that's just like

06:41

I think that was like his slogan. It was like, make math great again. I thought that's what it was. But he he messaged me also. He's, like, a year before well, he messaged me before,

I think that was like his slogan. It was like, make math great again. I thought that's what it was. But he he messaged me also. He's, like, a year before well, he messaged me before,

06:51

like, one of our events, hustle County, he's like, hey, I'm gonna run for president. Can I come talk? And I was, like, wanted you to be VP?

like, one of our events, hustle County, he's like, hey, I'm gonna run for president. Can I come talk? And I was, like, wanted you to be VP?

06:57

I was like, dude, you're gonna make me look stupid by some crazy guy saying he's gonna run for president. You're like that guy. I'm street who, like, holds up a sign. You know, it says, like, aliens are coming. I can't associate with that. And then turns out he kinda made a good run. And so this time, I was, like, I have to take this at least a little seriously. And so that's why we have to have Vivic on. But, yeah, what are we gonna have two guys being like,

I was like, dude, you're gonna make me look stupid by some crazy guy saying he's gonna run for president. You're like that guy. I'm street who, like, holds up a sign. You know, it says, like, aliens are coming. I can't associate with that. And then turns out he kinda made a good run. And so this time, I was, like, I have to take this at least a little seriously. And so that's why we have to have Vivic on. But, yeah, what are we gonna have two guys being like,

07:17

dot coms or dot govs?

dot coms or dot govs?

07:21

You asked about their workout routines. We're gonna compare you on things that we value in other men.

You asked about their workout routines. We're gonna compare you on things that we value in other men.

07:27

you know, like, here's the situation.

you know, like, here's the situation.

07:30

Person breaks into your And we just see how they react. And the reason I'm bringing this up is I'm not one of these guys that says, like, oh, like, I think Jason Calcanus said this. He's like,

Person breaks into your And we just see how they react. And the reason I'm bringing this up is I'm not one of these guys that says, like, oh, like, I think Jason Calcanus said this. He's like,

07:40

podcasts are gonna shape the next presidential election. She said

podcasts are gonna shape the next presidential election. She said

07:44

the next president will be will will be decided off of podcasts or something ridiculous like that. Let me let me let me let me look at By the way, do we have a little beef with Jason Calcanis? He's kinda sliding into our mentions here. He's he's coming in a little hot. I gotta say.

the next president will be will will be decided off of podcasts or something ridiculous like that. Let me let me let me let me look at By the way, do we have a little beef with Jason Calcanis? He's kinda sliding into our mentions here. He's he's coming in a little hot. I gotta say.

08:00

I like JC Calcanis, but, if if he'd like some internet beef,

I like JC Calcanis, but, if if he'd like some internet beef,

08:04

I would happily be the recipient of some internet beep. Yeah. Yeah. You're the chef boy r d of internet beep. Great. Hey. Grass fed internet beep. I mean, signed me up.

I would happily be the recipient of some internet beep. Yeah. Yeah. You're the chef boy r d of internet beep. Great. Hey. Grass fed internet beep. I mean, signed me up.

08:15

I like Jason too. I've only hung out with him a couple times and he's always he's always been nice to me, but he's been nice to me in, like, a rude uncle type of way. Where it's like Pat you on the head. He's like a compliment. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's like, oh, that podcast you have. It's really great. I think it's precious. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, he's like It's like, yeah. Jason said he love my start think he said he was cute at the end. Oh, yeah. That was stuff bad. Yeah. And so but if

I like Jason too. I've only hung out with him a couple times and he's always he's always been nice to me, but he's been nice to me in, like, a rude uncle type of way. Where it's like Pat you on the head. He's like a compliment. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's like, oh, that podcast you have. It's really great. I think it's precious. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, he's like It's like, yeah. Jason said he love my start think he said he was cute at the end. Oh, yeah. That was stuff bad. Yeah. And so but if

08:34

if

if

08:38

for the sake of entertainment, I'm happy to I'm happy to to call him out. Well, I wanna do two things. So first, on your birthday, I tweeted out, you know, just a little thing, and then he He he came into I I tweeted out a thing. I was like, yeah. Happy birthday too. And I I I made up a bunch of nicknames. I was like, the vanilla, gorilla, the long arm of the law. You know, whatever. The two percent milk himself,

for the sake of entertainment, I'm happy to I'm happy to to call him out. Well, I wanna do two things. So first, on your birthday, I tweeted out, you know, just a little thing, and then he He he came into I I tweeted out a thing. I was like, yeah. Happy birthday too. And I I I made up a bunch of nicknames. I was like, the vanilla, gorilla, the long arm of the law. You know, whatever. The two percent milk himself,

09:00

Sampar, and I was like, you know, gave gave you a little shout out like that. Just freestyling.

Sampar, and I was like, you know, gave gave you a little shout out like that. Just freestyling.

09:06

He he replies with the the the, like, think face as if

He he replies with the the the, like, think face as if

09:11

because I think and I was like, what the hell is this? What does this mean? And then somebody met they were like, oh, I think he thinks you stole his shtick from all in where he he gave them nicknames, like, the sultan of science, the queen of quinoa, whatever. Right? And, is that a Jason Calcanis trademark? Yeah. Yeah. I was like, oh, oh, yeah. You think you started Nick.

because I think and I was like, what the hell is this? What does this mean? And then somebody met they were like, oh, I think he thinks you stole his shtick from all in where he he gave them nicknames, like, the sultan of science, the queen of quinoa, whatever. Right? And, is that a Jason Calcanis trademark? Yeah. Yeah. I was like, oh, oh, yeah. You think you started Nick.

09:32

Can I nickname, like, the, like, turning left? Like, is that a thing? Like,

Can I nickname, like, the, like, turning left? Like, is that a thing? Like,

09:37

can can we can we trademark blue?

can can we can we trademark blue?

09:39

Yeah. Ridiculous. That's a little weird. So, yeah, I do think he passes it in the head and thinks he's great, but then,

Yeah. Ridiculous. That's a little weird. So, yeah, I do think he passes it in the head and thinks he's great, but then,

09:45

there was another another hilarious Jason Calicana's moment. I gotta say from Twitter. So

there was another another hilarious Jason Calicana's moment. I gotta say from Twitter. So

09:50

So I just replied and I said, I said all in. Billionaires talking about billionaire shit.

So I just replied and I said, I said all in. Billionaires talking about billionaire shit.

09:55

MFM.

MFM.

09:56

Millionaire is talking about millionaire shit. And, you know, I just, like, that's a that's a description. So people liked it, and then But someone

Millionaire is talking about millionaire shit. And, you know, I just, like, that's a that's a description. So people liked it, and then But someone

10:04

someone said, except just Years ago, Oh, you they go all in three billionaires, and their friend Jason.

someone said, except just Years ago, Oh, you they go all in three billionaires, and their friend Jason.

10:10

I was like, okay. That's a good bird. And then he came back and said,

I was like, okay. That's a good bird. And then he came back and said,

10:14

you know, a a bottom five, lamest thing you could say. He goes,

you know, a a bottom five, lamest thing you could say. He goes,

10:18

more like one billionaire and three centi millionaires.

more like one billionaire and three centi millionaires.

10:23

Whatever.

Whatever.

10:25

Roll with the punches, man. Roll with the punches. You've never wanted a centy centy millionaire. That's, like,

Roll with the punches, man. Roll with the punches. You've never wanted a centy centy millionaire. That's, like,

10:32

It's like

It's like

10:34

if I had to insult someone with a hundred million dollars, I would call them a centi millionaire.

if I had to insult someone with a hundred million dollars, I would call them a centi millionaire.

10:39

Yeah. Like, five eleven and a half. Exactly.

Yeah. Like, five eleven and a half. Exactly.

10:46

Is that what that is? That's got big five eleven energy.

Is that what that is? That's got big five eleven energy.

10:51

I do wanna challenge, by the way. I wanna challenge the all in, podcast to, to a poker game, by the way. I will play

I do wanna challenge, by the way. I wanna challenge the all in, podcast to, to a poker game, by the way. I will play

10:58

All of the all in podcasts. I'll play up all heads up and a game of poker.

All of the all in podcasts. I'll play up all heads up and a game of poker.

11:04

So I will play them heads up. I'll put up a hundred thousand dollars.

So I will play them heads up. I'll put up a hundred thousand dollars.

11:09

and if they be if if if two out of the four beat me,

and if they be if if if two out of the four beat me,

11:15

they get a they get a hundred hundred grand. But if I beat three or four out of the four. I get a hundred grand from them. They each out they only have to put up twenty five k each. And I'll play them heads up. Will live stream pull things? Well, I've seen the whole thing, and I will go and order from centi millionaire to billionaire. So I'll play Jason first.

they get a they get a hundred hundred grand. But if I beat three or four out of the four. I get a hundred grand from them. They each out they only have to put up twenty five k each. And I'll play them heads up. Will live stream pull things? Well, I've seen the whole thing, and I will go and order from centi millionaire to billionaire. So I'll play Jason first.

11:32

I've made quick work of Jason.

I've made quick work of Jason.

11:34

And then I'll go Freeburg Sachs and then Shamat at the end because I think they think Shamat is the best player, out of them. So Are you good? I mean, I I I I know nothing about poker. Are you good? I'm better than them. That's all they need to know.

And then I'll go Freeburg Sachs and then Shamat at the end because I think they think Shamat is the best player, out of them. So Are you good? I mean, I I I I know nothing about poker. Are you good? I'm better than them. That's all they need to know.

11:48

I mean, they named their pod after it. I mean, they're they're basing their a little bit of their their brand

I mean, they named their pod after it. I mean, they're they're basing their a little bit of their their brand

11:53

on that. My nickname is the nuts. And if you know about poker, you know what that means. So so, you know, we we have our own nicknames for ourselves. Alright. Let's get back to it. I don't know why I got on this Jay's account is different. We could wrap up. We could wrap up this little part, but I'm not one to say, like, I'm not gonna make an absolute statement, like Jason did, but I do think that there is, like, we are gonna see that this the the this little freak show that's going on right now is awesome for r f k.

on that. My nickname is the nuts. And if you know about poker, you know what that means. So so, you know, we we have our own nicknames for ourselves. Alright. Let's get back to it. I don't know why I got on this Jay's account is different. We could wrap up. We could wrap up this little part, but I'm not one to say, like, I'm not gonna make an absolute statement, like Jason did, but I do think that there is, like, we are gonna see that this the the this little freak show that's going on right now is awesome for r f k.

12:18

Beneficial to him for sure. I for sure. And I think we'll see a little bit more of podcasting, have a and and here's why I think This is inside baseball. A lot of people don't realize this, but so the hustle now is read by, let's say, three and a half to four million people.

Beneficial to him for sure. I for sure. And I think we'll see a little bit more of podcasting, have a and and here's why I think This is inside baseball. A lot of people don't realize this, but so the hustle now is read by, let's say, three and a half to four million people.

12:34

I have two hundred and fifty thousand followers on Twitter. I think. Yes. Yeah. It's precious. Sean,

I have two hundred and fifty thousand followers on Twitter. I think. Yes. Yeah. It's precious. Sean,

12:39

you had, two hundred fifty thousand got two hundred and fifty thousand followers on Twitter. You have three hundred and fifty thousand. The pod, let's just say, has a hundred thousand listeners per episode.

you had, two hundred fifty thousand got two hundred and fifty thousand followers on Twitter. You have three hundred and fifty thousand. The pod, let's just say, has a hundred thousand listeners per episode.

12:49

The pod consistently

The pod consistently

12:51

out punches

out punches

12:52

in terms of engagement, all of those things, I would say. Would you agree with that? In terms of, like, people who actually

in terms of engagement, all of those things, I would say. Would you agree with that? In terms of, like, people who actually

12:59

like, trust,

like, trust,

13:02

will take action on things.

will take action on things.

13:05

Yeah. One hundred percent. So I do think

Yeah. One hundred percent. So I do think

13:08

that for people who don't realize

that for people who don't realize

13:10

or who aren't in the game, they don't realize that podcasts, I have significantly

or who aren't in the game, they don't realize that podcasts, I have significantly

13:14

more

more

13:15

influence over people than I think any other medium that I've used, or that I have access to. I don't I don't have a big YouTube. Yeah. I think YouTube would do the same, but But, yeah, podcast definitely do. I I agree with you. I think podcasts are a bit bit of a a little bit of a sleeper still, which is, you know, depending on on on who you are, but

influence over people than I think any other medium that I've used, or that I have access to. I don't I don't have a big YouTube. Yeah. I think YouTube would do the same, but But, yeah, podcast definitely do. I I agree with you. I think podcasts are a bit bit of a a little bit of a sleeper still, which is, you know, depending on on on who you are, but

13:33

other people are are shocked at how effective podcasts are at swaying opinion.

other people are are shocked at how effective podcasts are at swaying opinion.

