00:10

We have here today the,

We have here today the,

00:13

I would say

I would say

00:14

you did both. You did both.

you did both. You did both.

00:17

You fulfilled the Brown man's obligation. You became a doctor. But then you fulfilled the dream in your heart and you became a content creator, and you are now one of the most popular YouTubers

You fulfilled the Brown man's obligation. You became a doctor. But then you fulfilled the dream in your heart and you became a content creator, and you are now one of the most popular YouTubers

00:27

productivity guys that people know on YouTube. This is Ali Abdaal. Welcome to the pod man. I've been watching you for a while. It's it's fun to have you here. Thanks so much. And I've been a fan of the pod for years now. It hard to believe it's been years because I I remember when you guys first started out, and it was actually, you know, how did you make your first million? And I was like, woah. What a great concept for a podcast? And I was keeping you starting a podcast, and everyone needed an angle, and the my first million angle was just so good. And I keeping up with you guys on Twitter and stuff for for ages as well. So it's super nice to be here. You gave us a big shout out early on in our podcast. I think you did a video where it was, like, ten podcasts that I like right now or something like that. And that was a big deal for us. So that was when you got that was when my first million was still a small podcast. And I was like, I discovered something. These two guys. You're like, us, people how they made their first millions of incredible stuff. I remember when I DM Sam, the name of the podcast. I was like, I think I'm I think about calling it this. And then he was just like, it's so bad. And I was like, I'm like, coming up with my response. He goes, that it's perfect.

productivity guys that people know on YouTube. This is Ali Abdaal. Welcome to the pod man. I've been watching you for a while. It's it's fun to have you here. Thanks so much. And I've been a fan of the pod for years now. It hard to believe it's been years because I I remember when you guys first started out, and it was actually, you know, how did you make your first million? And I was like, woah. What a great concept for a podcast? And I was keeping you starting a podcast, and everyone needed an angle, and the my first million angle was just so good. And I keeping up with you guys on Twitter and stuff for for ages as well. So it's super nice to be here. You gave us a big shout out early on in our podcast. I think you did a video where it was, like, ten podcasts that I like right now or something like that. And that was a big deal for us. So that was when you got that was when my first million was still a small podcast. And I was like, I discovered something. These two guys. You're like, us, people how they made their first millions of incredible stuff. I remember when I DM Sam, the name of the podcast. I was like, I think I'm I think about calling it this. And then he was just like, it's so bad. And I was like, I'm like, coming up with my response. He goes, that it's perfect.

01:23

Sam, why did you why did you think it was so bad? What is that? So bad that it's perfect?

Sam, why did you why did you think it was so bad? What is that? So bad that it's perfect?

01:27

Well, I'm not particularly good at naming things. My company was called the hustle So I'm I'm not good at naming things. Sean, you're actually quite good at naming things, but it was for some reason, it would it just I think that we've done a good job of appearing to be, like, internet marketing

Well, I'm not particularly good at naming things. My company was called the hustle So I'm I'm not good at naming things. Sean, you're actually quite good at naming things, but it was for some reason, it would it just I think that we've done a good job of appearing to be, like, internet marketing

01:41

shady almost, like, on the surface. Like, when I go to the barber and they say, what do I do for a living? And I I wanna cringe when I say the name of the pod, but then I'm like, but it's not what it sounds like. And so we I think it's a good name because it grabs your attention, but we've done a good job of staying on the right side of, I think, like, doing the right stuff and having good taste. That's one of the names. I think I think it's a fantastic name. I I I came across some,

shady almost, like, on the surface. Like, when I go to the barber and they say, what do I do for a living? And I I wanna cringe when I say the name of the pod, but then I'm like, but it's not what it sounds like. And so we I think it's a good name because it grabs your attention, but we've done a good job of staying on the right side of, I think, like, doing the right stuff and having good taste. That's one of the names. I think I think it's a fantastic name. I I I came across some,

02:05

occasionally people on Twitter like to hate on the clips in the podcast, I think be because you guys are so open about talking about money. And there was a quote tweet that I saw being like, Lowell. I caught, you know, what would you expect from a podcast called my first million? And I was like,

occasionally people on Twitter like to hate on the clips in the podcast, I think be because you guys are so open about talking about money. And there was a quote tweet that I saw being like, Lowell. I caught, you know, what would you expect from a podcast called my first million? And I was like,

02:18

It's perfect. That's exactly what you'd expect from a podcast called my first million. I I think the name is amazing. And, yeah, I just love. I just love how brazen you guys are about talking about money. Loved the Neil Patel episode in particular. You were just, like, asking him so specific questions. A huge huge fan of the show. He to this day, I give him credit. He's the only guy that has a absurdly

It's perfect. That's exactly what you'd expect from a podcast called my first million. I I think the name is amazing. And, yeah, I just love. I just love how brazen you guys are about talking about money. Loved the Neil Patel episode in particular. You were just, like, asking him so specific questions. A huge huge fan of the show. He to this day, I give him credit. He's the only guy that has a absurdly

02:38

high life burn rate. His burn rate for a month was, I think, a hundred hundred and eighty thousand. He just said it matter of factly. He's like, that's what I spend per month. Being Sam fell out of her chair, and we're like, what are you spending a hundred and eighty thousand on? And then he's like, What do you mean? Of course, I need that. Here I need that. And he's, like, explained it. Oh, my I three ninety. My two housekeeper was my all of that stuff. That that TikTok Club has, like, ten million views because

high life burn rate. His burn rate for a month was, I think, a hundred hundred and eighty thousand. He just said it matter of factly. He's like, that's what I spend per month. Being Sam fell out of her chair, and we're like, what are you spending a hundred and eighty thousand on? And then he's like, What do you mean? Of course, I need that. Here I need that. And he's, like, explained it. Oh, my I three ninety. My two housekeeper was my all of that stuff. That that TikTok Club has, like, ten million views because

03:03

it's the whole comment section just hates him in that for saying that, but I respect him for coming on here and standing

it's the whole comment section just hates him in that for saying that, but I respect him for coming on here and standing

03:09

He told his truth. What did the kids say? That's your truth, man. You you stood by your truth. So, in interestingly, just on the on the Neil Patel note, I was at a a mastermind that he was speaking at. And I asked him a question because our business was doing, I don't know, five million revenue or something like that. And he was like, man, Why are you in the info products business? All you can make with info products is like five million. You should be in the agency business because you can make a hundred million in the agency business.

He told his truth. What did the kids say? That's your truth, man. You you stood by your truth. So, in interestingly, just on the on the Neil Patel note, I was at a a mastermind that he was speaking at. And I asked him a question because our business was doing, I don't know, five million revenue or something like that. And he was like, man, Why are you in the info products business? All you can make with info products is like five million. You should be in the agency business because you can make a hundred million in the agency business.

03:34

And I was like, oh, but, like, I want a lifestyle business. I wanna chill out. Agency seemed very stressful. And he was like, man, I probably work less than you. I work, like, four, five, six hours a week. And I've got hundred million dollar agency. And then his CEO from the back of the room piped up, and he was like, nah, hang on. Hang on. Neil's bullshitting right now. Every we have eight hundred employees. We have so many people problems. He's stressed all the time, like, do not think that running an agency is an easy business to be in.

And I was like, oh, but, like, I want a lifestyle business. I wanna chill out. Agency seemed very stressful. And he was like, man, I probably work less than you. I work, like, four, five, six hours a week. And I've got hundred million dollar agency. And then his CEO from the back of the room piped up, and he was like, nah, hang on. Hang on. Neil's bullshitting right now. Every we have eight hundred employees. We have so many people problems. He's stressed all the time, like, do not think that running an agency is an easy business to be in.

03:58

Just for the record, I love that.

Just for the record, I love that.

04:00

And I love that his CEO called him him out because you do, you know, our good friend, Andrew Wilkinson, and I think Shaan and I are also victim to this as well, where we

And I love that his CEO called him him out because you do, you know, our good friend, Andrew Wilkinson, and I think Shaan and I are also victim to this as well, where we

04:09

oversimplify things, and we act like it's it's no big deal. It's very low stress. And that's not the reality. I was just

oversimplify things, and we act like it's it's no big deal. It's very low stress. And that's not the reality. I was just

04:16

text to my friend, Austin Rief who runs morning brew. And, like, morning brew is a similar thing where on paper, they're killing it on behind the scenes or

text to my friend, Austin Rief who runs morning brew. And, like, morning brew is a similar thing where on paper, they're killing it on behind the scenes or

04:25

in the public eye, they're killing it, and they are killing it. And it's so simple. Just a newsletter. Wow. What's a newsletter? Yeah. How hot can it be? Yeah. And you know what we were bitching to each other about? We were both saying how we had the Sunday Scaries. I was like, I've gotta do this podcast. I gotta prepare. I've got this meeting and that meeting, and then I gotta go do run this errand, and I think that

in the public eye, they're killing it, and they are killing it. And it's so simple. Just a newsletter. Wow. What's a newsletter? Yeah. How hot can it be? Yeah. And you know what we were bitching to each other about? We were both saying how we had the Sunday Scaries. I was like, I've gotta do this podcast. I gotta prepare. I've got this meeting and that meeting, and then I gotta go do run this errand, and I think that

04:45

it is not it it looks cool just like your life out of your your life, particularly

it is not it it looks cool just like your life out of your your life, particularly

04:49

Cool. You share your revenue. You're making profit. You're living a nomadic life. You've got a book coming out. You seem well, you you know, you put together. There all of our shit things, and it's all significantly more stressful than I think than it looks like. What what's the, what's the hot mess part of your life, Ali?

Cool. You share your revenue. You're making profit. You're living a nomadic life. You've got a book coming out. You seem well, you you know, you put together. There all of our shit things, and it's all significantly more stressful than I think than it looks like. What what's the, what's the hot mess part of your life, Ali?

05:05

The hot mess part of my life is that I

The hot mess part of my life is that I

05:08

generally don't enjoy filming YouTube videos,

generally don't enjoy filming YouTube videos,

05:12

which is Lovely too. Right? Yeah. Exactly.

which is Lovely too. Right? Yeah. Exactly.

05:16

There are there are lots of aspects about being a youtuber that I really like, and sometimes I enjoy making videos, but I've made, like, hundred and fifty videos to date where I just speak to the camera, and I've maybe enjoyed filming, like, twenty of them. And it's kinda weird because, like, I I love the reading, the synthesizing, the learning, but when it comes to sitting down, like, you know, I I love doing podcasts because there's someone else on the other end, and it's like, there's energy. It's it's more fun. But just speaking to a camera on my own, like, it's kinda depressing.

There are there are lots of aspects about being a youtuber that I really like, and sometimes I enjoy making videos, but I've made, like, hundred and fifty videos to date where I just speak to the camera, and I've maybe enjoyed filming, like, twenty of them. And it's kinda weird because, like, I I love the reading, the synthesizing, the learning, but when it comes to sitting down, like, you know, I I love doing podcasts because there's someone else on the other end, and it's like, there's energy. It's it's more fun. But just speaking to a camera on my own, like, it's kinda depressing.