13:39

I wanna point out a couple other things. So some people are saying

I wanna point out a couple other things. So some people are saying

13:44

Oh, Joe rogan, you're just doing this self serving thing. You're just trying to have this this freak show this debate to, like, pump your ratings.

Oh, Joe rogan, you're just doing this self serving thing. You're just trying to have this this freak show this debate to, like, pump your ratings.

13:50

I would say not true at all.

I would say not true at all.

13:53

Look at somebody's actions, not their words.

Look at somebody's actions, not their words.

13:56

Joe turned down having Trump on his podcast. He turned down having

Joe turned down having Trump on his podcast. He turned down having

14:00

other presidential candidates on his podcast that he thought would

other presidential candidates on his podcast that he thought would

14:04

just kinda be promotional or not a good conversation or bring unwanted attention

just kinda be promotional or not a good conversation or bring unwanted attention

14:09

to the pod. Like, saying no to Trump is saying no to ratings, especially in the last election when he was, or or when he was kind of on the rise.

to the pod. Like, saying no to Trump is saying no to ratings, especially in the last election when he was, or or when he was kind of on the rise.

14:17

And, he just said, you know, I'd rather not. I'd rather not do that. I'm not sure I'm the right person to moderate that debate. And,

And, he just said, you know, I'd rather not. I'd rather not do that. I'm not sure I'm the right person to moderate that debate. And,

14:24

you know, I don't think that they would be truthful. I think they would talk talking points, you know, if I had Hillary or Biden on.

you know, I don't think that they would be truthful. I think they would talk talking points, you know, if I had Hillary or Biden on.

14:30

So I'm not sure that that that would be a good thing. So I think you can't really say that Joe's just doing this for I think Joe actually

So I'm not sure that that that would be a good thing. So I think you can't really say that Joe's just doing this for I think Joe actually

14:37

I think Joe actually thinks you're r f k. I think he actually sides with r f k and says, alright. If you're gonna say this guy's full of shit, come explain why and let him let him argue with you and let's see where where it lands. That's the first thing.

I think Joe actually thinks you're r f k. I think he actually sides with r f k and says, alright. If you're gonna say this guy's full of shit, come explain why and let him let him argue with you and let's see where where it lands. That's the first thing.

14:50

The second thing is, have you seen this guy, this the scientist? I saw what he looks like. He looks like I would think a sign like, I mean, he just looks like a a a nerd. Right? Like an older nerd. Yeah. It looks like a guy, like, cosplaying Neil Degrasse Tyson. So he,

The second thing is, have you seen this guy, this the scientist? I saw what he looks like. He looks like I would think a sign like, I mean, he just looks like a a a nerd. Right? Like an older nerd. Yeah. It looks like a guy, like, cosplaying Neil Degrasse Tyson. So he,

15:04

so check out this clip. Do you take care of your immune system in other ways? Do you take probiotics?

so check out this clip. Do you take care of your immune system in other ways? Do you take probiotics?

15:10

Are you cautious about your diet? I'm not as cautious about my diet as I should be. I'm a junk food addict. That seems ridiculous for someone who works with health. Yeah. Yeah. What's going on with you, man? Sometimes, man. I just don't get it right.

Are you cautious about your diet? I'm not as cautious about my diet as I should be. I'm a junk food addict. That seems ridiculous for someone who works with health. Yeah. Yeah. What's going on with you, man? Sometimes, man. I just don't get it right.

15:25

So you live in large, we call it. Like that mouth pleasure so much. You're willing to sacrifice a little bit of health. I am. Yeah. You know, I, you know, I I can I have to concede that's the case? Do you take vitamins? I don't take vitamins. Really? Yeah. Wow. I think they What about essential fatty acids, which are great for your brain, fish oil, all these different things that are fantastic. I'm I'm not gonna I'm not gonna argue with you. You got you you got you got you got it you got it over me. Yeah. That's listen, but it would you would have a much better argument.

So you live in large, we call it. Like that mouth pleasure so much. You're willing to sacrifice a little bit of health. I am. Yeah. You know, I, you know, I I can I have to concede that's the case? Do you take vitamins? I don't take vitamins. Really? Yeah. Wow. I think they What about essential fatty acids, which are great for your brain, fish oil, all these different things that are fantastic. I'm I'm not gonna I'm not gonna argue with you. You got you you got you got you got it you got it over me. Yeah. That's listen, but it would you would have a much better argument.

15:57

You're making my wife's day here. If you're taking care of your a hundred percent. But you still need but you still need your vaccines.

You're making my wife's day here. If you're taking care of your a hundred percent. But you still need but you still need your vaccines.

16:04

I'm sure you do, but vaccines aren't gonna prevent cancer. No. That's true. We're gonna get you healthy, buddy. Yeah. Can't be pushing only chemicals and injectable forms to facilitate health. Fair enough. Yeah. They're not chemicals or vaccines. Oh, I'm sorry. What's in them? What? It's not I mean, it's some sort of chemical no. No other antigen. Right? They're they're -- They're fluid. -- mac macromolecules.

I'm sure you do, but vaccines aren't gonna prevent cancer. No. That's true. We're gonna get you healthy, buddy. Yeah. Can't be pushing only chemicals and injectable forms to facilitate health. Fair enough. Yeah. They're not chemicals or vaccines. Oh, I'm sorry. What's in them? What? It's not I mean, it's some sort of chemical no. No other antigen. Right? They're they're -- They're fluid. -- mac macromolecules.

16:27

What's the liquids?

What's the liquids?

16:29

Typically it would be saline or, you know, salt water. So it's him on rogan. That's the same scientist, I believe, on rogan, and, in the past.

Typically it would be saline or, you know, salt water. So it's him on rogan. That's the same scientist, I believe, on rogan, and, in the past.

16:38

Peter, his agent, everything. Peter, sir Hoats.

Peter, his agent, everything. Peter, sir Hoats.

16:40

So he's he's talking, and he's talking about vaccine vaccines. And,

So he's he's talking, and he's talking about vaccine vaccines. And,

16:45

he says something about he says something about he he's very pro vaccine. So he's like, says something vaccines. And Joe's like, yeah, but, you know, like, not everybody feels good. Like, putting chemicals in the body. He's like, oh, it's not chemicals. It's,

he says something about he says something about he he's very pro vaccine. So he's like, says something vaccines. And Joe's like, yeah, but, you know, like, not everybody feels good. Like, putting chemicals in the body. He's like, oh, it's not chemicals. It's,

16:55

these are antigens. These are, you know, cells. And he's like, okay. Well, you know what I mean? Like, just putting something else in your body. Like, you know, Are you taking care of the main things? And he asked Peter, he goes, he goes, do you do you do other things,

these are antigens. These are, you know, cells. And he's like, okay. Well, you know what I mean? Like, just putting something else in your body. Like, you know, Are you taking care of the main things? And he asked Peter, he goes, he goes, do you do you do other things,

17:05

to be healthy? Cause, like, Peter's kind of like, you know, he's circular in shape. And so,

to be healthy? Cause, like, Peter's kind of like, you know, he's circular in shape. And so,

17:12

and he's like, well, you know, I I do I I dabble in junk food, and Joe just starts pressing him. And I've never really seen Joe do this, but I think he wanted to make a point He's like, how how much are we talking? Like, once in a while or, like, every day? He's like, no. Not every day. Like, he's like, so how often?

and he's like, well, you know, I I do I I dabble in junk food, and Joe just starts pressing him. And I've never really seen Joe do this, but I think he wanted to make a point He's like, how how much are we talking? Like, once in a while or, like, every day? He's like, no. Not every day. Like, he's like, so how often?

17:28

And he's like, I don't know. Like, every other day? He's like, what do you what do you have? He's like, potato chips or, you know, candy or whatever. And he's like, do you exercise? And he's like, you're basically this guy over, like, a two minute period is, like, Yeah. I eat like shit and I don't exercise.

And he's like, I don't know. Like, every other day? He's like, what do you what do you have? He's like, potato chips or, you know, candy or whatever. And he's like, do you exercise? And he's like, you're basically this guy over, like, a two minute period is, like, Yeah. I eat like shit and I don't exercise.

17:45

And Joe's like, isn't that crazy? Like, shouldn't you

And Joe's like, isn't that crazy? Like, shouldn't you

17:48

like, you know better than that. Right? Like, you're saying people are crazy for not taking vaccines or pushing against them, but, like, you are not doing the basics of human health. Like, you're not exercising. You're not eating in a nutritious way. Like, don't you see that that's a problem? He's like, yeah, I should. You know, no one's perfect.

like, you know better than that. Right? Like, you're saying people are crazy for not taking vaccines or pushing against them, but, like, you are not doing the basics of human health. Like, you're not exercising. You're not eating in a nutritious way. Like, don't you see that that's a problem? He's like, yeah, I should. You know, no one's perfect.

18:05

And he's like, he's like, do you really just love that mouth pleasure so much that you and he, like, goes in on him a little bit, which -- Oh, he's so far. -- which I've never seen Joe do. He's like, generally,

And he's like, he's like, do you really just love that mouth pleasure so much that you and he, like, goes in on him a little bit, which -- Oh, he's so far. -- which I've never seen Joe do. He's like, generally,

18:14

quite, like, amenable. Like, you know, he's not really doesn't really do that. But I think for him, it is like a, you know, he plants a flag around, like, You gotta he's like, it's non negotiable. Like, you know, he's like, you know, for me, I travel somewhere. First thing I do is I go to the gym. It's just unnegotiable. It's just something I do. And then the other guy goes, yeah, I do that too. And I was like, no. I don't think you do that too.

quite, like, amenable. Like, you know, he's not really doesn't really do that. But I think for him, it is like a, you know, he plants a flag around, like, You gotta he's like, it's non negotiable. Like, you know, he's like, you know, for me, I travel somewhere. First thing I do is I go to the gym. It's just unnegotiable. It's just something I do. And then the other guy goes, yeah, I do that too. And I was like, no. I don't think you do that too.

18:36

Like, you're gonna tell him, look at his face like, yeah, but it's different maybe the way I'm doing it and the way you're doing it because look at what's happening here.

Like, you're gonna tell him, look at his face like, yeah, but it's different maybe the way I'm doing it and the way you're doing it because look at what's happening here.

18:44

Dude, whenever I, when I go and pick which doctors I'm gonna use, like, when I moved to a new city or something, I definitely

Dude, whenever I, when I go and pick which doctors I'm gonna use, like, when I moved to a new city or something, I definitely

18:52

their body matters. Right. Right. Yeah. You don't want the bald barber.

their body matters. Right. Right. Yeah. You don't want the bald barber.

18:56

Yeah, like, I I went to this one doctor and she had this beautiful vein of her bicep. And I was like,

Yeah, like, I I went to this one doctor and she had this beautiful vein of her bicep. And I was like,

19:03

I'm in.

I'm in.

19:05

I'm in, Bailey.

I'm in, Bailey.

19:07

I was in.

I was in.

19:12

Dude, that's that's hilarious.

Dude, that's that's hilarious.

19:14

I also think that, there's some other strange stuff about this guy, like,

I also think that, there's some other strange stuff about this guy, like,

19:18

His daughter has autism, and he wrote a book called, like, Rachel's

His daughter has autism, and he wrote a book called, like, Rachel's

19:24

vaccines did cause Rachel's autism or something like that, which I just thought was like a really I don't know. I can't imagine as a parent doing that. That sounds like just very aggressive.

vaccines did cause Rachel's autism or something like that, which I just thought was like a really I don't know. I can't imagine as a parent doing that. That sounds like just very aggressive.

19:34

Anyway, just I I would say, and it's funny to see the the debate here because some people are, like, there's on both sides. There's the rogan, you know, macho bro, which is basically, like, Yeah, bro, showdown. Let's go. But, you know, you and me in the bay

Anyway, just I I would say, and it's funny to see the the debate here because some people are, like, there's on both sides. There's the rogan, you know, macho bro, which is basically, like, Yeah, bro, showdown. Let's go. But, you know, you and me in the bay

19:47

behind the school at three PM, they wanna see a fight happen. And they really just wanna see him, like, punked, is kind of like one energy. And then the other energy is, like,

behind the school at three PM, they wanna see a fight happen. And they really just wanna see him, like, punked, is kind of like one energy. And then the other energy is, like,

19:56

this is, stupid. This is not what scientists

this is, stupid. This is not what scientists

20:00

like, trying to bully a scientist into debating when that's not his skill. Like, this other guy's a he's a politician. He's gonna have talking points written for all the stuff? Well, he's not a politician. He's not a he's a wannabe politician. Well, he's, yeah, I guess, trying to be currently.

like, trying to bully a scientist into debating when that's not his skill. Like, this other guy's a he's a politician. He's gonna have talking points written for all the stuff? Well, he's not a politician. He's not a he's a wannabe politician. Well, he's, yeah, I guess, trying to be currently.

20:15

But but they're basically, like, there's one guy, like, you know,

But but they're basically, like, there's one guy, like, you know,

20:18

This is what he's doing. He's going around talking about the stuff he's been doing that. He's been giving talks on the stuff for for a long time. And this guy is, you know, trying to be a scientist. He didn't sign up to be, like, kind of a debater of the stuff.

This is what he's doing. He's going around talking about the stuff he's been doing that. He's been giving talks on the stuff for for a long time. And this guy is, you know, trying to be a scientist. He didn't sign up to be, like, kind of a debater of the stuff.

20:30

So that's, like, the other point of view, and they're sort of, like, anti bro in that way of, like, You can't, like, stop trying to make this a fight. That's, like, anti science to do that.

So that's, like, the other point of view, and they're sort of, like, anti bro in that way of, like, You can't, like, stop trying to make this a fight. That's, like, anti science to do that.

20:39

This one guy who I really like, his name is Yishan Wong. He used to be He's, like, from the the,

This one guy who I really like, his name is Yishan Wong. He used to be He's, like, from the the,

20:46

from the tech world.

from the tech world.

20:47

And he,

And he,

20:50

he worked at Facebook early on. He was the CEO of Reddit Oh, he here's a he he has a new company where he's trying to plant trees. Right? Yeah. Exactly. He's trying to change -- Like that guy. -- it changed climate by by planting trees. I just wanna read you what he said. I thought he had, I thought he had a good point. So he goes, every science tech person who's currently on the bandwagon calling for the vaccine doctor to go on rogan, a debate should be ashamed of themselves.

he worked at Facebook early on. He was the CEO of Reddit Oh, he here's a he he has a new company where he's trying to plant trees. Right? Yeah. Exactly. He's trying to change -- Like that guy. -- it changed climate by by planting trees. I just wanna read you what he said. I thought he had, I thought he had a good point. So he goes, every science tech person who's currently on the bandwagon calling for the vaccine doctor to go on rogan, a debate should be ashamed of themselves.

21:11

If you care about the truth of science, like, a kind of a podcast debate, probably the worst thing to advocate for. Usually, that argument goes something like this. If you're the Vaxdock and you're so sure you're right, you should be willing to go on and defend it. Otherwise, you lose credibility.

If you care about the truth of science, like, a kind of a podcast debate, probably the worst thing to advocate for. Usually, that argument goes something like this. If you're the Vaxdock and you're so sure you're right, you should be willing to go on and defend it. Otherwise, you lose credibility.

21:26

That sounds like a good statement,

That sounds like a good statement,

21:28

But he's, like, it's an example of what Plato, the philosopher would call,

But he's, like, it's an example of what Plato, the philosopher would call,

21:33

rhetoric's oral spell. In simple terms, what he's explaining is, like, there's a difference between what is actually the truth and what can be said in a very persuasive way.

rhetoric's oral spell. In simple terms, what he's explaining is, like, there's a difference between what is actually the truth and what can be said in a very persuasive way.

21:44

you should want a medium where it's all about who could be most persuasive.

you should want a medium where it's all about who could be most persuasive.

21:47

You should want to if you want a debate to the truth, you should do it in a way where persu your charisma, your persuasiveness, your loudness,

You should want to if you want a debate to the truth, you should do it in a way where persu your charisma, your persuasiveness, your loudness,

21:56

your on the spot thinking

your on the spot thinking

21:58

is

is

21:59

deprioritized

deprioritized

22:00

compared just, like, making your most logical argument and then letting somebody take time and refute it. And he's basically, like I caught the Malcolm Gladwell effect. You know, like, he he writes so well. And even though it's theories, I'm like, oh, it must be true. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. You when you hear somebody who's so eloquent,

compared just, like, making your most logical argument and then letting somebody take time and refute it. And he's basically, like I caught the Malcolm Gladwell effect. You know, like, he he writes so well. And even though it's theories, I'm like, oh, it must be true. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. You when you hear somebody who's so eloquent,

22:16

you can you can conflate

you can you can conflate

22:18

how nice it sounds and how persuasive it sounds for how true the actual argument is. And vice versa, somebody could be so dry and boring. That even though they're saying something that's really

how nice it sounds and how persuasive it sounds for how true the actual argument is. And vice versa, somebody could be so dry and boring. That even though they're saying something that's really

22:27

on point, the message is not received by the by the market. So he basically says, he's like, you know, if you really wanted to do this, This is what you would do. So I I guess, like, just to finish the play doh thing. It's basically,

on point, the message is not received by the by the market. So he basically says, he's like, you know, if you really wanted to do this, This is what you would do. So I I guess, like, just to finish the play doh thing. It's basically,

22:41

oratory. So just going in verbally, you know, giving, like, a speech or a presentation,

oratory. So just going in verbally, you know, giving, like, a speech or a presentation,

22:48

the medium where you're most likely to have people fall under a great orator spells.

the medium where you're most likely to have people fall under a great orator spells.

22:53

And he's like, people are more like sheep than you than you wanna think. And a great order can get people to do crazy things. And if you ever seen Hitler give a speech or, you know, Mussolini give a speech. You could see how a great order from and you've seen it in the good direction or the bad direction. How a great order can move people to do something and believe something that may not they may not have actually believed otherwise.

And he's like, people are more like sheep than you than you wanna think. And a great order can get people to do crazy things. And if you ever seen Hitler give a speech or, you know, Mussolini give a speech. You could see how a great order from and you've seen it in the good direction or the bad direction. How a great order can move people to do something and believe something that may not they may not have actually believed otherwise.

23:14

So anyways, his his point was like, if you really wanna do this, They should do it through long form boring writing. One person should write down their argument with,

So anyways, his his point was like, if you really wanna do this, They should do it through long form boring writing. One person should write down their argument with,

23:22

sources cited, give the other person time to respond to each line each paragraph of that argument. And then you'll have basically both sides of the argument written out. Nobody wants to do this because this is boring. And, if he actually wanted the truth, though, that would be the way. And I thought that that was really good. And it reminded me of something that was in companies that I had also seen from

sources cited, give the other person time to respond to each line each paragraph of that argument. And then you'll have basically both sides of the argument written out. Nobody wants to do this because this is boring. And, if he actually wanted the truth, though, that would be the way. And I thought that that was really good. And it reminded me of something that was in companies that I had also seen from

23:42

from,

from,

23:43

Yushan's blog,

Yushan's blog,

23:45

which was

which was

23:46

he was like, yeah. In companies, the same thing happens.

he was like, yeah. In companies, the same thing happens.

23:50

The person in a meeting who is

The person in a meeting who is

23:53

tall charismatic,

tall charismatic,

23:56

willing to put their opinions forward. Basically, they are a hundred percent confident in their opinion. Yeah. Exactly.

willing to put their opinions forward. Basically, they are a hundred percent confident in their opinion. Yeah. Exactly.

24:01

Sound familiar?

Sound familiar?

24:05

No. I'm not holding up a mirror right now.

No. I'm not holding up a mirror right now.

24:08

But, basically, that person is going to, like, disproportionately

But, basically, that person is going to, like, disproportionately

24:12

sway what actually happens. And,

sway what actually happens. And,

24:15

And, actually, there's another method. So he basically it's called the Delphi method. And the Delphi method is basically this method where,

And, actually, there's another method. So he basically it's called the Delphi method. And the Delphi method is basically this method where,

24:22

you bring up a topic

you bring up a topic

24:24

everybody sort of presents everybody gets the same set of facts,

everybody sort of presents everybody gets the same set of facts,

24:27

then

then

24:28

you

you

24:29

write down your initial thoughts and statements

write down your initial thoughts and statements

24:32

And then they're circulated. Everybody reads, everybody's initial thoughts and statements anonymously. You don't know who sent this, so you can't just oh, the CEOs thinks this. Okay. I guess it's right. You just judge it by the merits of the argument anonymously. Everybody reads it, and then you can go revise your statement based on new information that you've got. And you update it and you pass it around again until you get to, you know, a sort of, like,

And then they're circulated. Everybody reads, everybody's initial thoughts and statements anonymously. You don't know who sent this, so you can't just oh, the CEOs thinks this. Okay. I guess it's right. You just judge it by the merits of the argument anonymously. Everybody reads it, and then you can go revise your statement based on new information that you've got. And you update it and you pass it around again until you get to, you know, a sort of, like,

24:53

you know, what what what people believe is the strongest strongest meritocratic,

you know, what what what people believe is the strongest strongest meritocratic,

24:57

argument after several rounds. How do you spell that? It's called the what? Delphi, d e l p h I.

argument after several rounds. How do you spell that? It's called the what? Delphi, d e l p h I.

25:03

And there's a couple benefits of this. First, anonymous, so it's not just like the the the highest ranking official gets their way. Second is it's time delay.

And there's a couple benefits of this. First, anonymous, so it's not just like the the the highest ranking official gets their way. Second is it's time delay.

25:11

So you don't reward time like, for a great decision, you don't need

So you don't reward time like, for a great decision, you don't need

25:16

to think of the answer, like, right on the spot. Like, if it takes you five minutes to think of something, five minutes is nothing, but in a meeting,

to think of the answer, like, right on the spot. Like, if it takes you five minutes to think of something, five minutes is nothing, but in a meeting,

25:22

five minutes is everything. You can't just sit there quietly thinking and formulating an idea for for fifteen minutes or an hour.

five minutes is everything. You can't just sit there quietly thinking and formulating an idea for for fifteen minutes or an hour.

25:29

The meeting's over by then. And so the argument has moved on by then. So this time delay in anonymity is really important. And I love this. And,

The meeting's over by then. And so the argument has moved on by then. So this time delay in anonymity is really important. And I love this. And,

25:38

I'll tell you, I shared this with, with the CEO at Twitch. And I was like, I think we should do this. He was like, dude, I love this. This actually would solve

I'll tell you, I shared this with, with the CEO at Twitch. And I was like, I think we should do this. He was like, dude, I love this. This actually would solve

25:45

one of our biggest problems I think we have in our meeting. Which is

one of our biggest problems I think we have in our meeting. Which is

25:49

people think that my opinion is the answer, it shouldn't be. I'm actually usually the least informed on the topic because I'm the furthest away from the data.

people think that my opinion is the answer, it shouldn't be. I'm actually usually the least informed on the topic because I'm the furthest away from the data.

25:56

And secondly, like, We reward the loudest loudest mouth and not maybe the most thoughtful person who who could have an answer. It's really hard in a in a normal meeting setting to get that person to speak.

And secondly, like, We reward the loudest loudest mouth and not maybe the most thoughtful person who who could have an answer. It's really hard in a in a normal meeting setting to get that person to speak.

26:08

Then I will give you one more data point. Josh Elman, who's a an awesome dude, friend of the pod. He's a he's a VC plus, like, Now he works at Apple, but he was basically, like, the growth guy at Twitter, the growth guy at LinkedIn, the growth guy at Facebook. Like, he, like, led growth,

Then I will give you one more data point. Josh Elman, who's a an awesome dude, friend of the pod. He's a he's a VC plus, like, Now he works at Apple, but he was basically, like, the growth guy at Twitter, the growth guy at LinkedIn, the growth guy at Facebook. Like, he, like, led growth,

26:23

at, like, three or four of Robinhood.

at, like, three or four of Robinhood.

26:25

He invested in Discord. He led growth at, like, four of the biggest consumer hits they've ever been.

He invested in Discord. He led growth at, like, four of the biggest consumer hits they've ever been.

26:31

He for fun, the other, you know, while he's kind of, like, you know, just kinda goofing off now. He for fun built this Slack app that does the same thing. He's like, you know, Slack is kind of rewards the same thing. Like, whoever's online the most gets to, like, say the thing in Slack.