05:42

But, hey, you know, that's that's the price to get the message out there, and and I do enjoy other aspects of the process. What else do you hate about it? You said that there you said there's a few things you like and there's there's a bunch of stuff you dislike. What do you what else do you dislike? I don't like doing sponsorship ad read this is gonna sound like very, like, first world problems because, you know, a sponsored ad read is I have to sort of stumble through my words doing it every which way. The brand says that, oh, you have to say the wording in this specific way, and then I'm kinda, like, yeah, it takes me twenty minutes to do, like, sixty second ad read just because of all the stumbling and stuff that's that's that's going through there. By the way, our producer Ari, our our producer Ari is like grimacing because

But, hey, you know, that's that's the price to get the message out there, and and I do enjoy other aspects of the process. What else do you hate about it? You said that there you said there's a few things you like and there's there's a bunch of stuff you dislike. What do you what else do you dislike? I don't like doing sponsorship ad read this is gonna sound like very, like, first world problems because, you know, a sponsored ad read is I have to sort of stumble through my words doing it every which way. The brand says that, oh, you have to say the wording in this specific way, and then I'm kinda, like, yeah, it takes me twenty minutes to do, like, sixty second ad read just because of all the stumbling and stuff that's that's that's going through there. By the way, our producer Ari, our our producer Ari is like grimacing because

06:19

Sean's actually pretty good with words. I stumble a lot. But I you so HubSpot's our main sponsor. I use HubSpot. I like the product. I own the stock. Whatever. And I still freaking hate reading what they tell me to say because they phrase it such a way I'm like, that's not how I would say. I don't even know if this feature existed. So, like, it sucks, man. I'll do it'll it'll take me an hour to do about five minutes worth of reach. Hey, guys. It's q four. It's winning time. Yeah. It's winning time. Because with the new sales prospecting tool, it's like, oh, god. Do I have to? You sure I have to say this? Or listen to this. I can even do it on our podcast. On the script, they write, read this word for word. Please do not change the one because, like, we have one we have some we get to improvise and some we don't. Or we'll do our reads and it's like, check out my first million wherever you get your podcasts.

Sean's actually pretty good with words. I stumble a lot. But I you so HubSpot's our main sponsor. I use HubSpot. I like the product. I own the stock. Whatever. And I still freaking hate reading what they tell me to say because they phrase it such a way I'm like, that's not how I would say. I don't even know if this feature existed. So, like, it sucks, man. I'll do it'll it'll take me an hour to do about five minutes worth of reach. Hey, guys. It's q four. It's winning time. Yeah. It's winning time. Because with the new sales prospecting tool, it's like, oh, god. Do I have to? You sure I have to say this? Or listen to this. I can even do it on our podcast. On the script, they write, read this word for word. Please do not change the one because, like, we have one we have some we get to improvise and some we don't. Or we'll do our reads and it's like, check out my first million wherever you get your podcasts.

07:05

You know, I like Oh, yeah. It's like, I'm not even like giving our reads.

You know, I like Oh, yeah. It's like, I'm not even like giving our reads.

07:10

Yeah. We actually switched to HubSpot, like, two weeks ago, for or or rather have started using HubSpot for our CRM because we never really had a CRM for our course sales and rev ops and all that stuff. Exactly. It's q four and it's winning time. It's q four and it's winning time. May

Yeah. We actually switched to HubSpot, like, two weeks ago, for or or rather have started using HubSpot for our CRM because we never really had a CRM for our course sales and rev ops and all that stuff. Exactly. It's q four and it's winning time. It's q four and it's winning time. May

07:26

I

I

07:27

actually, like, I did my first HubSpot Adried yesterday because they're now sponsoring my videos as well, which is cool. Because, like, as soon as we switched to them, they gave us a discount on the package. They're sponsoring the videos. They're really good. Love HubSpot. Check out HubSpot everyone.

actually, like, I did my first HubSpot Adried yesterday because they're now sponsoring my videos as well, which is cool. Because, like, as soon as we switched to them, they gave us a discount on the package. They're sponsoring the videos. They're really good. Love HubSpot. Check out HubSpot everyone.

07:43

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

Our software is the worst. Have you heard of HubSpot?

07:46

See most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. I think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. HubSpot

See most CRMs are a cobbled together mess, but HubSpot is easy to adopt and actually looks gorgeous. I think I love our new CRM. Our software is the best. HubSpot

07:56

grow better.

grow better.

07:58

I wanted to ask you about some of your productivity stuff because if I go to your YouTube channel, which I have many times, And I'll be honest. When I usually go there, I'm like, okay. He seems like such a good

I wanted to ask you about some of your productivity stuff because if I go to your YouTube channel, which I have many times, And I'll be honest. When I usually go there, I'm like, okay. He seems like such a good

08:10

guy somebody you'd wanna be friends with, but I was, like, in terms of YouTube success, he's not the the funniest.

guy somebody you'd wanna be friends with, but I was, like, in terms of YouTube success, he's not the the funniest.

08:16

He's not the sexiest. He's not the smartest. He's not the most successful guy on the but you really win and you do really well. And one of the things you do well is you just share very useful,

He's not the sexiest. He's not the smartest. He's not the most successful guy on the but you really win and you do really well. And one of the things you do well is you just share very useful,

08:27

just useful things. And I think useful is actually kind of underrated

just useful things. And I think useful is actually kind of underrated

08:31

so instead of trying to impress everybody, you could just try to be a little bit helpful, like, a, you know, like a friend helping you out. And you had this list of

so instead of trying to impress everybody, you could just try to be a little bit helpful, like, a, you know, like a friend helping you out. And you had this list of

08:40

productivity things you do. You probably got, like, fifty YouTube videos about productivity, but you did this Twitter list that I thought was really good, which was how you are more productive

productivity things you do. You probably got, like, fifty YouTube videos about productivity, but you did this Twitter list that I thought was really good, which was how you are more productive

08:48

than the average person. And I wanna read you some of these, and I want you to explain what they are because I didn't But by the way, Sean, for the record, he ranks pretty high on, like, the sexiest. He's got the good London Max cent. He's a doctor. Like, he's dressed nicely. He's he's at least two notches above average on all of those things. Yeah. I just think he's not the most in the world. Right? Like,

than the average person. And I wanna read you some of these, and I want you to explain what they are because I didn't But by the way, Sean, for the record, he ranks pretty high on, like, the sexiest. He's got the good London Max cent. He's a doctor. Like, he's dressed nicely. He's he's at least two notches above average on all of those things. Yeah. I just think he's not the most in the world. Right? Like,

09:07

Like, if I go on twitch there's some Twitch streamers where I'm like, I understand why she's doing well. This

Like, if I go on twitch there's some Twitch streamers where I'm like, I understand why she's doing well. This

09:14

this makes sense to me why this would appeal to people on this form. Right? I get it.

this makes sense to me why this would appeal to people on this form. Right? I get it.

09:18

Alright. So anyways, let's go back to your productivity stuff. So you have a technique called you call the daily highlight. What is the daily highlight? One thing I would say before is before talking about this stuff, this thread that you're referencing was actually a bit of a experiment I did a year ago where I got chat GPT to write the whole thing before chat GPT was cool.

Alright. So anyways, let's go back to your productivity stuff. So you have a technique called you call the daily highlight. What is the daily highlight? One thing I would say before is before talking about this stuff, this thread that you're referencing was actually a bit of a experiment I did a year ago where I got chat GPT to write the whole thing before chat GPT was cool.

09:37

So the first two on the bullshit and the rest are just pure it's all bullshit made up by AI.

So the first two on the bullshit and the rest are just pure it's all bullshit made up by AI.

09:42

Great. A few days. I was blown away. Put your best work. I thought. At a few days after I posted the thread, I did another thread talking about how that thread was AI generated, and now it's not news anymore because everyone's doing this. But, like, at the time, people were like, oh my god, AI's taking over our jobs, AI's taking over the world. But the daily highlight is legit. The daily highlight is the technique. Basically, you ask yourself

Great. A few days. I was blown away. Put your best work. I thought. At a few days after I posted the thread, I did another thread talking about how that thread was AI generated, and now it's not news anymore because everyone's doing this. But, like, at the time, people were like, oh my god, AI's taking over our jobs, AI's taking over the world. But the daily highlight is legit. The daily highlight is the technique. Basically, you ask yourself

10:03

what is the most important thing I need to do today. And that's it. Like, it's One of the, by far, the most simple productivity tips that you could possibly have, but it's so needle moving because so few of us actually focus down on what is the most important thing I personally like to phrase it as what's today's adventure going to be because my whole shtick is to really to be productive, you gotta find a way to enjoy the process. And even just reframing something in your mind as an adventure makes you way more likely to enjoy the process. It's so true. Like, we are all children inside, and we can use all of these different tactics to make us feel good about the things that we're doing, and adventure framing is is one of them. So that's the daily highlight. With my kids, whenever I need them to do something or, like, walk somewhere to do something, I just say, hey, let's go over here. They'll never like, there's wanted around. They won't come they I'm like, come on. Come on. Let's go. But if I'm like, hey, guys. It's a mission.

what is the most important thing I need to do today. And that's it. Like, it's One of the, by far, the most simple productivity tips that you could possibly have, but it's so needle moving because so few of us actually focus down on what is the most important thing I personally like to phrase it as what's today's adventure going to be because my whole shtick is to really to be productive, you gotta find a way to enjoy the process. And even just reframing something in your mind as an adventure makes you way more likely to enjoy the process. It's so true. Like, we are all children inside, and we can use all of these different tactics to make us feel good about the things that we're doing, and adventure framing is is one of them. So that's the daily highlight. With my kids, whenever I need them to do something or, like, walk somewhere to do something, I just say, hey, let's go over here. They'll never like, there's wanted around. They won't come they I'm like, come on. Come on. Let's go. But if I'm like, hey, guys. It's a mission.

10:51

We have to find your jackets before we go outside. And I'm like, it's a mission. Like, it's a mission, and then they get really excited. And then yesterday, by myself, I couldn't find my,

We have to find your jackets before we go outside. And I'm like, it's a mission. Like, it's a mission, and then they get really excited. And then yesterday, by myself, I couldn't find my,

11:00

My laptop, I was, like, ready to do some more conf I didn't have no idea where I put it in my house, and I just told myself, Sean, it's a mission. And I got kind of excited. I'm not gonna lie. The third grade teacher technique works. Sam, do you do this kind of one highlight? Like, he says he calls it daily highlight. I call it the one big thing where I my to do I have a to do list of one. You do something like that, or do you have a long to do list every day?

My laptop, I was, like, ready to do some more conf I didn't have no idea where I put it in my house, and I just told myself, Sean, it's a mission. And I got kind of excited. I'm not gonna lie. The third grade teacher technique works. Sam, do you do this kind of one highlight? Like, he says he calls it daily highlight. I call it the one big thing where I my to do I have a to do list of one. You do something like that, or do you have a long to do list every day?