He for fun, the other, you know, while he's kind of, like, you know, just kinda goofing off now. He for fun built this Slack app that does the same thing. He's like, you know, Slack is kind of rewards the same thing. Like, whoever's online the most gets to, like, say the thing in Slack.

26:44

And he he created this app was like a time delay. So you anybody could prompt a question,

And he he created this app was like a time delay. So you anybody could prompt a question,

26:50

and then everybody has a certain amount of time. Like, in the question, it'll say, you have, you know, we'll we'll read the answers in four hours. So anybody could write their answer within the four hour period? What's it called? Oh, thinking time is the name of it.

and then everybody has a certain amount of time. Like, in the question, it'll say, you have, you know, we'll we'll read the answers in four hours. So anybody could write their answer within the four hour period? What's it called? Oh, thinking time is the name of it.

27:01

So just Google, Josh Sherman, thinking time. It's a Slack app. And thinking time dot org is the is the URL. And, basically, it just gave you time, and then you could say, alright. Here's what I think. I think x.

So just Google, Josh Sherman, thinking time. It's a Slack app. And thinking time dot org is the is the URL. And, basically, it just gave you time, and then you could say, alright. Here's what I think. I think x.

27:13

And then It tells you all the answers will be released together in thirty minutes. And then in thirty minutes, it posts everybody's answers at the same time to prevent groupthink.

And then It tells you all the answers will be released together in thirty minutes. And then in thirty minutes, it posts everybody's answers at the same time to prevent groupthink.

27:21

And I just love this because I think these little, like, nuances actually can really change the way any group of people interact.

And I just love this because I think these little, like, nuances actually can really change the way any group of people interact.

27:29

Because I know I'm guilty of it all the time. I'm I'm loud, I'm persuasive,

Because I know I'm guilty of it all the time. I'm I'm loud, I'm persuasive,

27:33

but that doesn't mean I'm smart. It doesn't mean I'm right. And

but that doesn't mean I'm smart. It doesn't mean I'm right. And

27:36

I, like, actively look for methods or tools to counteract that. This is,

I, like, actively look for methods or tools to counteract that. This is,

27:41

a, awesome. I'm gonna use these things. I like that.

a, awesome. I'm gonna use these things. I like that.

27:45

B,

B,

27:46

in real time, I just wanna call out what just happened. This is called a good partnership where I bring

in real time, I just wanna call out what just happened. This is called a good partnership where I bring

27:53

kinda shit.

kinda shit.

27:55

And Sean just kinda polishes that shit. And and we somehow get something amazing.

And Sean just kinda polishes that shit. And and we somehow get something amazing.

27:59

This is this is this is called chemistry, my friend. This is this how it's done. That was that was beautiful. I didn't know you knew all the that stuff, and you tied it around perfectly. I'm actually was asking those questions and I'm writing notes. I'm actually gonna go use this Thank you for your time. Yes. And the Delphi method, that's awesome. I've got a few more things, but you wanna go to Yeah. Let me do a quick one first. I got a simple business opportunity for people.

This is this is this is called chemistry, my friend. This is this how it's done. That was that was beautiful. I didn't know you knew all the that stuff, and you tied it around perfectly. I'm actually was asking those questions and I'm writing notes. I'm actually gonna go use this Thank you for your time. Yes. And the Delphi method, that's awesome. I've got a few more things, but you wanna go to Yeah. Let me do a quick one first. I got a simple business opportunity for people.

28:21

So I don't know if you know this, dude, but, so Google Analytics, which is the most popular

So I don't know if you know this, dude, but, so Google Analytics, which is the most popular

28:26

analytics tool on the planet.

analytics tool on the planet.

28:28

Is is just changed. Basically shutting down. They're not saying it's shutting down. They're like, it's changing for the worse.

Is is just changed. Basically shutting down. They're not saying it's shutting down. They're like, it's changing for the worse.

28:36

Like, I would love to see actually, I wanna film a commercial

Like, I would love to see actually, I wanna film a commercial

28:40

on behalf of all marketers out there of the Google fake Google fake Google analytics commercial where it's like, but what if

on behalf of all marketers out there of the Google fake Google fake Google analytics commercial where it's like, but what if

28:47

we made it worse in every way? What if we rethought it -- Dude. -- and removed all the key functionality

we made it worse in every way? What if we rethought it -- Dude. -- and removed all the key functionality

28:54

and replaced it -- Is it possible to use? -- with vague analytics.

and replaced it -- Is it possible to use? -- with vague analytics.

28:58

Wouldn't that be better than precise analytics? It's like and that's why people are wondering why. I think the reason why is because of all the privacy stuff, the cookie stuff. So, basically, the same think that happened to Facebook,

Wouldn't that be better than precise analytics? It's like and that's why people are wondering why. I think the reason why is because of all the privacy stuff, the cookie stuff. So, basically, the same think that happened to Facebook,

29:10

where Apple changed their rules, the iOS fourteen,

where Apple changed their rules, the iOS fourteen,

29:13

rules, and all of a sudden Facebook ad performance went down. And it was like,

rules, and all of a sudden Facebook ad performance went down. And it was like,

29:17

Yo. Genius is over there. Why why is why is performance down? And why don't you have attribution? Like, why don't we know if I spent a thousand dollars on this ad, did I make nine hundred, twelve hundred. What what did I make? Why can't you just tell me that? You know, I put your pixel on my website. You know, your Facebook, you're the biggest geniuses in the world. It's impossible. And the reason is because now legally, they're not allowed to, like, use this type of tracking that they used before where it's not a technical problem. It's a regulation problem. Meaning,

Yo. Genius is over there. Why why is why is performance down? And why don't you have attribution? Like, why don't we know if I spent a thousand dollars on this ad, did I make nine hundred, twelve hundred. What what did I make? Why can't you just tell me that? You know, I put your pixel on my website. You know, your Facebook, you're the biggest geniuses in the world. It's impossible. And the reason is because now legally, they're not allowed to, like, use this type of tracking that they used before where it's not a technical problem. It's a regulation problem. Meaning,

29:45

The site that serves the ads can't also track the users on third party websites.

The site that serves the ads can't also track the users on third party websites.

29:50

And this is why Portfolio company Triple Wale exploded.

And this is why Portfolio company Triple Wale exploded.

29:54

One of my investments exploded in popularity. It is now, like, you know, on track to be this huge winner. Because let's say you owned an e commerce store and you were using Facebook and you're spending, like, we spend hundreds of thousands on Facebook ads every month.

One of my investments exploded in popularity. It is now, like, you know, on track to be this huge winner. Because let's say you owned an e commerce store and you were using Facebook and you're spending, like, we spend hundreds of thousands on Facebook ads every month.

30:08

We we have to know is, you know, how how our Facebook ads are performing. And when Facebook's ability to track that got cut off due to regulation,

We we have to know is, you know, how how our Facebook ads are performing. And when Facebook's ability to track that got cut off due to regulation,

30:16

people were like, what's another solution? And triple o was like, hey, we have this thing called triple o pixel. We can tell you more accurately than Facebook how your ads are doing. And so everybody signed up. Triple will take off. It does amazing.

people were like, what's another solution? And triple o was like, hey, we have this thing called triple o pixel. We can tell you more accurately than Facebook how your ads are doing. And so everybody signed up. Triple will take off. It does amazing.

30:28

And so,

And so,

30:29

I think the same thing happened to Google where Google had to, because of the privacy reasons, be like, alright, You know what? We yeah. There's gonna ball Yeah. Because of the ads business, we gotta just,

I think the same thing happened to Google where Google had to, because of the privacy reasons, be like, alright, You know what? We yeah. There's gonna ball Yeah. Because of the ads business, we gotta just,

30:38

you know, lick a finger and and and guess you know, roughly you got about this much,

you know, lick a finger and and and guess you know, roughly you got about this much,

30:44

traffic, conversion, etcetera. And so,

traffic, conversion, etcetera. And so,

30:47

not great. So they're upgrading to this thing called GA four. It's called the Google Analytics lackadaisable.

not great. So they're upgrading to this thing called GA four. It's called the Google Analytics lackadaisable.

30:52

That's, like, the new update. Yeah. They're, like,

That's, like, the new update. Yeah. They're, like,

30:56

that's the update. Analytics after six beers, and it needs a nap.

that's the update. Analytics after six beers, and it needs a nap.

31:01

Yeah. And every marketer I know hates this thing. And also, nobody knows how to migrate from Google Analytics to GA four. It's like a There's, like, every time you log in to Google Analytics, there's literally, like, a ticking countdown. Like, it's, you know, season four of twenty four. It's, like,

Yeah. And every marketer I know hates this thing. And also, nobody knows how to migrate from Google Analytics to GA four. It's like a There's, like, every time you log in to Google Analytics, there's literally, like, a ticking countdown. Like, it's, you know, season four of twenty four. It's, like,

31:15

You're, like, your analytics are about to explode.

You're, like, your analytics are about to explode.

31:18

You need to go learn this new tool that, by the way, sucks.

You need to go learn this new tool that, by the way, sucks.

31:21

And you need to migrate everything over because in fourteen days, There's no more Google analytics for you. And,

And you need to migrate everything over because in fourteen days, There's no more Google analytics for you. And,

31:27

so me and a bunch of other people are like, how do you do this? And we try to migrate over, didn't

so me and a bunch of other people are like, how do you do this? And we try to migrate over, didn't

31:32

we're like, is is this working? I don't know if this is working out of the box. And I think right now, there's a very simple business opportunity for somebody to go be the GA four export expert put a ton of free content and be like, I will handle your migration for you. And you just cold email every business owner that you can think of it, maybe in the e commerce space. That's where I would start. If not e commerce, SaaS, businesses, whatever, and be like, hey.

we're like, is is this working? I don't know if this is working out of the box. And I think right now, there's a very simple business opportunity for somebody to go be the GA four export expert put a ton of free content and be like, I will handle your migration for you. And you just cold email every business owner that you can think of it, maybe in the e commerce space. That's where I would start. If not e commerce, SaaS, businesses, whatever, and be like, hey.

31:53

Do you wanna help migrating over to g a four? I'll do the whole thing for you. It's done for you. Turnkey.

Do you wanna help migrating over to g a four? I'll do the whole thing for you. It's done for you. Turnkey.

31:57

Just pay me, you know, fifteen hundred dollars and, and I'll do it. I think you could I think somebody can make a million dollars in the next six months. Just migrating people over to g a four and auditing their g a four to be like, hey. Is this set up correctly?

Just pay me, you know, fifteen hundred dollars and, and I'll do it. I think you could I think somebody can make a million dollars in the next six months. Just migrating people over to g a four and auditing their g a four to be like, hey. Is this set up correctly?

32:11

Just as a one person service business or a two person service business? I agree. I need it. I need it. We've been trying to, like, figure this out. I I don't even know how to set up reports.

Just as a one person service business or a two person service business? I agree. I need it. I need it. We've been trying to, like, figure this out. I I don't even know how to set up reports.

32:20

I was out of the game for about a year and a half, and then I came back and everything done changed. I I don't know how to do it. Did you you know what else has changed?

I was out of the game for about a year and a half, and then I came back and everything done changed. I I don't know how to do it. Did you you know what else has changed?

32:28

Pronouns and Google Analytics. What the hell just happened?

Pronouns and Google Analytics. What the hell just happened?

32:32

I take two years off. Everything changes. Business doesn't work the same way anymore.

I take two years off. Everything changes. Business doesn't work the same way anymore.

32:36

There's no office.

There's no office.

32:38

Dude, everything has changed. Another thing that's changed is newsletters. Like, people are asking me like, what do we do for this newsletter? And I'm like, dude, I don't know. It's been two years. And in that amount of time, everything has changed. Like, when we started the hustle, it was us mourning grew in the skim, And I always I don't like saying it this way because it sounds like it's a bigger deal than it is because it's not, but we kind of, like, pioneered this very small industry

Dude, everything has changed. Another thing that's changed is newsletters. Like, people are asking me like, what do we do for this newsletter? And I'm like, dude, I don't know. It's been two years. And in that amount of time, everything has changed. Like, when we started the hustle, it was us mourning grew in the skim, And I always I don't like saying it this way because it sounds like it's a bigger deal than it is because it's not, but we kind of, like, pioneered this very small industry

33:00

And now people take it seriously, and there's all these, like, agencies around it. And they tell me what they're doing, and I'm like, I don't I don't get any of that. I don't understand how any of this works. It it just things have changed very quickly. Yeah. Yeah.

And now people take it seriously, and there's all these, like, agencies around it. And they tell me what they're doing, and I'm like, I don't I don't get any of that. I don't understand how any of this works. It it just things have changed very quickly. Yeah. Yeah.

33:13

I was gonna say something, but I decided to to to

I was gonna say something, but I decided to to to

33:17

take the high road on on something. I was gonna call someone out on Twitter, but I just decided not to do it. I think you'll know who it is, but,

take the high road on on something. I was gonna call someone out on Twitter, but I just decided not to do it. I think you'll know who it is, but,

33:24

Yeah. I'll avoid it.

Yeah. I'll avoid it.

33:27

This data is wrong. April freaking time.

This data is wrong. April freaking time.

33:30

Have you heard of HubSpot?

Have you heard of HubSpot?

33:32

HubSpot is a CRM platform where everything is fully integrated. Well, I can see the client's whole history, calls, support tickets, emails. And here's a test from three days ago, I totally missed

HubSpot is a CRM platform where everything is fully integrated. Well, I can see the client's whole history, calls, support tickets, emails. And here's a test from three days ago, I totally missed

33:47

Okay. I got another thing for you. What? How would you like to hear about a business deal?

Okay. I got another thing for you. What? How would you like to hear about a business deal?

33:53

That involves

That involves

33:54

one of the goats,

one of the goats,

33:57

that involves -- I like goats. -- billions of dollars that involves

that involves -- I like goats. -- billions of dollars that involves

34:01

A messy divorce. Let me tell you the story about Michael Jordan selling,

A messy divorce. Let me tell you the story about Michael Jordan selling,

34:05

his team right now, the Charlotte Hornets. That was related to a divorce. In a roundabout way. So the story actually

his team right now, the Charlotte Hornets. That was related to a divorce. In a roundabout way. So the story actually

34:12

so so a lot of people are looking at the story right now, and they're like, Michael Jordan bought this team I think, two hundred seventy five million dollars, and it's about to sell for two billion dollars. The the the whole thing? Did he sell the whole thing? I'm a joint owner. Right? I don't think anybody no. I don't think any of the MB owners own hundred percent, but I think he's the majority owner. So he,

so so a lot of people are looking at the story right now, and they're like, Michael Jordan bought this team I think, two hundred seventy five million dollars, and it's about to sell for two billion dollars. The the the whole thing? Did he sell the whole thing? I'm a joint owner. Right? I don't think anybody no. I don't think any of the MB owners own hundred percent, but I think he's the majority owner. So he,

34:31

the valuation of the team at the time was two hundred seventy five million.

the valuation of the team at the time was two hundred seventy five million.

34:35

And he bought it, and now it's gonna sell for two billion dollars.

And he bought it, and now it's gonna sell for two billion dollars.

34:38

MJ strikes again. The go the go strikes again. The guy's gonna make, you know, more money doing this than he ever made playing. And more money on this probably than he made through his Nike deal as well. So, you know, found a new found a new way to, like, you know, double his wealth.

MJ strikes again. The go the go strikes again. The guy's gonna make, you know, more money doing this than he ever made playing. And more money on this probably than he made through his Nike deal as well. So, you know, found a new found a new way to, like, you know, double his wealth.

34:51

What's interesting is actually who owned the Hornets before

What's interesting is actually who owned the Hornets before

34:56

MJ did. So I don't know if you know, do do you know the story? Do you know who his owner was? This guy Bob Johnson. Does that sound familiar?

MJ did. So I don't know if you know, do do you know the story? Do you know who his owner was? This guy Bob Johnson. Does that sound familiar?

35:03

Most generic name race? I

Most generic name race? I

35:05

I know a Bob Jackson.

I know a Bob Jackson.

35:07

Well, do you know the one that was the richest black man in America at a at a given time?

Well, do you know the one that was the richest black man in America at a at a given time?

35:11

Well, okay. We're narrowing it down. No. But maybe He's the guy who started b. She

Well, okay. We're narrowing it down. No. But maybe He's the guy who started b. She

35:17

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I listened to his, his wife was,

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I listened to his, his wife was,

35:21

his wife was, like, also the the head honcho, I think. Right? Him and his wife kinda ran it. I'm not sure about that. So he starts,

his wife was, like, also the the head honcho, I think. Right? Him and his wife kinda ran it. I'm not sure about that. So he starts,

35:28

BT with, like,

BT with, like,

35:30

he has fifteen thousand dollars of his own money. He out in. He gets five hundred thousand dollars from a guy named John Malone.

he has fifteen thousand dollars of his own money. He out in. He gets five hundred thousand dollars from a guy named John Malone.

35:35

And he's like, look, there's no cable network. There's no channel

And he's like, look, there's no cable network. There's no channel

35:40

that's

that's

35:42

caters towards black Americans.

caters towards black Americans.

35:44

And he's like, you know, we can do this. We can build this up. And so they had music, obviously. So it's basically like the black m MTV. They had music, they had award shows, culture, whatever.

And he's like, you know, we can do this. We can build this up. And so they had music, obviously. So it's basically like the black m MTV. They had music, they had award shows, culture, whatever.

35:55

BT is a winner.

BT is a winner.

35:56

And BT wins. He sells BT to Viacom

And BT wins. He sells BT to Viacom

35:59

for three billion dollars, which is just an incredible outcome. Right? So he did he own the whole thing? Yeah. They were the, I don't know what John Malone got. I don't know if it was a loan or equity, but, like, yeah, he owned the majority of it. So

for three billion dollars, which is just an incredible outcome. Right? So he did he own the whole thing? Yeah. They were the, I don't know what John Malone got. I don't know if it was a loan or equity, but, like, yeah, he owned the majority of it. So

36:10

after everything is all all after everything settles, Bob Johnson is reportedly worth, you know, about a billion and a half dollars, one point three one to one point five billion dollars.

after everything is all all after everything settles, Bob Johnson is reportedly worth, you know, about a billion and a half dollars, one point three one to one point five billion dollars.

36:19

And he diversifies.

And he diversifies.

36:21

He puts a bunch of money

He puts a bunch of money

36:23

into,

into,

36:23

real estate. He owns hotels. He owns hotel chains. He owns,

real estate. He owns hotels. He owns hotel chains. He owns,

36:28

you know, a bunch of different, like, assets, basically.

you know, a bunch of different, like, assets, basically.

36:31

But they're all kind of, like,

But they're all kind of, like,

36:33

cash cash heavy assets. So building hotels, that was a lot.

cash cash heavy assets. So building hotels, that was a lot.

36:37

He had, like, I think, a casino type thing or, like, some some gambling thing or whatever. He needed money for that.

He had, like, I think, a casino type thing or, like, some some gambling thing or whatever. He needed money for that.

36:44

So he's put out a lot of cash, then he gets divorced.

So he's put out a lot of cash, then he gets divorced.

36:47

He gets divorced, and his wife gets four hundred million out of the one point three billion, awarded to her in the judgment.

He gets divorced, and his wife gets four hundred million out of the one point three billion, awarded to her in the judgment.

36:55

So that judge made a, you know, gave her a very nice, settlement or very nice ruling

So that judge made a, you know, gave her a very nice, settlement or very nice ruling

37:01

guess who she marries a few months later.

guess who she marries a few months later.

37:03

The judge.

The judge.

37:06

no way. No way.

no way. No way.

37:08

I don't know if it was a few months later. I shouldn't say that. Mary's the judge, which is just an incredible Wow. That's an incredible anecdote. I wasn't I honestly wasn't gonna tell the story till I heard that. I was like, oh, I gotta tell the story just because that is That's how thankful she was. That is amazing. So so

I don't know if it was a few months later. I shouldn't say that. Mary's the judge, which is just an incredible Wow. That's an incredible anecdote. I wasn't I honestly wasn't gonna tell the story till I heard that. I was like, oh, I gotta tell the story just because that is That's how thankful she was. That is amazing. So so

37:24

Did did did but then they did they freak out afterwards and appeal it? Or is that a thing that went in support? I don't think it was done. So

Did did did but then they did they freak out afterwards and appeal it? Or is that a thing that went in support? I don't think it was done. So

37:32

so he so this happens.

so he so this happens.

37:34

He buys an NBA team. So he buys the Bob Katz at the time, for three hundred million dollars.

He buys an NBA team. So he buys the Bob Katz at the time, for three hundred million dollars.

37:40

And, I think they were, like, the expansion franchise, basically. And so

And, I think they were, like, the expansion franchise, basically. And so

37:45

but they're burning money So he's losing twenty to twenty five million dollars a year. He loses another two hundred. So he buys it for three hundred, then he loses two hundred million operating the thing and just operating expenses. Which is crazy because there's this famous phrase when it comes to NBA teams that nobody's ever lost money running an NBA team, and all the owners claim they're losing money, but it's really just like, a negotiation thing against the players. They don't want anybody to know how much money they're actually making, or they'll run it at, like, a slight loss, but the franchise value is appreciating, like, crazy. So they're, like, Oh, poor us. How could we ever afford to pay for our stadium? It's like, dude, you're you bought this for three hundred million. It's now worth three billion. Like, I think you can, I think you can afford it?

but they're burning money So he's losing twenty to twenty five million dollars a year. He loses another two hundred. So he buys it for three hundred, then he loses two hundred million operating the thing and just operating expenses. Which is crazy because there's this famous phrase when it comes to NBA teams that nobody's ever lost money running an NBA team, and all the owners claim they're losing money, but it's really just like, a negotiation thing against the players. They don't want anybody to know how much money they're actually making, or they'll run it at, like, a slight loss, but the franchise value is appreciating, like, crazy. So they're, like, Oh, poor us. How could we ever afford to pay for our stadium? It's like, dude, you're you bought this for three hundred million. It's now worth three billion. Like, I think you can, I think you can afford it?

38:23

So he's losing money.

So he's losing money.

38:25

He's got all his money tied up in investments. He's got a ton of debt. He's using a ton of debt to, build this thing. He's like, alright. Look, I need to turn this team around. He hires Michael Jordan. So he's like, Mike, come come work for the Bobcats. You're from Charlotte. And, you know, come work for the local team. You you run the team. So he's Michael's running the team,

He's got all his money tied up in investments. He's got a ton of debt. He's using a ton of debt to, build this thing. He's like, alright. Look, I need to turn this team around. He hires Michael Jordan. So he's like, Mike, come come work for the Bobcats. You're from Charlotte. And, you know, come work for the local team. You you run the team. So he's Michael's running the team,

38:44

but Bob is getting stretched for cash. And, basically, he's got too much debt and his shit's all about to come due. And so he's about to lose his entire empire because he can't come up with enough money to pay off his his, his note and they're about to take all of the collateral. So he's about to lose all his hotels and his his team.

but Bob is getting stretched for cash. And, basically, he's got too much debt and his shit's all about to come due. And so he's about to lose his entire empire because he can't come up with enough money to pay off his his, his note and they're about to take all of the collateral. So he's about to lose all his hotels and his his team.

39:01

Do you think that in those situations, which has happened a lot? They go to the ex wife and they're like,

Do you think that in those situations, which has happened a lot? They go to the ex wife and they're like,

39:07

hey.

hey.

39:09

Do you remember that time that I tried to make sure you've got nothing, but you still got something.

Do you remember that time that I tried to make sure you've got nothing, but you still got something.

39:15

Can we talk? You know what I mean? Like, I wonder if there's any I wonder if I'm just, like, being close to you. We had a first date

Can we talk? You know what I mean? Like, I wonder if there's any I wonder if I'm just, like, being close to you. We had a first date

39:21

you know, why I brought you here? I just wanted to

you know, why I brought you here? I just wanted to

39:24

see if you had any of those feelings left for me because I'm about to lose it all. So

see if you had any of those feelings left for me because I'm about to lose it all. So

39:29

he's about to lose it all.

he's about to lose it all.

39:31

And he's like, okay, I need to, like, sell the team or something, but the team is losing money, and they're the worst team, they're the sorriest team. So he wants to sell it for, like, you know, three hundred fifty million or something like that. Can't find a buyer.

And he's like, okay, I need to, like, sell the team or something, but the team is losing money, and they're the worst team, they're the sorriest team. So he wants to sell it for, like, you know, three hundred fifty million or something like that. Can't find a buyer.

39:42

MJ comes to him and says, alright, I'll buy it.

MJ comes to him and says, alright, I'll buy it.