11:21

Look. I know what the audience is thinking. They think, Sam, you're wonderfully attractive man. You're so charismatic. You're so productive.

Look. I know what the audience is thinking. They think, Sam, you're wonderfully attractive man. You're so charismatic. You're so productive.

11:28

But truth is is I actually struggle with this. I I just have do list, I keep a notebook here, and I just, like, make my list in the morning. And, frankly, I find it very stressful and, like, not

But truth is is I actually struggle with this. I I just have do list, I keep a notebook here, and I just, like, make my list in the morning. And, frankly, I find it very stressful and, like, not

11:40

my productivity

my productivity

11:41

scheme is I find very unproductive.

scheme is I find very unproductive.

11:44

What I believe and I actually think this is, I I believe Sean might do this too. And I think this is actually

What I believe and I actually think this is, I I believe Sean might do this too. And I think this is actually

11:50

maybe

maybe

11:51

wrong of us is I leave a lot of open space, and I just kinda follow my heart of, like, what's going on. And I used to tell myself, well, Paul Graham said it's the manager versus the the artist.

wrong of us is I leave a lot of open space, and I just kinda follow my heart of, like, what's going on. And I used to tell myself, well, Paul Graham said it's the manager versus the the artist.

12:02

Yeah. The maker's schedule.

Yeah. The maker's schedule.

12:03

And it's okay to have open space. And I find myself getting really stressed when I have things on my calendar, but I find myself just messing around, far too often than I should be probably.

And it's okay to have open space. And I find myself getting really stressed when I have things on my calendar, but I find myself just messing around, far too often than I should be probably.

12:13

The the manager schedule, the maker schedule, and then the skater boys. Schedule, I'm just flirting around that. You know, like, when at Warren Buffett, we made a joke it was real. Warren Buffett says he just reads all day. So I would just read, like, fiction books. I'm like, oh, I'm productive. It turns out he's reading, like, annual reports. You know, he's working actually. But, no, I find my my I find my productivity schedule to be pretty shitty. And I'm actually I wrote down the daily highlight, and then the next one you have is the hourglass.

The the manager schedule, the maker schedule, and then the skater boys. Schedule, I'm just flirting around that. You know, like, when at Warren Buffett, we made a joke it was real. Warren Buffett says he just reads all day. So I would just read, like, fiction books. I'm like, oh, I'm productive. It turns out he's reading, like, annual reports. You know, he's working actually. But, no, I find my my I find my productivity schedule to be pretty shitty. And I'm actually I wrote down the daily highlight, and then the next one you have is the hourglass.

12:37

I find some of those, like, little tricks actually helpful. But I don't do anything. Do you, Sean? Well, I do the the one big I I call it the one big thing. In fact, I had somebody build me a Chrome extension that every time I open a tab, it would say your one big thing is,

I find some of those, like, little tricks actually helpful. But I don't do anything. Do you, Sean? Well, I do the the one big I I call it the one big thing. In fact, I had somebody build me a Chrome extension that every time I open a tab, it would say your one big thing is,

12:50

and it's just a huge, like, text of what's the one thing. And the beauty of this is

and it's just a huge, like, text of what's the one thing. And the beauty of this is

12:57

What I used to do like, I used to do a to do list. And here's how you'd here's how I would do the to do list.

What I used to do like, I used to do a to do list. And here's how you'd here's how I would do the to do list.

13:02

It would be written down. So there's no particular order, like, I wouldn't rank it by, like, kind of most urgent or important. I would just sort of write down the things as they came to mind. And then I would, like, It's like if it's a plate of food, I would just go for the French fries first every time. So I would always do the thing. That's not actually the thing is easy to do. I do the easy one. I would myself into, oh, it's getting the momentum, then I would go on a tangent, and I would just never get the important shit done. And I would never finish the to do list. Everything I did would add stuff add more things to to to the to do list. Oh, I emailed this guy. Okay. I gotta follow-up.

It would be written down. So there's no particular order, like, I wouldn't rank it by, like, kind of most urgent or important. I would just sort of write down the things as they came to mind. And then I would, like, It's like if it's a plate of food, I would just go for the French fries first every time. So I would always do the thing. That's not actually the thing is easy to do. I do the easy one. I would myself into, oh, it's getting the momentum, then I would go on a tangent, and I would just never get the important shit done. And I would never finish the to do list. Everything I did would add stuff add more things to to to the to do list. Oh, I emailed this guy. Okay. I gotta follow-up.

13:33

He said send him the deck. Now I gotta make the make the deck. I gotta right? So I was always adding, and it just was a source stress. So I had this,

He said send him the deck. Now I gotta make the make the deck. I gotta right? So I was always adding, and it just was a source stress. So I had this,

13:41

my coach, my trainer. He said this thing to me. He goes, you know, what if you did it a little bit differently? So, you know, like, what's

my coach, my trainer. He said this thing to me. He goes, you know, what if you did it a little bit differently? So, you know, like, what's

13:48

One thing where if you just had this one outcome of the day, the whole day is a success. Whether you did anything else or not, is there such a thing? And if there's not, then you're sort of like hunting mice. You're just nibbling on little stuff. You don't have anything that's actually impactful that you're that you're striving towards. But if you have one impactful thing,

One thing where if you just had this one outcome of the day, the whole day is a success. Whether you did anything else or not, is there such a thing? And if there's not, then you're sort of like hunting mice. You're just nibbling on little stuff. You don't have anything that's actually impactful that you're that you're striving towards. But if you have one impactful thing,

14:07

then

then

14:08

that one thing should be enough for the day. Imagine just doing the one most important thing every day for three hundred sixty five days out of the year, you would outpace

that one thing should be enough for the day. Imagine just doing the one most important thing every day for three hundred sixty five days out of the year, you would outpace

14:16

all the productivity nerds out there. I've got these days, Ali, where, like, it feels like I was busy all day. And at the end of the day, I've got nothing done. Do you know what I mean? Mate, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah. I feel bad at the end of the day. I don't feel good. Yeah. I find that that happens to me a lot when I have, like, the day chock a block with calendar events, and that's when I find that, like, as Sean said, I I haven't made time to do the one big thing, the daily highlight, the adventure, whatever the fuck you wanna call it. And just, honestly, just doing that thing makes such a huge difference to everything else. Because it's, like, you've hunted the big thing, and now you can hunt the mice if you really want to. Because, like, the small stuff does build up, and it's important to, you know, send that email, send the follow-up, all that crap. But actually the thing that's really gonna get you to where you wanna be is generally making big progress on that one big thing. And by the way, it's not one big task.

all the productivity nerds out there. I've got these days, Ali, where, like, it feels like I was busy all day. And at the end of the day, I've got nothing done. Do you know what I mean? Mate, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah. I feel bad at the end of the day. I don't feel good. Yeah. I find that that happens to me a lot when I have, like, the day chock a block with calendar events, and that's when I find that, like, as Sean said, I I haven't made time to do the one big thing, the daily highlight, the adventure, whatever the fuck you wanna call it. And just, honestly, just doing that thing makes such a huge difference to everything else. Because it's, like, you've hunted the big thing, and now you can hunt the mice if you really want to. Because, like, the small stuff does build up, and it's important to, you know, send that email, send the follow-up, all that crap. But actually the thing that's really gonna get you to where you wanna be is generally making big progress on that one big thing. And by the way, it's not one big task.

15:01

I I don't do it as one task. It's one, like, outcome you're going for. Like, oh, today, I'm gonna

I I don't do it as one task. It's one, like, outcome you're going for. Like, oh, today, I'm gonna

15:07

find the right person for this role. Which might involve me doing five tasks, like go through the applications,

find the right person for this role. Which might involve me doing five tasks, like go through the applications,

15:13

shortlist the best five, email them, and research them or whatever. Right? Like, whatever it is, schedule a call with But, like, it's one outcome that you're going for.

shortlist the best five, email them, and research them or whatever. Right? Like, whatever it is, schedule a call with But, like, it's one outcome that you're going for.

15:22

What's this hourglass one? Is this is this for, like, timeboxing?

What's this hourglass one? Is this is this for, like, timeboxing?

15:25

Yeah. So the hourglass one is is is interesting. So one of the things that I've discovered about procrastination from doing a bunch of reading and interviewing professors about this, Chad, is that procrastination is generally a problem with getting started with doing the thing. Usually once you've gotten started, like, you have momentum and then you can, like, finish, you know, it it becomes a lot easier to sustain the thing once you've gotten started. And so how do we how do we hack our brains into just starting a task? And back when I wasn't traveling around the world, digital nomading, I would have a five minute hour glass on my desk. And I would just be like, alright. I'm gonna film the video for just five minutes, and I'd turn the hourglass over. And I would genuinely tell myself I'm just doing it for five minutes. Then usually I'm I'm into the flow of it, and then the hourglass time is way gone, and I've I'm now into the flow with the task. But sometimes, I would just do the thing for five minutes. And it's just a little

Yeah. So the hourglass one is is is interesting. So one of the things that I've discovered about procrastination from doing a bunch of reading and interviewing professors about this, Chad, is that procrastination is generally a problem with getting started with doing the thing. Usually once you've gotten started, like, you have momentum and then you can, like, finish, you know, it it becomes a lot easier to sustain the thing once you've gotten started. And so how do we how do we hack our brains into just starting a task? And back when I wasn't traveling around the world, digital nomading, I would have a five minute hour glass on my desk. And I would just be like, alright. I'm gonna film the video for just five minutes, and I'd turn the hourglass over. And I would genuinely tell myself I'm just doing it for five minutes. Then usually I'm I'm into the flow of it, and then the hourglass time is way gone, and I've I'm now into the flow with the task. But sometimes, I would just do the thing for five minutes. And it's just a little

16:12

practical I I I like physical things that help boost my productivity because it's, like, yeah, you could set a timer on your phone, but then you see notification above.

practical I I I like physical things that help boost my productivity because it's, like, yeah, you could set a timer on your phone, but then you see notification above.

16:19

The the phone is too much of a multitasking tool. It's literally an hourglass that's five minutes is has one tool, and that is this is the thing that stops me from procrastinating.

The the phone is too much of a multitasking tool. It's literally an hourglass that's five minutes is has one tool, and that is this is the thing that stops me from procrastinating.

16:28

That's fascinating. So you're saying

That's fascinating. So you're saying

16:30

That's a fascinating insight. Percrastination

That's a fascinating insight. Percrastination

16:33

is not,

is not,

16:35

I'm putting off finishing the thing. It's I'm pushed putting off starting the thing. And as soon as you start,

I'm putting off finishing the thing. It's I'm pushed putting off starting the thing. And as soon as you start,

16:40

You're like, you know, you're it's actually quite easy to just keep going and finish the thing for for most people.

You're like, you know, you're it's actually quite easy to just keep going and finish the thing for for most people.