39:47

I'm gonna buy I'm gonna buy it for put down twenty five million in cash.

I'm gonna buy I'm gonna buy it for put down twenty five million in cash.

39:51

Just twenty five million, and I want it at a two hundred seventy five million dollar valuation. So he gets like a twenty five, thirty percent discount on the team. Because Bob's under pressure and has no other choice, basically. He's like, but here's what I'll do. I'll assume all the debts of the team.

Just twenty five million, and I want it at a two hundred seventy five million dollar valuation. So he gets like a twenty five, thirty percent discount on the team. Because Bob's under pressure and has no other choice, basically. He's like, but here's what I'll do. I'll assume all the debts of the team.

40:04

So I'll get you off this debt, which will relieve the pressure on you. So MJ buys this team for only twenty five million down, and now is gonna sell this thing for two billion, which is like a, you know, a hundred x cash on cash return for him buying this which is just an incredible move and yet another reason MJ is one of the goats. There's a shark.

So I'll get you off this debt, which will relieve the pressure on you. So MJ buys this team for only twenty five million down, and now is gonna sell this thing for two billion, which is like a, you know, a hundred x cash on cash return for him buying this which is just an incredible move and yet another reason MJ is one of the goats. There's a shark.

40:24

Is that soy popular? I've never heard that. No. That's not popular. That's

Is that soy popular? I've never heard that. No. That's not popular. That's

40:28

That's a that's a MFM original, an MFM classic

That's a that's a MFM original, an MFM classic

40:32

soon to be copycated

soon to be copycated

40:33

by all of our little fanboys everywhere. Who will, take this and turn this into a thread, a newsletter, a TikTok and a an IG real for themselves.

by all of our little fanboys everywhere. Who will, take this and turn this into a thread, a newsletter, a TikTok and a an IG real for themselves.

40:42

so, you know, it'll be everywhere soon. The one thing that the another interesting twist It's gonna be here's what it's gonna be called. It's gonna be called, like, Michael Jordan made money. He became a billionaire in ways that you didn't even realize were and has nothing to do with him playing and has nothing to do with Nike. Here's the story of how Michael Michael George turned twenty five million dollars. You guys have brought your hook for you too.

so, you know, it'll be everywhere soon. The one thing that the another interesting twist It's gonna be here's what it's gonna be called. It's gonna be called, like, Michael Jordan made money. He became a billionaire in ways that you didn't even realize were and has nothing to do with him playing and has nothing to do with Nike. Here's the story of how Michael Michael George turned twenty five million dollars. You guys have brought your hook for you too.

41:03

There's there is more to the story potentially. So

There's there is more to the story potentially. So

41:06

the team has sucked ever since Jordan bought them. And, like, Basically, he actually underperformed.

the team has sucked ever since Jordan bought them. And, like, Basically, he actually underperformed.

41:12

Like, the team sucked. The franchise values are down. His franchise value should be up more than it is.

Like, the team sucked. The franchise values are down. His franchise value should be up more than it is.

41:18

So he didn't actually maximize the value on it. But it just shows when you when you buy right, it's hard to, you know, hard to lose money at that point.

So he didn't actually maximize the value on it. But it just shows when you when you buy right, it's hard to, you know, hard to lose money at that point.

41:25

The other rumor is that

The other rumor is that

41:28

MJ

MJ

41:29

is only selling the team because he himself

is only selling the team because he himself

41:32

Oh, it was a bunch of money. That's the other rumor. I don't know if this is true or not, but Well, there's always these crazy conspiracy theories that he's, like, a degenerate Gambler. And, like, there's always there was a I listened to a podcast called conspiracy theories, and it was how

Oh, it was a bunch of money. That's the other rumor. I don't know if this is true or not, but Well, there's always these crazy conspiracy theories that he's, like, a degenerate Gambler. And, like, there's always there was a I listened to a podcast called conspiracy theories, and it was how

41:46

the mob,

the mob,

41:48

made him retire from the NBA or something like that. And they there was even theories that they killed his father. Right. Yeah. That's that's the conspiracy is that they killed his father because he owed money and that the commissioner told him you need to take a couple years off because we could suspend you, but that's a bad look for you and us because, you know,

made him retire from the NBA or something like that. And they there was even theories that they killed his father. Right. Yeah. That's that's the conspiracy is that they killed his father because he owed money and that the commissioner told him you need to take a couple years off because we could suspend you, but that's a bad look for you and us because, you know,

42:06

of this gambling problem, So you just disappear. So, you know, that's the that's the conspiracy theory. Who knows if that's true? The other version of this is the guy who bought the team now has got Gabe Plock and He's the guy that ran Melvin Capital, which is the the hedge fund that the editors, do the Wall Street, bets guys blew up in the GameStop thing. And so Gabe lost, like, five hundred million dollars. And that, they were his fund was about to go under, and then he gets bailed out by what's his name? Ken Griffin,

of this gambling problem, So you just disappear. So, you know, that's the that's the conspiracy theory. Who knows if that's true? The other version of this is the guy who bought the team now has got Gabe Plock and He's the guy that ran Melvin Capital, which is the the hedge fund that the editors, do the Wall Street, bets guys blew up in the GameStop thing. And so Gabe lost, like, five hundred million dollars. And that, they were his fund was about to go under, and then he gets bailed out by what's his name? Ken Griffin,

42:34

The rumor is that Michael had given Melvin Capital a lot of money, hundreds of millions of dollars to invest on his behalf, and that they had lost it. And so,

The rumor is that Michael had given Melvin Capital a lot of money, hundreds of millions of dollars to invest on his behalf, and that they had lost it. And so,

42:42

he needed cash.

he needed cash.

42:44

And so that that's why he sold it. And now he sold it to that guy. He sold it to Gabe, which is pretty crazy.

And so that that's why he sold it. And now he sold it to that guy. He sold it to Gabe, which is pretty crazy.

42:49

This is this is juicy, man. This is this is a this is a juicy grape. This is a this is a grape of a story. I don't know if this is a big mac grape. A lot of that is a lot of what what I just said is stitching together pieces because people don't come out and say everything,

This is this is juicy, man. This is this is a this is a juicy grape. This is a this is a grape of a story. I don't know if this is a big mac grape. A lot of that is a lot of what what I just said is stitching together pieces because people don't come out and say everything,

43:03

but they do say pieces. And then you kinda have to assume things in between the guys. And he's protected

but they do say pieces. And then you kinda have to assume things in between the guys. And he's protected

43:08

Jordan's protected pretty hard. Like, I remember,

Jordan's protected pretty hard. Like, I remember,

43:11

you remember that rapper Camillionaire? Yeah.

you remember that rapper Camillionaire? Yeah.

43:13

He told the story. He he, like, because, you know, rappers love, Jordan because of well, he's like a good, like, you know, a black, a black man succeeding, and they love his brand. A chameleon Air was like, nah, man, Jordan's the worst. One time, I tried to get an autograph from him, and Jordan goes, nah, I don't give autographs or take pictures with n words. And,

He told the story. He he, like, because, you know, rappers love, Jordan because of well, he's like a good, like, you know, a black, a black man succeeding, and they love his brand. A chameleon Air was like, nah, man, Jordan's the worst. One time, I tried to get an autograph from him, and Jordan goes, nah, I don't give autographs or take pictures with n words. And,

43:35

like, there's, like, the store at Camiliner was, like, and he's, like, I've at the time, he was, like, I was famous, like, Not famous enough that I thought, like, Jordan would bow down to me, but famous enough that, like, I thought maybe I would get, like, oh, nice to see you, Tabitha.

like, there's, like, the store at Camiliner was, like, and he's, like, I've at the time, he was, like, I was famous, like, Not famous enough that I thought, like, Jordan would bow down to me, but famous enough that, like, I thought maybe I would get, like, oh, nice to see you, Tabitha.

43:48

And he's like, I I got nothing. I got nothing from Jordan, and he's an asshole. And I and and I I don't remember how he explained it, but it basically I was like, oh, Jordan. Not a nice guy. Not not not nice at all. I would have thought that it was like a story of, like, everyone knows that he's a jerk on the court, but I would have thought like, oh, maybe that just, like, ends once you retire, but it sounds like maybe that's not the case. Yeah. I don't know why that would end when he retires.

And he's like, I I got nothing. I got nothing from Jordan, and he's an asshole. And I and and I I don't remember how he explained it, but it basically I was like, oh, Jordan. Not a nice guy. Not not not nice at all. I would have thought that it was like a story of, like, everyone knows that he's a jerk on the court, but I would have thought like, oh, maybe that just, like, ends once you retire, but it sounds like maybe that's not the case. Yeah. I don't know why that would end when he retires.

44:11

Okay. Yeah. So that's the, that's the Jordan story. Where do you wanna go next?

Okay. Yeah. So that's the, that's the Jordan story. Where do you wanna go next?

44:15

Alright. I have got one interesting thing. So

Alright. I have got one interesting thing. So

44:19

everyone wants to say, Sean, what's your ecom store? Tell me all about and you give out little nibbles, and you kinda tell people, you know, things are going well.

everyone wants to say, Sean, what's your ecom store? Tell me all about and you give out little nibbles, and you kinda tell people, you know, things are going well.

44:28

We wanna know what the problem with e comm and also a lot of other businesses that we talk about The things that are somewhat easy to start, the valuations are shit. Like,

We wanna know what the problem with e comm and also a lot of other businesses that we talk about The things that are somewhat easy to start, the valuations are shit. Like,

44:38

a decent e com business right now. What do you think it sells for? Five times profit? One times revenue,

a decent e com business right now. What do you think it sells for? Five times profit? One times revenue,

44:44

which is usually which is the same thing as five times profit for most of these. So

which is usually which is the same thing as five times profit for most of these. So

44:49

the thing is about is, like, a lot of these businesses that we talk about and what people initially start, particularly, like, the really crap ones, like a drop shipping or or things like that or an agency. They don't really sell for a lot of money.

the thing is about is, like, a lot of these businesses that we talk about and what people initially start, particularly, like, the really crap ones, like a drop shipping or or things like that or an agency. They don't really sell for a lot of money.

45:00

And so I like to research businesses that a can last a really long time. A lot of e com businesses well, a lot of businesses in general don't last long, particularly ones built off of Facebook and things like that.

And so I like to research businesses that a can last a really long time. A lot of e com businesses well, a lot of businesses in general don't last long, particularly ones built off of Facebook and things like that.

45:10

Or it's a struggle, at least, and also,

Or it's a struggle, at least, and also,

45:12

b, they sell for shit.

b, they sell for shit.

45:14

One type of business that I've brought up consistently is trade shows.

One type of business that I've brought up consistently is trade shows.

45:18

And the reason why is I've noticed a trend where

And the reason why is I've noticed a trend where

45:22

a trade show business can last many, many, many decades. Sometimes there's many examples of them lasting a hundred plus years.

a trade show business can last many, many, many decades. Sometimes there's many examples of them lasting a hundred plus years.

45:30

these businesses that are okay, like they're not that fast growing, but they're good.

these businesses that are okay, like they're not that fast growing, but they're good.

45:36

Man, they're consistently selling for ten, sometimes fifteen times profit, which is pretty good. That can be three times revenue. Whereas a media property, like the hustle, if it's only okay, that will sell for

Man, they're consistently selling for ten, sometimes fifteen times profit, which is pretty good. That can be three times revenue. Whereas a media property, like the hustle, if it's only okay, that will sell for

45:49

five times profit sometimes six times profit. It depends how fast it's growing, but

five times profit sometimes six times profit. It depends how fast it's growing, but

45:55

I was reading, flash and flames. It's just like tiny, tiny, tiny trade publication that I read. And they were telling the story about this guy named Tony Robinson. He started this company in nineteen ninety one. He started this company called UKI.

I was reading, flash and flames. It's just like tiny, tiny, tiny trade publication that I read. And they were telling the story about this guy named Tony Robinson. He started this company in nineteen ninety one. He started this company called UKI.

46:07

I believe it's UKI,

I believe it's UKI,

46:09

media, and it was SEO is screwed.

media, and it was SEO is screwed.

46:12

You don't wanna be Tony Robinson.

You don't wanna be Tony Robinson.

46:15

Yeah. Yeah. He's screwed for a bunch of reasons, but he, like, never never gives interviews. He's, like, a pretty low key guy, but it's called UKI

Yeah. Yeah. He's screwed for a bunch of reasons, but he, like, never never gives interviews. He's, like, a pretty low key guy, but it's called UKI

46:22

Media and Event. And you could go to the website.

Media and Event. And you could go to the website.

46:25

If you click it, it's like it looks old. It doesn't look special. And most of the people in the pictures look like they're above sixty years old.

If you click it, it's like it looks old. It doesn't look special. And most of the people in the pictures look like they're above sixty years old.

46:33

So it's, like, not, like, particularly new looking, you know, they're not at least trying to, like, be cool.

So it's, like, not, like, particularly new looking, you know, they're not at least trying to, like, be cool.

46:38

And but here's what's interesting.

And but here's what's interesting.

46:40

So they own seventeen b to b,

So they own seventeen b to b,

46:43

trade shows.

trade shows.

46:45

And they own a couple magazines, but almost all the revenue comes from these trade shows, and their biggest one is a twenty four year old thing called the automotive testing exposition or expo.

And they own a couple magazines, but almost all the revenue comes from these trade shows, and their biggest one is a twenty four year old thing called the automotive testing exposition or expo.

46:55

And it's basically this is like a niche amongst niches

And it's basically this is like a niche amongst niches

46:58

It's not a car show. It's a trade show and co a core exhibition that has,

It's not a car show. It's a trade show and co a core exhibition that has,

47:03

it's where the people making the machines that help you test

it's where the people making the machines that help you test

47:08

if your car works. So if you're building a Tesla or Ford or whatever, you're constantly testing, like, your new self driving system, or you're testing, like, I guess,

if your car works. So if you're building a Tesla or Ford or whatever, you're constantly testing, like, your new self driving system, or you're testing, like, I guess,

47:17

different new components in the LCD screen, things like that. There's people who are building machines to test that. This is a trade show for those people.

different new components in the LCD screen, things like that. There's people who are building machines to test that. This is a trade show for those people.

47:26

And I was, like, doing more research about this. And he was saying he goes, I chose,

And I was, like, doing more research about this. And he was saying he goes, I chose,

47:31

I chose specialized in transportation and avoid developing products and what's he say? The whatever. Actually, I was gonna quote something. It's not that interesting of a quote. But here's listen to the revenue.

I chose specialized in transportation and avoid developing products and what's he say? The whatever. Actually, I was gonna quote something. It's not that interesting of a quote. But here's listen to the revenue.

47:42

Two thousand nineteen, they did thirty two million with thirty percent margin. So they made ten million dollars in profit. Let's skip two thousand twenty and twenty one. They only did eight million in revenue, how they still did eight million in revenue during those periods. I don't know. Two thousand twenty two post COVID

Two thousand nineteen, they did thirty two million with thirty percent margin. So they made ten million dollars in profit. Let's skip two thousand twenty and twenty one. They only did eight million in revenue, how they still did eight million in revenue during those periods. I don't know. Two thousand twenty two post COVID

47:58

revenue of twenty six million. Same margin of around, twenty six, so that it's six point seven million in profit. Two thousand twenty three, the expectation is thirty in revenue.

revenue of twenty six million. Same margin of around, twenty six, so that it's six point seven million in profit. Two thousand twenty three, the expectation is thirty in revenue.

48:07

Nine in profit.

Nine in profit.

48:09

And there's a rumor that they're about to sell for around

And there's a rumor that they're about to sell for around

48:13

twelve times.

twelve times.

48:15

Profit. So the this thirty million dollar a year trade show business is about to sell for somewhere between a hundred and a hundred and twenty million in revenue, and he's done this multiple times. So he had one for aircraft interiors

Profit. So the this thirty million dollar a year trade show business is about to sell for somewhere between a hundred and a hundred and twenty million in revenue, and he's done this multiple times. So he had one for aircraft interiors

48:27

Expo.

Expo.

48:28

So, like, people building aircraft interiors, he sold that for ten times profit. He also had a magazine company that he sold for only four times profit, but he's done this multiple times. And there's this there's this guy in Hampton, his name's Jonathan Weiner, He's done the same thing. He did money twenty twenty. He did

So, like, people building aircraft interiors, he sold that for ten times profit. He also had a magazine company that he sold for only four times profit, but he's done this multiple times. And there's this there's this guy in Hampton, his name's Jonathan Weiner, He's done the same thing. He did money twenty twenty. He did

48:45

Shop Talk, and I think he did one more. He sold each of them for around a hundred to a hundred and fifty million dollars, and it was, like, thirteen times profit. I'm gonna ask them to come on the pod, but

Shop Talk, and I think he did one more. He sold each of them for around a hundred to a hundred and fifty million dollars, and it was, like, thirteen times profit. I'm gonna ask them to come on the pod, but

48:55

it's just crazy that these,

it's just crazy that these,

48:58

trade shows are consistently selling for ten or thirteen times profit. Now here's the the opportunity.

trade shows are consistently selling for ten or thirteen times profit. Now here's the the opportunity.

49:04

If I'm one of the if I'm listening to this pod and I'm trying to start a business, what I would do

If I'm one of the if I'm listening to this pod and I'm trying to start a business, what I would do

49:09

there's a whole lot of niche

there's a whole lot of niche

49:13

Twitter handles. There's the strip mall guy.

Twitter handles. There's the strip mall guy.

49:16

There's

There's

49:18

the used car salesperson guy. There's the used watch guy.

the used car salesperson guy. There's the used watch guy.

49:22

I don't know this for sure, but I bet It's not just you and I, like, a pop culture type of person who's just, like, paying attention because it's fun and we're outside. But I bet there's people like the strip mall guy, and I bet there's dozens and dozens of other people like that who are in these really niche in which the actual industry insiders follow them, and they get they get a kick out of them.

I don't know this for sure, but I bet It's not just you and I, like, a pop culture type of person who's just, like, paying attention because it's fun and we're outside. But I bet there's people like the strip mall guy, and I bet there's dozens and dozens of other people like that who are in these really niche in which the actual industry insiders follow them, and they get they get a kick out of them.

49:43

It could be, like, the motor home guy or it could be the, I don't know, whatever it is. I think you could partner with some of these people and build these trade shows because the way that these these particular this guy, Tony Robinson, the way that his thing works,

It could be, like, the motor home guy or it could be the, I don't know, whatever it is. I think you could partner with some of these people and build these trade shows because the way that these these particular this guy, Tony Robinson, the way that his thing works,

49:57

is I think access to the events are free. But what they do is they hire salespeople and they pay their salespeople a lot. You give them I think he even says in the article. It's like eighty grand a year base but up of you they can earn three hundred thousand dollars a year, but what they do is they sell spots

is I think access to the events are free. But what they do is they hire salespeople and they pay their salespeople a lot. You give them I think he even says in the article. It's like eighty grand a year base but up of you they can earn three hundred thousand dollars a year, but what they do is they sell spots

50:13

or booths at the at the trade show and they create a map where you can, like, see it all in in different it's just, like, real estate, different locations can get higher prices. And it's basically, like,

or booths at the at the trade show and they create a map where you can, like, see it all in in different it's just, like, real estate, different locations can get higher prices. And it's basically, like,

50:24

You know, it's not like a conference like what I used to do, hustle con or TED Talk where you're going to, like, watch content.

You know, it's not like a conference like what I used to do, hustle con or TED Talk where you're going to, like, watch content.

50:29

Like, the content's not important you might have speakers, but that's just to attract the right type of people. It's really to do business. And so this small I bet you there's a lot of, like, ten, thirty, forty million dollar a year businesses that sell components that sell to Toyota. It's like just your door handle. I don't know something.

Like, the content's not important you might have speakers, but that's just to attract the right type of people. It's really to do business. And so this small I bet you there's a lot of, like, ten, thirty, forty million dollar a year businesses that sell components that sell to Toyota. It's like just your door handle. I don't know something.

50:46

And they do business there, and they say, alright. Great. I got five leads. That was five leads. I can probably get a few million dollars if I can close one of those leads. So it's worth it for me to pay fifty thousand dollars.

And they do business there, and they say, alright. Great. I got five leads. That was five leads. I can probably get a few million dollars if I can close one of those leads. So it's worth it for me to pay fifty thousand dollars.

50:57

I think someone could do some of these trade shows with a lot of these industry insiders on Twitter. And I think that's an interesting opportunity, and I think it's significantly better than many of the other opportunities, including agencies that a lot of people are starting online.

I think someone could do some of these trade shows with a lot of these industry insiders on Twitter. And I think that's an interesting opportunity, and I think it's significantly better than many of the other opportunities, including agencies that a lot of people are starting online.

51:11

It's harder. Like, if it if there's bad weather, you're screwed, or if there's a pandemic, you're screwed, But these things can sell for way more money, and they can actually last for dozens and dozens and dozens of years. Right. So that's my pitch on trade shows and the and a small opportunity.

It's harder. Like, if it if there's bad weather, you're screwed, or if there's a pandemic, you're screwed, But these things can sell for way more money, and they can actually last for dozens and dozens and dozens of years. Right. So that's my pitch on trade shows and the and a small opportunity.

51:24

Yeah. I love it. I think that's great.

Yeah. I love it. I think that's great.

51:26

Nobody talks about trade shows more than you in my life. And, I was stunned when I heard about that guy who did Shop Talk, Monday twenty twenty, and I think they did the health care one. I forgot what that one was called.

Nobody talks about trade shows more than you in my life. And, I was stunned when I heard about that guy who did Shop Talk, Monday twenty twenty, and I think they did the health care one. I forgot what that one was called.

51:41

Those are it's really, really remarkable. I don't fully understand it, meaning,

Those are it's really, really remarkable. I don't fully understand it, meaning,

51:46

What don't you understand?

What don't you understand?

51:47

Like, let's kind of walk through it. So, basically,

Like, let's kind of walk through it. So, basically,

51:51

What's the draw to get the attendees to attend? How do you tell the what what is the value prompt for the attendees? Is it meet others in your industry? Is it see these vendors up close and personal? Is it listen to these famous peep three famous people talk? What is the core draw?

What's the draw to get the attendees to attend? How do you tell the what what is the value prompt for the attendees? Is it meet others in your industry? Is it see these vendors up close and personal? Is it listen to these famous peep three famous people talk? What is the core draw?

52:06

Well, I think it's all of the above, but let's go through each one. First, one you didn't mention is, I think sometimes it's like, oh, sick. I could justify

Well, I think it's all of the above, but let's go through each one. First, one you didn't mention is, I think sometimes it's like, oh, sick. I could justify

52:15

a free trip to Florida.

a free trip to Florida.

52:16

Like, I'm gonna go hang out with people and also, oh, hey, Bob, who is not really our competitor, but he's in our industry. He might be there. So maybe I can go and shoot the shit with and hang out with him, but I could bring, like, eight of my teammates, and we can justify this trick. I think that's definitely a thing.

Like, I'm gonna go hang out with people and also, oh, hey, Bob, who is not really our competitor, but he's in our industry. He might be there. So maybe I can go and shoot the shit with and hang out with him, but I could bring, like, eight of my teammates, and we can justify this trick. I think that's definitely a thing.

52:31

The second way that you get the so it's all about this is a marketplace. You need the attendees to be there. The second place, second way you get there is you need, like, interesting speakers. So it could even be someone who's not even related. Yeah. But it's like, oh, wow. This one person like, Gary Vaynerchuk, like, that's not really in our industry, but, like, whatever, like, I would I've always wanted to see what he had to say. Like, alright. Cool. I can get that person. And then the third one is let's just see the latest and greatest technology, and so we can spend one day, like, getting to know what's going on in our industry. But I really think a lot of times it's rooted and

The second way that you get the so it's all about this is a marketplace. You need the attendees to be there. The second place, second way you get there is you need, like, interesting speakers. So it could even be someone who's not even related. Yeah. But it's like, oh, wow. This one person like, Gary Vaynerchuk, like, that's not really in our industry, but, like, whatever, like, I would I've always wanted to see what he had to say. Like, alright. Cool. I can get that person. And then the third one is let's just see the latest and greatest technology, and so we can spend one day, like, getting to know what's going on in our industry. But I really think a lot of times it's rooted and

53:03

I wanna get out of the office, and I can justify this three thousand dollar ticket, and I can get five of my coworkers to go, and it's an easy just vacation. But in this one, they're giving away the passes for free. Is that correct? The this UK I think?

I wanna get out of the office, and I can justify this three thousand dollar ticket, and I can get five of my coworkers to go, and it's an easy just vacation. But in this one, they're giving away the passes for free. Is that correct? The this UK I think?