16:46

Yeah. Absolutely. The law of inertia. It's like if you're

Yeah. Absolutely. The law of inertia. It's like if you're

16:48

you know, when I I've I still struggle with working out, but if I just get myself to the gym and just do something for five minutes, I'm like, oh, I'm there already. I might as well keep going and it's kinda fun, and I'm gonna get the endorphin rush and all that. But it's that first step of, like, getting, you know, going downstairs to the hotel gym or wherever I am these days. It's actually just lifting the first wave as by far the hardest part. And that's the hardest part of any task just getting started. I, I went to this, like, conference on Thursday and Friday. Sean, do you know Nick Ray?

you know, when I I've I still struggle with working out, but if I just get myself to the gym and just do something for five minutes, I'm like, oh, I'm there already. I might as well keep going and it's kinda fun, and I'm gonna get the endorphin rush and all that. But it's that first step of, like, getting, you know, going downstairs to the hotel gym or wherever I am these days. It's actually just lifting the first wave as by far the hardest part. And that's the hardest part of any task just getting started. I, I went to this, like, conference on Thursday and Friday. Sean, do you know Nick Ray?

17:15

Or send out Nick Gray. He's the, the inventor of the two hour cocktail party. There there really wasn't one until he he made it.

Or send out Nick Gray. He's the, the inventor of the two hour cocktail party. There there really wasn't one until he he made it.

17:22

Ali, do you know who have you seen Nick Gray? Yeah. We hang out in Austin a few months ago. Great guy. Yeah. So he he's a character. He's like a type of guy where you think you're hanging out with him and you're, like, this a shtick? Are you just acting? And it's not? Like, that, like, for example,

Ali, do you know who have you seen Nick Gray? Yeah. We hang out in Austin a few months ago. Great guy. Yeah. So he he's a character. He's like a type of guy where you think you're hanging out with him and you're, like, this a shtick? Are you just acting? And it's not? Like, that, like, for example,

17:35

my wife and I got lunch with him one day. And he goes, alright, I have a list of topics. First, I wanna talk about my dating life. And then at eleven twenty four, we're gonna switch Sarah to what you're doing at work. And then at eleven forty four,

my wife and I got lunch with him one day. And he goes, alright, I have a list of topics. First, I wanna talk about my dating life. And then at eleven twenty four, we're gonna switch Sarah to what you're doing at work. And then at eleven forty four,

17:48

Sam, I wanna ask you an update on this thing. Like, and it's, like, that's, like, his real life. And it's, it's, like, exhausting at first and then you realize it's pretty wonderful to hang out with him. Super intentional. He's like the walking equivalent of may I have a kiss?

Sam, I wanna ask you an update on this thing. Like, and it's, like, that's, like, his real life. And it's, it's, like, exhausting at first and then you realize it's pretty wonderful to hang out with him. Super intentional. He's like the walking equivalent of may I have a kiss?

18:04

He's, like, he he's he's he's wild. And for his forty first birthday, he wanted to host a conference. That's what he wanted to do. And so he convinced cloudflare, which is a stock that he owns, and he loves. And so that's why he did it there. He convinced them to let him have this forty person event there. And he had all these people come and there's forty people or so. And we basically just went into groups of eight, and we would discuss,

He's, like, he he's he's he's wild. And for his forty first birthday, he wanted to host a conference. That's what he wanted to do. And so he convinced cloudflare, which is a stock that he owns, and he loves. And so that's why he did it there. He convinced them to let him have this forty person event there. And he had all these people come and there's forty people or so. And we basically just went into groups of eight, and we would discuss,

18:27

a topic that was like, it could've been parenting. And if you go to the parenting one, it could've been whatever. And there was a bunch of YouTubers there. So there was Patty Galloway, who's, a really fascinating guy. And this other guy I met who I didn't know at time. His name was Josh Weisman. If you guys heard of Josh Weisman,

a topic that was like, it could've been parenting. And if you go to the parenting one, it could've been whatever. And there was a bunch of YouTubers there. So there was Patty Galloway, who's, a really fascinating guy. And this other guy I met who I didn't know at time. His name was Josh Weisman. If you guys heard of Josh Weisman,

18:42

he's a chef. The chef. He's a chef. Yeah. He's an incredible youtuber.

he's a chef. The chef. He's a chef. Yeah. He's an incredible youtuber.

18:48

Yep. Yeah. Or more. I think it's, like, eleven million. It's a lot. And he was in the investing one with me. So we were talking about finances.

Yep. Yeah. Or more. I think it's, like, eleven million. It's a lot. And he was in the investing one with me. So we were talking about finances.

18:54

And then I

And then I

18:56

There was a bunch of other YouTubers there. And it was first of all, it was one of the best events I've ever been to. I met so many interesting people But second, there was like That's birthday conference you ever been to? That's that's forty first birthday conference I've ever been to. Dude, there was this one time. So Nick owns a bunch of cloudflare stock. And he goes, hey, I convinced a VP of Cloudflare to come down here to meet me. He has no idea what he's walking into. And and he goes, when you guys get here, I need you to start cheering for him and telling him how much you love cloudflare.

There was a bunch of other YouTubers there. And it was first of all, it was one of the best events I've ever been to. I met so many interesting people But second, there was like That's birthday conference you ever been to? That's that's forty first birthday conference I've ever been to. Dude, there was this one time. So Nick owns a bunch of cloudflare stock. And he goes, hey, I convinced a VP of Cloudflare to come down here to meet me. He has no idea what he's walking into. And and he goes, when you guys get here, I need you to start cheering for him and telling him how much you love cloudflare.

19:25

And so this guy, this, like, he's a VP of engineering. He just walks in and you think he's just meeting Nick, And we're like, whoa. Is that the VP of engineering of cloudflare? Tell us your mission. And he goes, oh, cloudflare's mission is to make sure the internet doesn't go down. And we're like, I believe that we're, like, screaming

And so this guy, this, like, he's a VP of engineering. He just walks in and you think he's just meeting Nick, And we're like, whoa. Is that the VP of engineering of cloudflare? Tell us your mission. And he goes, oh, cloudflare's mission is to make sure the internet doesn't go down. And we're like, I believe that we're, like, screaming

19:43

and cheering. And he, like, convinced this guy, and he never told the guy that this was a joke. So to this day, this guy still thinks that we were there to, like, discuss how much we love Cloudflare.

and cheering. And he, like, convinced this guy, and he never told the guy that this was a joke. So to this day, this guy still thinks that we were there to, like, discuss how much we love Cloudflare.

19:51

It was amazing. But, anyway, all these YouTubers were there. And about half of them didn't first of all, they're making so much money. I didn't realize it would be like a twenty six or twenty seven year old guy who's making maybe ten million a year if I had to guess. A lot of them don't it it didn't in by the way, you wanna know the craziest thing. A lot of them, their the biggest problem that they were discussing was, like, they kept a lot of their cash just in a checking account as opposed to, like, investing it because they were afraid to put it even into a high yield savings account, which blew my mind of how many successful people do But a lot of them, it seemed didn't run their business, like, a business. They ran it, like, almost a hobby, but the numbers were astronomical, making a million dollars a month, I imagine. It seems like you're running your business, like a real business. And, like, you've hired, like, I don't know, fifteen or twenty people.

It was amazing. But, anyway, all these YouTubers were there. And about half of them didn't first of all, they're making so much money. I didn't realize it would be like a twenty six or twenty seven year old guy who's making maybe ten million a year if I had to guess. A lot of them don't it it didn't in by the way, you wanna know the craziest thing. A lot of them, their the biggest problem that they were discussing was, like, they kept a lot of their cash just in a checking account as opposed to, like, investing it because they were afraid to put it even into a high yield savings account, which blew my mind of how many successful people do But a lot of them, it seemed didn't run their business, like, a business. They ran it, like, almost a hobby, but the numbers were astronomical, making a million dollars a month, I imagine. It seems like you're running your business, like a real business. And, like, you've hired, like, I don't know, fifteen or twenty people.

20:34

Have you seen this with a lot of these YouTubers where they're just, like, it's, like, run, like, a twenty six year old who's just creative as opposed to a a business.

Have you seen this with a lot of these YouTubers where they're just, like, it's, like, run, like, a twenty six year old who's just creative as opposed to a a business.

20:43

Yeah. Yeah. I see this quite a lot. This is like the biggest thing I talk about when I hang out with other youtubers. I haven't met many who are, like, twenty seven and doing tens of millions,

Yeah. Yeah. I see this quite a lot. This is like the biggest thing I talk about when I hang out with other youtubers. I haven't met many who are, like, twenty seven and doing tens of millions,

20:52

without treating it like a business. I think that would that that that's a very unusual state to be. And by the way, I'm not referring to that guy, Josh. I'm just referring to, in general, I met people. I don't wanna, like, break any confidentiality or anything.

without treating it like a business. I think that would that that that's a very unusual state to be. And by the way, I'm not referring to that guy, Josh. I'm just referring to, in general, I met people. I don't wanna, like, break any confidentiality or anything.

21:02

Yeah, in general, what I find is that a lot of a lot of youtubers,

Yeah, in general, what I find is that a lot of a lot of youtubers,

21:05

they're creatives at heart and not business people at heart, which is why they started YouTube in the first place. And they have this reliance on AdSense and Brand deals in particular. Like, I know, I know a couple of people with, like, millions of subscribers

they're creatives at heart and not business people at heart, which is why they started YouTube in the first place. And they have this reliance on AdSense and Brand deals in particular. Like, I know, I know a couple of people with, like, millions of subscribers

21:17

who are so stressed and kinda hate their lives because every video has to get a million views, because if it doesn't get a million views, then the brand deals revenue is gonna go down, and they need that brand deal revenue and especially entertainment YouTubers find it really hard to monetize off of the platform because it's not you can't just sell a course if you're an entertainment dealer. All you can do is sell a course on how to do YouTube audience doesn't want anyway. We saw yes theory. You know, you guys know yes theory, you know, ten million subscribers. They tried to release a course about doing YouTube

who are so stressed and kinda hate their lives because every video has to get a million views, because if it doesn't get a million views, then the brand deals revenue is gonna go down, and they need that brand deal revenue and especially entertainment YouTubers find it really hard to monetize off of the platform because it's not you can't just sell a course if you're an entertainment dealer. All you can do is sell a course on how to do YouTube audience doesn't want anyway. We saw yes theory. You know, you guys know yes theory, you know, ten million subscribers. They tried to release a course about doing YouTube

21:44

and the audience hated them for it. And we released our course on, like, the same day about how to do YouTube. We charged five times as much, and our audience loved us for it. So it's like there's this weird thing where entertainment YouTubers in particular are reliant on brand deals, and that's a very stressful existence. And I think businessifying

and the audience hated them for it. And we released our course on, like, the same day about how to do YouTube. We charged five times as much, and our audience loved us for it. So it's like there's this weird thing where entertainment YouTubers in particular are reliant on brand deals, and that's a very stressful existence. And I think businessifying

22:00

and operationalizing

and operationalizing

22:01

and stuff is, like, the way a lot of these guys level up. There was this one guy there who had this big audience, and he said, we were talking about cancelization,

and stuff is, like, the way a lot of these guys level up. There was this one guy there who had this big audience, and he said, we were talking about cancelization,

22:11

like getting canceled for saying the wrong thing, particularly with Israel and Palestine going on and, like, taking a stand and you have to. That was, like, the the discussion. And this one guy was, like, I've basically created an audience that's gonna cancel with me sometime in the near future. I don't know when, but I know it's going to happen.

like getting canceled for saying the wrong thing, particularly with Israel and Palestine going on and, like, taking a stand and you have to. That was, like, the the discussion. And this one guy was, like, I've basically created an audience that's gonna cancel with me sometime in the near future. I don't know when, but I know it's going to happen.

22:28

And,

And,

22:29

and like that, it was a really stressful

and like that, it was a really stressful

22:32

a stressful life he seemed like he had. He's like, they're gonna, like, I'm their monkey at the moment, and I'm dancing for them, but they're gonna come after me eventually.

a stressful life he seemed like he had. He's like, they're gonna, like, I'm their monkey at the moment, and I'm dancing for them, but they're gonna come after me eventually.

22:40

And it seemed really stressful to be living that life.

And it seemed really stressful to be living that life.

22:44

Yeah. It's a pretty stressful place to be.

Yeah. It's a pretty stressful place to be.

22:47

I know. One of one of my big things is all about, like, treating create treating treating the creator thing more like a business, because, like, almost no one that I speak to actually treats it like a business. And I think if you do learn if someone's listening to this and they're a creator, if you learn, like, the basics of business, like, what is an SOP and reading books like the E myth and traction and things like that, you end up with, like, oh, shit. I can apply all of these principles of business, OKRs and KP

I know. One of one of my big things is all about, like, treating create treating treating the creator thing more like a business, because, like, almost no one that I speak to actually treats it like a business. And I think if you do learn if someone's listening to this and they're a creator, if you learn, like, the basics of business, like, what is an SOP and reading books like the E myth and traction and things like that, you end up with, like, oh, shit. I can apply all of these principles of business, OKRs and KP

23:13

to my YouTube channel. And therefore, I can, like, oh, I can use a CRM. I can use HubSpot. I can drive sales to a product. Oh, that's cool. And you get this whole new skill set, which then serves you for the rest of your but also really benefits your your YouTube channel or whatever the thing might be. Well, let's put up on the screen on on YouTube. Your you did this you you're very open about how much money you made.

to my YouTube channel. And therefore, I can, like, oh, I can use a CRM. I can use HubSpot. I can drive sales to a product. Oh, that's cool. And you get this whole new skill set, which then serves you for the rest of your but also really benefits your your YouTube channel or whatever the thing might be. Well, let's put up on the screen on on YouTube. Your you did this you you're very open about how much money you made.

23:33

And,

And,

23:34

you show your revenue year by year. So two thousand seventeen,

you show your revenue year by year. So two thousand seventeen,

23:37

you did two dollars and twenty seven cents, which was your AdSense revenue when you got started. But then it goes twenty four thousand,

you did two dollars and twenty seven cents, which was your AdSense revenue when you got started. But then it goes twenty four thousand,

23:45

hundred thirty thousand. So I wanna point out here. You're now three years in, and you were a doctor. So you're in three years basically making less of what a kind of traditional full on doctor would would make. I think you were, like, in your,

hundred thirty thousand. So I wanna point out here. You're now three years in, and you were a doctor. So you're in three years basically making less of what a kind of traditional full on doctor would would make. I think you were, like, in your,

23:58

re whatever the UK version of residency is, some version of that. But then twenty in twenty twenty, you jumped from a hundred thirty thousand up to one point two million.

re whatever the UK version of residency is, some version of that. But then twenty in twenty twenty, you jumped from a hundred thirty thousand up to one point two million.

24:07

What happened there in that jump? Was that you released the course? Yeah. So we that was when we had a whole year of releasing classes on Skillshare. Which made, like, I don't know, five hundred k that year. I probably left that four hundred k. And we released my YouTube course, which was about how to be a part time YouTuber.

What happened there in that jump? Was that you released the course? Yeah. So we that was when we had a whole year of releasing classes on Skillshare. Which made, like, I don't know, five hundred k that year. I probably left that four hundred k. And we released my YouTube course, which was about how to be a part time YouTuber.

24:22

Which is not at all what I'm known for. Like, I should have released a productivity course, but I was like, people keep asking me about this YouTube thing. Let me just make a course. And it was a pandemic,

Which is not at all what I'm known for. Like, I should have released a productivity course, but I was like, people keep asking me about this YouTube thing. Let me just make a course. And it was a pandemic,

24:30

live cohort courses where all the rage then with building a second brain and rite of passage and all these other cohort based courses.

live cohort courses where all the rage then with building a second brain and rite of passage and all these other cohort based courses.

24:37

So after speaking to Tiago four ten David Parrell, who ran these courses, they basically talked me into charging loads of money for a live cohort course. And then that became, like, It was meant to be a bit of a side hustle, but it ended up being the majority of our revenue,

So after speaking to Tiago four ten David Parrell, who ran these courses, they basically talked me into charging loads of money for a live cohort course. And then that became, like, It was meant to be a bit of a side hustle, but it ended up being the majority of our revenue,

24:49

for the next, like, three plus years. And that is still the cash cow that funds the entire business, basically, because more than half of our revenue comes from this this one course. It's now evergreen, and we've got, like, a service based offering on the back of it and, like, a higher ticket thing on the back of it. But but randomly this idea in a coffee shop of like, hey, let me make a course about how to do YouTube has now just, like, transformed a business completely. So that was the big jump from, like, hundred k to a hundred thirty k to one point two million, then four million in twenty twenty one, four points six. I think that was the last one I saw in twenty twenty two. I think you finished a little higher than that maybe.

for the next, like, three plus years. And that is still the cash cow that funds the entire business, basically, because more than half of our revenue comes from this this one course. It's now evergreen, and we've got, like, a service based offering on the back of it and, like, a higher ticket thing on the back of it. But but randomly this idea in a coffee shop of like, hey, let me make a course about how to do YouTube has now just, like, transformed a business completely. So that was the big jump from, like, hundred k to a hundred thirty k to one point two million, then four million in twenty twenty one, four points six. I think that was the last one I saw in twenty twenty two. I think you finished a little higher than that maybe.

25:24

And you're profiting

And you're profiting

25:25

you know, the profit margins were very good. So when you made one point two million in revenue, your profit was nine hundred fifty k. So, like, incredible profit margin, I don't know what that is. Let's roughly eighty percent or something. And then you, you know, you've done two to two and a half million of profit the last couple years.

you know, the profit margins were very good. So when you made one point two million in revenue, your profit was nine hundred fifty k. So, like, incredible profit margin, I don't know what that is. Let's roughly eighty percent or something. And then you, you know, you've done two to two and a half million of profit the last couple years.

25:40

I'm curious

I'm curious

25:41

of two things. One,

of two things. One,

25:44

Why do you think your course hit when so many courses fail,

Why do you think your course hit when so many courses fail,

25:48

or or just fail to get get the same type of traction? Is it

or or just fail to get get the same type of traction? Is it

25:51

What what do you what do you attribute that to?

What what do you what do you attribute that to?

25:56

Why did our cause hit?

Why did our cause hit?

25:59

I think we got really lucky. We got really lucky with the timing in the pandemic. And

I think we got really lucky. We got really lucky with the timing in the pandemic. And

26:05

the thing that I would tell myself

the thing that I would tell myself

26:07

the the thing that I would do differently is just spend a lot of time crafting the offer. Like, at the time, Hundred Million Dollar Offers haven't come out. I didn't even know what an offer was. I'd never read a book about marketing.

the the thing that I would do differently is just spend a lot of time crafting the offer. Like, at the time, Hundred Million Dollar Offers haven't come out. I didn't even know what an offer was. I'd never read a book about marketing.

26:16

I'd been on, like, Russell Brunson and Neil Patel's email list since I was, like, thirteen, but always thought they were a bit scammy. And I was, like, what, you know, what could they possibly teach me? Because, like, you know, it's all just scammy click funnely bullshit.

I'd been on, like, Russell Brunson and Neil Patel's email list since I was, like, thirteen, but always thought they were a bit scammy. And I was, like, what, you know, what could they possibly teach me? Because, like, you know, it's all just scammy click funnely bullshit.

26:27

And so when we first made the course, I think we got very lucky by just the fact that it just happened to hit at the right time.

And so when we first made the course, I think we got very lucky by just the fact that it just happened to hit at the right time.

26:34

When the course made real money was the final cohort after I'd read a Hundred Million Dollar Offers, Dotcom Secrets, Copywriting Secrets, and we've revamped the entire landing page, the entire offer, the entire product, purely based on the advice of what Russell Brunson and Alex Hormozi have written in their books and just literally following the step by step method, and that was when a single launch of the course did, like, two million in a week. Isn't that hilarious? I went to the the exact thing where I'm like, Russell Brunson, Neil Patel scam.

When the course made real money was the final cohort after I'd read a Hundred Million Dollar Offers, Dotcom Secrets, Copywriting Secrets, and we've revamped the entire landing page, the entire offer, the entire product, purely based on the advice of what Russell Brunson and Alex Hormozi have written in their books and just literally following the step by step method, and that was when a single launch of the course did, like, two million in a week. Isn't that hilarious? I went to the the exact thing where I'm like, Russell Brunson, Neil Patel scam.

27:01

And then I, like, start reading their stuff. And I'm like, no. It's not a scam at all. Maybe,

And then I, like, start reading their stuff. And I'm like, no. It's not a scam at all. Maybe,

27:06

I I think a lot of scammers consume that stuff and implement it. But it but it's definitely not. It's it's really helpful stuff. Yeah. It's incredible stuff. When I first read dot com secrets, I was like, I cannot believe I've been sitting on this for fifteen years. Like, I've I I should have been reading all the Russell Bruns and stuff from day one. Essentially, the the the the before and after was before when I was selling a course, I was like, oh, I'm making a course and then selling the course. It's like, right? So, like, what how can I just explain what the course is, basically? It was, like, a a very sort of unsophisticated

I I think a lot of scammers consume that stuff and implement it. But it but it's definitely not. It's it's really helpful stuff. Yeah. It's incredible stuff. When I first read dot com secrets, I was like, I cannot believe I've been sitting on this for fifteen years. Like, I've I I should have been reading all the Russell Bruns and stuff from day one. Essentially, the the the the before and after was before when I was selling a course, I was like, oh, I'm making a course and then selling the course. It's like, right? So, like, what how can I just explain what the course is, basically? It was, like, a a very sort of unsophisticated

27:34

way of of doing things, didn't have any formula for writing a landing page. It was just like, I think maybe they should go on it. I was just sort of making shit up as I went along.

way of of doing things, didn't have any formula for writing a landing page. It was just like, I think maybe they should go on it. I was just sort of making shit up as I went along.