53:15

When I went to their website, they advertised free passes. So that's the of my research. Gotcha. Okay. And then In money twenty twenty, they charge people. Right. And so, how do they sell those tickets? How do they how do they build the brand from scratch? Is it content

When I went to their website, they advertised free passes. So that's the of my research. Gotcha. Okay. And then In money twenty twenty, they charge people. Right. And so, how do they sell those tickets? How do they how do they build the brand from scratch? Is it content

53:30

first, free content, then they lead up to it, or are they just cold emailing? What do you what do you know about how that guy jumped the wiener or whatever his name was,

first, free content, then they lead up to it, or are they just cold emailing? What do you what do you know about how that guy jumped the wiener or whatever his name was,

53:39

how they did it? Well, so that's why,

how they did it? Well, so that's why,

53:42

it helps to have some type of audience. And so what you'll notice is a lot of these companies, their trade show, and media business, So oftentimes,

it helps to have some type of audience. And so what you'll notice is a lot of these companies, their trade show, and media business, So oftentimes,

53:50

they'll create a blog or magazine in order to get some type of audience, and then they'll use that to, like, use their authority to sell tickets. But other times, I think what you can do is you can just cold email a bunch of people, to be honest. I think that in order to get Look, I still when I the first year that I did Hussicon,

they'll create a blog or magazine in order to get some type of audience, and then they'll use that to, like, use their authority to sell tickets. But other times, I think what you can do is you can just cold email a bunch of people, to be honest. I think that in order to get Look, I still when I the first year that I did Hussicon,

54:08

I charged three hundred dollars, and I was a nobody. So, like, I didn't have an email list. I had nothing. I got the right speakers, and I was able to get four hundred people to come, and that was only in six weeks' time. I think it's actually significantly

I charged three hundred dollars, and I was a nobody. So, like, I didn't have an email list. I had nothing. I got the right speakers, and I was able to get four hundred people to come, and that was only in six weeks' time. I think it's actually significantly

54:20

easier

easier

54:21

Then you think if you go into a niche to just tell a handful of people and those handful of people tell a handful of people because a really successful show in a particular in a smallish niche, you can do a lot of damage with a thousand or two thousand people, but then you really start making revenue after a year or five and six. Would we do off MFM?

Then you think if you go into a niche to just tell a handful of people and those handful of people tell a handful of people because a really successful show in a particular in a smallish niche, you can do a lot of damage with a thousand or two thousand people, but then you really start making revenue after a year or five and six. Would we do off MFM?

54:40

Let's say we could get magically, get somebody to organize this whole thing because we don't wanna do it. What could we use our distribution for? That would be awesome. Well, I would never wanna do this because I think this because the the value here is low, but podcasting. So you could do a podcasting point. You know, we have

Let's say we could get magically, get somebody to organize this whole thing because we don't wanna do it. What could we use our distribution for? That would be awesome. Well, I would never wanna do this because I think this because the the value here is low, but podcasting. So you could do a podcasting point. You know, we have

54:56

thirty friends who are big ish name podcasters, you could do a podcasting trade show where you have, like, what are we using now? Riverside Riverside would be a booth and, like,

thirty friends who are big ish name podcasters, you could do a podcasting trade show where you have, like, what are we using now? Riverside Riverside would be a booth and, like,

55:06

Fuck. I don't know. Like, all the shit that we use.

Fuck. I don't know. Like, all the shit that we use.

55:10

What? It's just like

What? It's just like

55:12

the podcast the business side of podcasting is just so small.

the podcast the business side of podcasting is just so small.

55:16

Oh, man. But small is good. Small is good. The pro the problem is is that the contract value is there. Yeah. Exactly. That's the issue. You need something where people spend millions of dollars. So the podcasting would But, like, but would you ever wanna go? You don't leave your house. So but hypothetically, a person like you, would you wanna go and, like, shoot the shit with some other guy who's a little bit ahead of you? And, like, just hear best practices. Yeah. Yeah. That's fine. Maybe. Okay. So podcasting is one. What else?

Oh, man. But small is good. Small is good. The pro the problem is is that the contract value is there. Yeah. Exactly. That's the issue. You need something where people spend millions of dollars. So the podcasting would But, like, but would you ever wanna go? You don't leave your house. So but hypothetically, a person like you, would you wanna go and, like, shoot the shit with some other guy who's a little bit ahead of you? And, like, just hear best practices. Yeah. Yeah. That's fine. Maybe. Okay. So podcasting is one. What else?

55:39

I don't know, dude. What what what are you interested in? Oh, it's not what about. Why? What I mentioned this? What do you think? What niche do you think? What type of niche do you think would work? So for example, these these guys are doing

I don't know, dude. What what what are you interested in? Oh, it's not what about. Why? What I mentioned this? What do you think? What niche do you think? What type of niche do you think would work? So for example, these these guys are doing

55:50

auto parts and all the automotive industry because

auto parts and all the automotive industry because

55:54

it's b to b and a bunch of people are selling, you know, high priced things.

it's b to b and a bunch of people are selling, you know, high priced things.

55:58

We've seen that,

We've seen that,

55:59

money twenty twenty was like, hey, fintech is gonna be a thing. Let's just make the number one I I don't even know if those are trade shows as much as they were conferences, but, like, let's make the fintech conference. Let's, let's make the e commerce conference. That's kinda what they tried to do with those to, like, ride an Upstart wave.

money twenty twenty was like, hey, fintech is gonna be a thing. Let's just make the number one I I don't even know if those are trade shows as much as they were conferences, but, like, let's make the fintech conference. Let's, let's make the e commerce conference. That's kinda what they tried to do with those to, like, ride an Upstart wave.

56:16

We could probably do something either involving investing or high net worth people. So where and your your boosts

We could probably do something either involving investing or high net worth people. So where and your your boosts

56:23

are

are

56:25

different type of, like, a question that you and I and our friends constantly ask each other is, like, does anyone have, like, a an accountant to they trust? Or I am having this tax issue, what are some lawyers that I can trust? I think you could do something in that vein. I would have to narrow in on what it what it would be. I think you could do something like that,

different type of, like, a question that you and I and our friends constantly ask each other is, like, does anyone have, like, a an accountant to they trust? Or I am having this tax issue, what are some lawyers that I can trust? I think you could do something in that vein. I would have to narrow in on what it what it would be. I think you could do something like that,

56:43

where, like, one customer for a particular law firm can earn hundreds of thousands of dollars in a lifetime of fees or or or a net worth

where, like, one customer for a particular law firm can earn hundreds of thousands of dollars in a lifetime of fees or or or a net worth

56:51

or a financial advisor could. I think you could do something in that vein. And by the way, we've been to a couple of these. Farmcon, I think is a is exactly this. So that's for the agriculture industry. We went to that.

or a financial advisor could. I think you could do something in that vein. And by the way, we've been to a couple of these. Farmcon, I think is a is exactly this. So that's for the agriculture industry. We went to that.

57:02

Another one is,

Another one is,

57:04

Back when I was doing the sushi restaurant, I remember we somehow we're at the QSR.

Back when I was doing the sushi restaurant, I remember we somehow we're at the QSR.

57:08

I don't even remember what it's called. It's the QSR event, and I just remember that CEO, the guy who created it, his last name was Hamburg. And I was like,

I don't even remember what it's called. It's the QSR event, and I just remember that CEO, the guy who created it, his last name was Hamburg. And I was like,

57:16

like, I forgot what what's the name of that effect where people end up living up to their name?

like, I forgot what what's the name of that effect where people end up living up to their name?

57:21

Like, there's, like, some, there's, like, a whole subreddit about this,

Like, there's, like, some, there's, like, a whole subreddit about this,

57:25

Reddit,

Reddit,

57:26

people.

people.

57:27

Well, he does a big juicy guy. I mean, it. What was it? I mean, just just basically this is the idea of,

Well, he does a big juicy guy. I mean, it. What was it? I mean, just just basically this is the idea of,

57:34

somebody who's named John Hamburgger ends up creating

somebody who's named John Hamburgger ends up creating

57:37

the quick the the fast food trade show. Like, you know, you saying bolt is the fastest man on on earth. Like, this is just too good to be true.

the quick the the fast food trade show. Like, you know, you saying bolt is the fastest man on on earth. Like, this is just too good to be true.

57:46

Like, if you're that wolf of franchise guy, who we like on Twitter. Oh, yeah. Like, you definitely could pull up. You could pull off you could pull off something like this. Now it's really the logistically, it's still like this isn't easy. This is this there's some challenge But it's a it's a problem that's been solved tons and tons of times. Like, it's a it's not like you're inventing we're not inventing anything new. This is a a s. This is we're selling t shirts. You know, it's still, like, revolves logistical issues, but, like, it it's it's not you're not inventing anything. Yeah. Yeah. That's cool.

Like, if you're that wolf of franchise guy, who we like on Twitter. Oh, yeah. Like, you definitely could pull up. You could pull off you could pull off something like this. Now it's really the logistically, it's still like this isn't easy. This is this there's some challenge But it's a it's a problem that's been solved tons and tons of times. Like, it's a it's not like you're inventing we're not inventing anything new. This is a a s. This is we're selling t shirts. You know, it's still, like, revolves logistical issues, but, like, it it's it's not you're not inventing anything. Yeah. Yeah. That's cool.

58:13

Alright. Well, I think that's good. I'm gonna save my other topics for the for the next episode.

Alright. Well, I think that's good. I'm gonna save my other topics for the for the next episode.

58:18

Did that not tickle your fancy? It does. It seems like

Did that not tickle your fancy? It does. It seems like

58:21

You you know it's good when I'm slack into the background because I'm just like, oh, here's a half baked idea. Here's a half baked idea,

You you know it's good when I'm slack into the background because I'm just like, oh, here's a half baked idea. Here's a half baked idea,

58:27

of what what could happen. I think the trade shows up is actually pretty fascinating. And I like You know, I think there's two ways to approach a business. One is, like, what do I love to do? And let me just follow the, like, follow my curiosity, follow my natural, like, scratching my own itch type of thing.

of what what could happen. I think the trade shows up is actually pretty fascinating. And I like You know, I think there's two ways to approach a business. One is, like, what do I love to do? And let me just follow the, like, follow my curiosity, follow my natural, like, scratching my own itch type of thing.

58:41

And then the other is, like, the cold calculating,

And then the other is, like, the cold calculating,

58:44

like, alright. Let me work backwards from businesses that sell with high multiples. And I'm just gonna go fishing over there because I don't know what I don't know what my passion is, so might as well just go calculate the best opportunity. I've actually done both in my life. Both can work. You can win both ways. I think it is better to win when you follow your passion, but, like,

like, alright. Let me work backwards from businesses that sell with high multiples. And I'm just gonna go fishing over there because I don't know what I don't know what my passion is, so might as well just go calculate the best opportunity. I've actually done both in my life. Both can work. You can win both ways. I think it is better to win when you follow your passion, but, like,

59:02

but I but if you're not gonna do that, this is a fun way to to reverse engineer what business you should be in. And I don't wanna say this is like an absolute thing, but it appears as though

but I but if you're not gonna do that, this is a fun way to to reverse engineer what business you should be in. And I don't wanna say this is like an absolute thing, but it appears as though

59:14

the comp there's lots of buyers for these businesses

the comp there's lots of buyers for these businesses

59:18

because the way that, like there's a handful of publicly traded companies as well as,

because the way that, like there's a handful of publicly traded companies as well as,

59:23

some really, like, heavy, heavy, heavy backed PE companies

some really, like, heavy, heavy, heavy backed PE companies

59:28

what they do is they just buy, like, eight of them, and they put them together, and they do synergist stuff to reduce costs and whatever. And it seems as though it's a very, very high

what they do is they just buy, like, eight of them, and they put them together, and they do synergist stuff to reduce costs and whatever. And it seems as though it's a very, very high

59:37

buyer -- Right. -- market, whereas, like, e com, for example, I don't know if agencies are like this, I I I don't know. They might be. They may not be. But some of the things that people start, they're they seem a little bit more difficult to sell, whereas these things aren't as difficult to sell. Totally. That's right.

buyer -- Right. -- market, whereas, like, e com, for example, I don't know if agencies are like this, I I I don't know. They might be. They may not be. But some of the things that people start, they're they seem a little bit more difficult to sell, whereas these things aren't as difficult to sell. Totally. That's right.

59:52

Good stuff. Alright. That was a good episode. I like that one. That's the pod.

Good stuff. Alright. That was a good episode. I like that one. That's the pod.

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