27:42

And two years later, when I read hundred million dollar offers and dot com secrets and explored this world of marketing a little bit more, that was when I realized, hang on. People have been selling courses online for, like, twenty years plus at this point. They've got a playbook. They've done all the testing. And one of the big mindset shifts was

And two years later, when I read hundred million dollar offers and dot com secrets and explored this world of marketing a little bit more, that was when I realized, hang on. People have been selling courses online for, like, twenty years plus at this point. They've got a playbook. They've done all the testing. And one of the big mindset shifts was

27:59

separating the offer from the fulfillment of the offer. Like, the thing that people are buying is the offer, and the offer needs to be a grand slam offer to the point that people feel like they're a dumbass for saying no to it. And then you can always worry about the fulfillment later. And there's the the there's something weird about separating it into those two of, like, oh, okay. Cool. So now when when we make a course, We just focus on the offer where, like, until the offer is amazing and the landing page is amazing, we're not even gonna bother creating the course because, like, what's the point? And the creation of the course will be sort of based on what the offer is based on, like, you know, talking to users and talking to people in our audience and being like, hey, what do you need to know about productivity?

separating the offer from the fulfillment of the offer. Like, the thing that people are buying is the offer, and the offer needs to be a grand slam offer to the point that people feel like they're a dumbass for saying no to it. And then you can always worry about the fulfillment later. And there's the the there's something weird about separating it into those two of, like, oh, okay. Cool. So now when when we make a course, We just focus on the offer where, like, until the offer is amazing and the landing page is amazing, we're not even gonna bother creating the course because, like, what's the point? And the creation of the course will be sort of based on what the offer is based on, like, you know, talking to users and talking to people in our audience and being like, hey, what do you need to know about productivity?

28:34

And then just following a formula for, like, funnels in terms of, like, upsells and down sells as per the Russell Brunson method, and there's a really good book copywriting secrets by Jim Edwards He's like one of Russell like acolytes, and that's really freaking good. And I was like, oh, the headline's really important. The subhead is really important. Shit. This is the structure of a landing page. You should talk about the user's problems. Okay. Let's just do that. And we did that. And that, you know, final code of course did, like, two million in a week. And I was like, fuck. Wish I'd done this earlier. So My issue with the the thing I've read all those books too. And I think they're awesome. My issue

And then just following a formula for, like, funnels in terms of, like, upsells and down sells as per the Russell Brunson method, and there's a really good book copywriting secrets by Jim Edwards He's like one of Russell like acolytes, and that's really freaking good. And I was like, oh, the headline's really important. The subhead is really important. Shit. This is the structure of a landing page. You should talk about the user's problems. Okay. Let's just do that. And we did that. And that, you know, final code of course did, like, two million in a week. And I was like, fuck. Wish I'd done this earlier. So My issue with the the thing I've read all those books too. And I think they're awesome. My issue

29:07

that I've always personally challenged, struggled with is, like, for example, in Alex Hormozi's book, he was, like, for Gym Launch or whatever business he had. He was saying, like, you know, we'll prove that for you spend forty grand with us, and then you make a hundred and fifty thousand dollars in additional revenue. Like, we'll somehow prove that. And if you don't, you get your money back.

that I've always personally challenged, struggled with is, like, for example, in Alex Hormozi's book, he was, like, for Gym Launch or whatever business he had. He was saying, like, you know, we'll prove that for you spend forty grand with us, and then you make a hundred and fifty thousand dollars in additional revenue. Like, we'll somehow prove that. And if you don't, you get your money back.

29:26

When so he was like, you gotta make it irresistible. So, of course, you shouldn't spend 40k. You'll make a 150k. And I was like, yeah. That's that's irresistible.

When so he was like, you gotta make it irresistible. So, of course, you shouldn't spend 40k. You'll make a 150k. And I was like, yeah. That's that's irresistible.

29:35

I gotta figure out how to do that. And and and that's actually quite challenging. I mean, like, it was hard just to come up. I mean, I could make a landing page sound amazing. It it's actually quite challenging. But the course, it's a bit easier because it's, oh, sometimes a one time purchase, and you just have to, like, Be like, well, here's just the information that I've gotta give them.

I gotta figure out how to do that. And and and that's actually quite challenging. I mean, like, it was hard just to come up. I mean, I could make a landing page sound amazing. It it's actually quite challenging. But the course, it's a bit easier because it's, oh, sometimes a one time purchase, and you just have to, like, Be like, well, here's just the information that I've gotta give them.

29:53

How do you

How do you

29:54

bridge that gap between fulfillment and promise?

bridge that gap between fulfillment and promise?

29:57

Yeah.

Yeah.

29:58

This was another big, sort of before and off a moment. That's the beauty of it. You don't.

This was another big, sort of before and off a moment. That's the beauty of it. You don't.

30:06

That's one of your team's values. It's just fuck them.

That's one of your team's values. It's just fuck them.

30:09

Yeah. Exactly.

Yeah. Exactly.

30:13

One of the big insights from from Homer Holmes's book was this idea of, like, what what's the dream outcome? Like, what is the actual thing that you're selling?

One of the big insights from from Homer Holmes's book was this idea of, like, what what's the dream outcome? Like, what is the actual thing that you're selling?

30:20

I didn't really I didn't really have a have a a sense of this when we launched the course initially. And I I've been selling courses online since, like,

I didn't really I didn't really have a have a a sense of this when we launched the course initially. And I I've been selling courses online since, like,

30:28

thirteen or something. And I I I just never had a sense of what is the actual thing that we're selling. What I realized after reading the books is, with our course, our YouTube academy,

thirteen or something. And I I I just never had a sense of what is the actual thing that we're selling. What I realized after reading the books is, with our course, our YouTube academy,

30:35

The thing we're selling is time. We're saying we will save you time, and that is all we're saying. We're not saying we're gonna make you money because that's we we cannot fulfill on that promise because, like, YouTube channels, like, a very few succeed, people have to put in the work, all that crap. But we can absolutely save you time. And as soon as we changed all of our messaging to, hey, we just save you time. If you value your time, You should take our course because we've done all the work. Yeah. You can troll the internet and find all this stuff for free. If you want if you really want to, but if you value your time, join our course because we'll save you time. Saving time is a very easy promise to fulfill because, obviously, we're gonna fulfill it and massively over deliver on it. And also, we have a thirty day money back guarantee if someone doesn't like it for whatever reason we literally them their their money back because we don't need the money. So those two things, we save time and we give you a money back if you don't like it. That gives us all of the conviction we need that, like, actually, this is already fucking a product. Because we are not promising, hey, we'll make you money.

The thing we're selling is time. We're saying we will save you time, and that is all we're saying. We're not saying we're gonna make you money because that's we we cannot fulfill on that promise because, like, YouTube channels, like, a very few succeed, people have to put in the work, all that crap. But we can absolutely save you time. And as soon as we changed all of our messaging to, hey, we just save you time. If you value your time, You should take our course because we've done all the work. Yeah. You can troll the internet and find all this stuff for free. If you want if you really want to, but if you value your time, join our course because we'll save you time. Saving time is a very easy promise to fulfill because, obviously, we're gonna fulfill it and massively over deliver on it. And also, we have a thirty day money back guarantee if someone doesn't like it for whatever reason we literally them their their money back because we don't need the money. So those two things, we save time and we give you a money back if you don't like it. That gives us all of the conviction we need that, like, actually, this is already fucking a product. Because we are not promising, hey, we'll make you money.

31:25

Do you have a so the business is going well. I think in your latest video, you're living you said you're living nomadically now. You said you're gonna do five point something million in revenue.

Do you have a so the business is going well. I think in your latest video, you're living you said you're living nomadically now. You said you're gonna do five point something million in revenue.

31:35

What's do you have, like, like, a north star where you're, like, I think the business can get to here. Like, is there a world? Are you one of these guys where you're, like, I wanna get to fifty hundred billion dollar business?

What's do you have, like, like, a north star where you're, like, I think the business can get to here. Like, is there a world? Are you one of these guys where you're, like, I wanna get to fifty hundred billion dollar business?

31:46

Do you have an ambition and what is it and what businesses are you gonna launch to get there? Yeah. That's a great question. I actually don't. And I'd I'd I'd love to get your guys take on this. My North Star is

Do you have an ambition and what is it and what businesses are you gonna launch to get there? Yeah. That's a great question. I actually don't. And I'd I'd I'd love to get your guys take on this. My North Star is

32:00

When I'm dead and people are speaking at my funeral, I just want them to say, a, I was a I was a nice dude, but, b, that my my my stuff helped them in some way, like, helped them live a better life or, like, I taught them something or something like that. Like, my whole north star is how do I continue being able to learn synthesize and teach forever?

When I'm dead and people are speaking at my funeral, I just want them to say, a, I was a I was a nice dude, but, b, that my my my stuff helped them in some way, like, helped them live a better life or, like, I taught them something or something like that. Like, my whole north star is how do I continue being able to learn synthesize and teach forever?

32:19

I'm super inspired by, for example, people like Tony Robbins, he's got his downsides, but, like, the cool thing is he's been doing this stuff for forty seven years. And millions of people around the world say his stuff changed their life. That's pretty cool. Tim Ferris had been doing this stuff for, like, nearly twenty years, and, well, the people around the world would say he changed their life. I would say Tim Ferris changed my That's pretty cool. So that's the north star. It's like, how do I just

I'm super inspired by, for example, people like Tony Robbins, he's got his downsides, but, like, the cool thing is he's been doing this stuff for forty seven years. And millions of people around the world say his stuff changed their life. That's pretty cool. Tim Ferris had been doing this stuff for, like, nearly twenty years, and, well, the people around the world would say he changed their life. I would say Tim Ferris changed my That's pretty cool. So that's the north star. It's like, how do I just

32:41

it's it it's that thing of, like, one once you're playing your infinite game, which is what I'm playing right now, like, the only objective that makes sense is to be able to continue playing the game. And so I don't have any revenue goals. I don't have any profit goals.

it's it it's that thing of, like, one once you're playing your infinite game, which is what I'm playing right now, like, the only objective that makes sense is to be able to continue playing the game. And so I don't have any revenue goals. I don't have any profit goals.

32:53

Have a bit of a profit goal. It's like, let's just make as much profit as the year before, at least, please.

Have a bit of a profit goal. It's like, let's just make as much profit as the year before, at least, please.

32:58

But beyond that, I'm I'm I'm not shooting for ten, twenty, fifty mill hundred million

But beyond that, I'm I'm I'm not shooting for ten, twenty, fifty mill hundred million

33:02

We are building, like, a SaaS product on the side that I'm a sort of co founder in. You know, I I like hearing the ideas that you guys come up with in the podcast. I'm subscribed to trends to to see, is is there anything interesting that I can I can come up with here? But honestly, for me, the main thing is how do I just keep on being able to make content, write books, make videos, do podcasts, whatever whatever formats are gonna come along in in the future to be able to teach. And so being being a good teacher is my north star. So

We are building, like, a SaaS product on the side that I'm a sort of co founder in. You know, I I like hearing the ideas that you guys come up with in the podcast. I'm subscribed to trends to to see, is is there anything interesting that I can I can come up with here? But honestly, for me, the main thing is how do I just keep on being able to make content, write books, make videos, do podcasts, whatever whatever formats are gonna come along in in the future to be able to teach. And so being being a good teacher is my north star. So

33:28

Please do tell me on that because I don't know if I'm bullshitting myself.

Please do tell me on that because I don't know if I'm bullshitting myself.

33:31

Well, I think you're definitely telling yourself a story, but we all tell ourselves that whatever the answer is, it's a story. That one sounds like it serves you pretty well. So so keep it, I would say.

Well, I think you're definitely telling yourself a story, but we all tell ourselves that whatever the answer is, it's a story. That one sounds like it serves you pretty well. So so keep it, I would say.

33:40

You know, it is probably worth worth questioning. Like, if I just ask you,

You know, it is probably worth worth questioning. Like, if I just ask you,

33:44

What would be a more true answer?

What would be a more true answer?

33:46

I think what would be more true is I love teaching. And if someone offered me an easy way to get to ten million, I wouldn't say no to it, but Right. If yeah. So there is a ten million. Yeah. The funeral thing I think is, the part that smelled, like,

I think what would be more true is I love teaching. And if someone offered me an easy way to get to ten million, I wouldn't say no to it, but Right. If yeah. So there is a ten million. Yeah. The funeral thing I think is, the part that smelled, like,

33:58

you know,

you know,

33:59

where we borrow from others versus what's actually true in our core, like what makes us wanna do something.

where we borrow from others versus what's actually true in our core, like what makes us wanna do something.

34:06

I personally have never been very motivated by, like, my actual funeral. I do think it's a good signal. It's a good side effect of a life well lived.

I personally have never been very motivated by, like, my actual funeral. I do think it's a good signal. It's a good side effect of a life well lived.

34:14

It's not not something I would get excited about is, like, I'm gonna do this because at my funeral, they'll this will be remembered, you know, that sort of thing, whereas it sounds like

It's not not something I would get excited about is, like, I'm gonna do this because at my funeral, they'll this will be remembered, you know, that sort of thing, whereas it sounds like

34:23

What you really have said is

What you really have said is

34:25

you love the learning part.

you love the learning part.

34:27

You like the teaching part. You may not actually like the format you teach today. Which is, like YouTube videos. You you kind of admitted that, you know, you liked maybe twenty of the seven hundred videos that you enjoyed making those, but you really enjoyed the research and the learning part. That that resonates

You like the teaching part. You may not actually like the format you teach today. Which is, like YouTube videos. You you kind of admitted that, you know, you liked maybe twenty of the seven hundred videos that you enjoyed making those, but you really enjoyed the research and the learning part. That that resonates

34:42

with me. I remember we did a a set of interviews in LA where we tried to book bigger name guest, Mark Manson and Bryan Johnson. We booked all these guests And to do it, I was like, okay. I'm gonna do the best job I possibly can. I'm gonna research,

with me. I remember we did a a set of interviews in LA where we tried to book bigger name guest, Mark Manson and Bryan Johnson. We booked all these guests And to do it, I was like, okay. I'm gonna do the best job I possibly can. I'm gonna research,

34:54

like, as deep as I can go on all these people. And I wait. I did. I wait, like, I spent basically, like, two or three full days researching each of those people. If you spent two or three full days researching somebody, you have a PhD.

like, as deep as I can go on all these people. And I wait. I did. I wait, like, I spent basically, like, two or three full days researching each of those people. If you spent two or three full days researching somebody, you have a PhD.

35:05

I have a PhD and Mark Manson. I, like, I I have fully researched it. Like, I I went and found he was, like, had this pickup artist alter ego back in the day, and I went and read all his stuff. And then I read his first book that nobody even talks about models rather than the subtle artifacts. Oh, great. I read all of it. Right? And so

I have a PhD and Mark Manson. I, like, I I have fully researched it. Like, I I went and found he was, like, had this pickup artist alter ego back in the day, and I went and read all his stuff. And then I read his first book that nobody even talks about models rather than the subtle artifacts. Oh, great. I read all of it. Right? And so

35:22

That and I had so much fun doing it. I I didn't do three days because it needed three days. Frankly, probably needed three hours. But I got into it, and I could justify it. I had this big interview book that we booked the studio. So I could justify doing whatever the hell I want. And so I indulged myself and just went further because I was enjoying it. Then came the actual interview. And he's a great guy. It interview turned out fine, but it was like a seven or eight compared to that fun I had in actually, like, going down the rabbit hole myself and actually trying to learn things. It sounds like that might be true for you too. Where you the the ten out of ten is the learning and the seven out of ten is recording the content for for YouTube.

That and I had so much fun doing it. I I didn't do three days because it needed three days. Frankly, probably needed three hours. But I got into it, and I could justify it. I had this big interview book that we booked the studio. So I could justify doing whatever the hell I want. And so I indulged myself and just went further because I was enjoying it. Then came the actual interview. And he's a great guy. It interview turned out fine, but it was like a seven or eight compared to that fun I had in actually, like, going down the rabbit hole myself and actually trying to learn things. It sounds like that might be true for you too. Where you the the ten out of ten is the learning and the seven out of ten is recording the content for for YouTube.

35:56

Yeah. I think for me, the

Yeah. I think for me, the

35:58

The the learning is ten out of ten. I I think teaching in real life is also a ten out of ten. I wanna go back through my life and think of the most meaningful moments, like, quite enjoyed being a doctor, but I enjoyed it way more when I had a medical student attached to me who I could teach along the way. And,

The the learning is ten out of ten. I I think teaching in real life is also a ten out of ten. I wanna go back through my life and think of the most meaningful moments, like, quite enjoyed being a doctor, but I enjoyed it way more when I had a medical student attached to me who I could teach along the way. And,

36:13

you know,

you know,

36:14

on days where I didn't have someone I was teaching, I would kinda be looking forward to going home so I could make future videos. But on days where I did have someone I was teaching alongside, I'd they time would just fly. I I wouldn't be thinking, oh, you know, when's the day gonna end. I'd be thinking, fucking love this. This is so fun.

on days where I didn't have someone I was teaching, I would kinda be looking forward to going home so I could make future videos. But on days where I did have someone I was teaching alongside, I'd they time would just fly. I I wouldn't be thinking, oh, you know, when's the day gonna end. I'd be thinking, fucking love this. This is so fun.

36:28

So I wanna do more like live seminar live teaching e type things next year. That's something we've got in the pipeline. My my therapy my end of my therapy session for you is I think the actual north star should be if the your learning is a ten out of ten today,

So I wanna do more like live seminar live teaching e type things next year. That's something we've got in the pipeline. My my therapy my end of my therapy session for you is I think the actual north star should be if the your learning is a ten out of ten today,

36:41

Find a way to turn the teaching into a ten out of ten, and then you've won. Right? Because then you're Yeah. Literally just doing the shit. You you you truly enjoy.

Find a way to turn the teaching into a ten out of ten, and then you've won. Right? Because then you're Yeah. Literally just doing the shit. You you you truly enjoy.

36:48

In the infinite game. You could do that forever. I also think Ali that, like

In the infinite game. You could do that forever. I also think Ali that, like

36:53

so my bullshit detector was going off when you were telling me what your goals are because I think that you can have multiple goals. So I think that I think that I believe what you're saying about how you how you wanna be remembered and all that. But I think that it doesn't sound I think it sounds, like, crude to say, like, well, I would like to hit ten million in revenue maybe by year, eight or whatever. And I I and I think that maybe you didn't say that because it sounds crude, but I think that that's perfectly

so my bullshit detector was going off when you were telling me what your goals are because I think that you can have multiple goals. So I think that I think that I believe what you're saying about how you how you wanna be remembered and all that. But I think that it doesn't sound I think it sounds, like, crude to say, like, well, I would like to hit ten million in revenue maybe by year, eight or whatever. And I I and I think that maybe you didn't say that because it sounds crude, but I think that that's perfectly

37:20

that's a wonderful goal. I I think that, like, with me personally, I I think of this business thing, you're past the point where it you you have security.

that's a wonderful goal. I I think that, like, with me personally, I I think of this business thing, you're past the point where it you you have security.

37:28

I think that it's the same way that when you're exercising,

I think that it's the same way that when you're exercising,

37:31

you know, you're like, I wanna run a five k at this time.

you know, you're like, I wanna run a five k at this time.

37:34

I'm not gonna be devastated if I don't do it, but it's just a really fun goal to chase after. And I think that's the same with a lot of business stuff, which is you wanna net worth by this age, or you want your business to hit this much in revenue or profit or users.

I'm not gonna be devastated if I don't do it, but it's just a really fun goal to chase after. And I think that's the same with a lot of business stuff, which is you wanna net worth by this age, or you want your business to hit this much in revenue or profit or users.

37:47

And I don't think that you need to stake your personal

And I don't think that you need to stake your personal

37:50

or your self esteem or your personal self worth on it, but I still think it's exciting, like, when it's like, man,

or your self esteem or your personal self worth on it, but I still think it's exciting, like, when it's like, man,

37:56

This new SaaS thing I'm working on, maybe one day this could make this much in revenue. And if it doesn't, it could still be awesome so long as I enjoyed it. But that's just exciting. You know, like, it's an exciting thing to shoot for. Or,

This new SaaS thing I'm working on, maybe one day this could make this much in revenue. And if it doesn't, it could still be awesome so long as I enjoyed it. But that's just exciting. You know, like, it's an exciting thing to shoot for. Or,

38:09

and I think that's okay to admit that, but it's, for some reason, it seems like you didn't want to.

and I think that's okay to admit that, but it's, for some reason, it seems like you didn't want to.

38:13

Yeah.

Yeah.

38:14

I don't know. I'm

I don't know. I'm

38:17

the thing that excites me is, it is

the thing that excites me is, it is

38:20

again, I it it the the just be a story of the story, but it it honestly is that thing of,

again, I it it the the just be a story of the story, but it it honestly is that thing of,

38:25

I just wanna learn and share cool stuff.

I just wanna learn and share cool stuff.

38:27

And that

And that

38:29

focus on the process, focus on the things that are in my control has led to, like, the the score takes care of itself when you focus on the things that are on the that are in your control. Me ask you a question. You you had this story

focus on the process, focus on the things that are in my control has led to, like, the the score takes care of itself when you focus on the things that are on the that are in your control. Me ask you a question. You you had this story

38:39

about your the first business you ever launched.

about your the first business you ever launched.

38:42

And you were eighteen years old,

And you were eighteen years old,

38:45

And it didn't go well.

And it didn't go well.

38:46

Tell the story of this thousand dollar business that you had when you were eighteen years old. What happened, when Yeah. So,

Tell the story of this thousand dollar business that you had when you were eighteen years old. What happened, when Yeah. So,

38:53

this was,

this was,

38:55

From from my age sixteen to eighteen, I was doing some, like, private tutoring. I was teaching people how to do well in maths and science exams and shit. And I saved up about a thousand dollars. And then I was like, okay. I'm I'm rich now. I can buy my first Apple product. I was like, yeah. I can find it, find it for an Apple product. And so I went out to try and find a MacBook Air. And I bought one of some dude on Craigslist.

From from my age sixteen to eighteen, I was doing some, like, private tutoring. I was teaching people how to do well in maths and science exams and shit. And I saved up about a thousand dollars. And then I was like, okay. I'm I'm rich now. I can buy my first Apple product. I was like, yeah. I can find it, find it for an Apple product. And so I went out to try and find a MacBook Air. And I bought one of some dude on Craigslist.

39:15

But it turned out after what it transpired that he'd sold me a model that didn't work, and it really old, and I was a dumbass. So I didn't realize that he was selling me a a, kind of, a dead, a dead MacBook.

But it turned out after what it transpired that he'd sold me a model that didn't work, and it really old, and I was a dumbass. So I didn't realize that he was selling me a a, kind of, a dead, a dead MacBook.

39:25

And so this thousand dollars that I'd spent, like, years of my life worked every week, like, hours of private tutoring, like, ten dollars an hour to get to this thousand, suddenly all that disappeared. And I was like, cool. Need to find a way to recoup these losses. I need to find a way to build a business that allows me to make this money back. And so I still have the Evernote file from twenty twelve when when I was eighteen, where that happened. Where I was like, okay. What am I good at? I'm good at teaching. I'm good at med school entrance exams. I know how to make websites.

And so this thousand dollars that I'd spent, like, years of my life worked every week, like, hours of private tutoring, like, ten dollars an hour to get to this thousand, suddenly all that disappeared. And I was like, cool. Need to find a way to recoup these losses. I need to find a way to build a business that allows me to make this money back. And so I still have the Evernote file from twenty twelve when when I was eighteen, where that happened. Where I was like, okay. What am I good at? I'm good at teaching. I'm good at med school entrance exams. I know how to make websites.

39:51

So let me build a business that combines all those things. And that was my first business. Like, I I've been trying to make money on the internet since age thirteen. Hence, why I was on Russell Brunson and Neil Patel email list since then. That was the first business I made that I actually succeeded

So let me build a business that combines all those things. And that was my first business. Like, I I've been trying to make money on the internet since age thirteen. Hence, why I was on Russell Brunson and Neil Patel email list since then. That was the first business I made that I actually succeeded

40:03

where I had this strong desire to do it and found this combination of things that I was already good at. And then that business did, like, ten k o one, hundred k hundred and fifty k year three and actually sold that business a few years ago to go full time on the YouTube channel.

where I had this strong desire to do it and found this combination of things that I was already good at. And then that business did, like, ten k o one, hundred k hundred and fifty k year three and actually sold that business a few years ago to go full time on the YouTube channel.

40:16

But because my YouTube channel originally started off content marketing for that original business, which was teaching courses of how to get into med school.

But because my YouTube channel originally started off content marketing for that original business, which was teaching courses of how to get into med school.

40:23

I've probably,

I've probably,

40:25

I don't know, in total, YouTube channel and all around has probably done over ten million revenue. So my thousand dollar loss, which was, like, felt life changing at the time has now transformed into, like, a ten million kind of upside.

I don't know, in total, YouTube channel and all around has probably done over ten million revenue. So my thousand dollar loss, which was, like, felt life changing at the time has now transformed into, like, a ten million kind of upside.

40:37

And I feel kinda like, that's kinda cool. Like, at the time I thought to myself, I'm gonna find a way to turn this thousand dollar loss into a really good opportunity.

And I feel kinda like, that's kinda cool. Like, at the time I thought to myself, I'm gonna find a way to turn this thousand dollar loss into a really good opportunity.

40:45

And that was when that first business really, really started and and took off.

And that was when that first business really, really started and and took off.

40:50

Sam, have you ever had that? Have you ever had, like,

Sam, have you ever had that? Have you ever had, like,

40:53

A big l that's turned that what felt like a big l in the moment that turned into a w?

A big l that's turned that what felt like a big l in the moment that turned into a w?

40:59

My whole thing was,

My whole thing was,

41:02

like, just growing up where, like, my parents controlled money and

like, just growing up where, like, my parents controlled money and

41:07

where it was, like, you you're not allowed to do this or You know, like, when your parents say, like, well, if you're living under my roof, you're gonna do this. And I there's been many times where I was, like, at a very young age, I was, like, Alright. Fine. Money equals power then. And then, basically, everything that I've done since then has been because my parents probably because they said no to me a handful of times.

where it was, like, you you're not allowed to do this or You know, like, when your parents say, like, well, if you're living under my roof, you're gonna do this. And I there's been many times where I was, like, at a very young age, I was, like, Alright. Fine. Money equals power then. And then, basically, everything that I've done since then has been because my parents probably because they said no to me a handful of times.

41:28

And I said, alright. Then I'm gonna be completely free, and money is one way to achieve that freedom.

And I said, alright. Then I'm gonna be completely free, and money is one way to achieve that freedom.

41:34

Yeah, yeah, I mean, it all stems. Basically, every great business person, I think, probably stems from some type of childhood trauma, whether it's your parents telling you no, or you see your mother,

Yeah, yeah, I mean, it all stems. Basically, every great business person, I think, probably stems from some type of childhood trauma, whether it's your parents telling you no, or you see your mother,

41:46

be poor, or you get scammed out of a MacBook.

be poor, or you get scammed out of a MacBook.

41:50

When we sold the milk road, I asked the guys. I was like, man, you guys have been they've just been doing different businesses for so long, and they'd a pretty interesting track record, like, small wins, big wins, like that. And,

When we sold the milk road, I asked the guys. I was like, man, you guys have been they've just been doing different businesses for so long, and they'd a pretty interesting track record, like, small wins, big wins, like that. And,

42:03

I was like, what's the driver? Because, like, you know, what's your you bank a hundred million dollars and you're still taking risks and starting businesses, like, you're not doing it for the money. I don't believe.

I was like, what's the driver? Because, like, you know, what's your you bank a hundred million dollars and you're still taking risks and starting businesses, like, you're not doing it for the money. I don't believe.

42:12

And, I was like, what's a driver. Or, like, what's and then he's like, I don't know what it is now. He's like, but for a long time, he's like, both of them had the same story. And it wasn't, like, this wasn't on the podcast. This wasn't to look cool. This was, like, I was hanging out, and he said it matter of factly. He's like, yeah, this girl rejected me when I was, like, fourteen years old. And he's like, I so I literally felt like shit. And I was like, okay.

And, I was like, what's a driver. Or, like, what's and then he's like, I don't know what it is now. He's like, but for a long time, he's like, both of them had the same story. And it wasn't, like, this wasn't on the podcast. This wasn't to look cool. This was, like, I was hanging out, and he said it matter of factly. He's like, yeah, this girl rejected me when I was, like, fourteen years old. And he's like, I so I literally felt like shit. And I was like, okay.

42:33

Like, I don't wanna be rejected again. How do I make myself awesome?

Like, I don't wanna be rejected again. How do I make myself awesome?

42:37

And he's like, I didn't know what the answer was, but I immediately started a bit, like, Oh, I'm if I'm if I'm okay at this, I'm good at this, I'm gonna become awesome at this instead. And so he's like, I was good at, like, the internet, making websites, stuff like that. I just, like, went into overdrive. And he's, like, the other guy had the same story. He's, like, yeah, I lived this. He's, like, I had six friends

And he's like, I didn't know what the answer was, but I immediately started a bit, like, Oh, I'm if I'm if I'm okay at this, I'm good at this, I'm gonna become awesome at this instead. And so he's like, I was good at, like, the internet, making websites, stuff like that. I just, like, went into overdrive. And he's, like, the other guy had the same story. He's, like, yeah, I lived this. He's, like, I had six friends

42:56

and in college, and they had, we wanted to live off campus together, and they got that only had five rooms.

and in college, and they had, we wanted to live off campus together, and they got that only had five rooms.

43:01

And I was the odd man out. And I was just like, fuck these guys.

And I was the odd man out. And I was just like, fuck these guys.

43:05

I'm gonna okay. I'm gonna go live in my by myself, but I'm gonna, like, I'm gonna go into the hole and I'm gonna come out a different guy. What's her, Sean? Because you seem like you've had your act together. I mean, you've seen emotionally stable.

I'm gonna okay. I'm gonna go live in my by myself, but I'm gonna, like, I'm gonna go into the hole and I'm gonna come out a different guy. What's her, Sean? Because you seem like you've had your act together. I mean, you've seen emotionally stable.

43:17

Yeah.

Yeah.

43:18

I've had a few

I've had a few

43:19

things like this. Probably not, like,

things like this. Probably not, like,

43:22

not like some huge disrespect or nothing I was that aware of, but I do remember,

not like some huge disrespect or nothing I was that aware of, but I do remember,

43:26

like,

like,

43:27

I remember hearing this story. So I went to this, got into this random accelerator that I don't even know if it exists anymore. It's called the mass challenge. And they used to invite these speakers in, it was in Massachusetts. And,

I remember hearing this story. So I went to this, got into this random accelerator that I don't even know if it exists anymore. It's called the mass challenge. And they used to invite these speakers in, it was in Massachusetts. And,

43:39

one time, was that this this event they had in,

one time, was that this this event they had in,

43:42

Ben from Ben and Jerry's was there.

Ben from Ben and Jerry's was there.

43:45

And he told this story

And he told this story

43:47

about Ben and about the starting story of Ben and Jerry's. There's all these, like, interesting funny things. Like, he starts it off being, like, Yeah. I met Jerry because we were both, like, in PE class. And, I was like, you know, the people are like, did you guys get along right away? He's like, No. But we were both the fat kids. So, like, we would have to run the mile every day. And,

about Ben and about the starting story of Ben and Jerry's. There's all these, like, interesting funny things. Like, he starts it off being, like, Yeah. I met Jerry because we were both, like, in PE class. And, I was like, you know, the people are like, did you guys get along right away? He's like, No. But we were both the fat kids. So, like, we would have to run the mile every day. And,

44:04

we were just walking at the back. And, like, first, we didn't talk for the first two weeks. And finally, I was like, alright.

we were just walking at the back. And, like, first, we didn't talk for the first two weeks. And finally, I was like, alright.

44:10

What's up, man? Like, you know, what? Do you again? And so they became friends that way. And he talks about, like, you know, they start this they they take this five dollar one of them was trying to get into med school, and he failed the entrance exam five or six times in a row.

What's up, man? Like, you know, what? Do you again? And so they became friends that way. And he talks about, like, you know, they start this they they take this five dollar one of them was trying to get into med school, and he failed the entrance exam five or six times in a row.

44:23

So, like, you know, he basically for several years couldn't get into med school, And so they instead took a five dollar ice cream making course together. And, that's, like, you know, part of how they learned out of my ice cream for Ben and Jerry's. So they opened up the shop

So, like, you know, he basically for several years couldn't get into med school, And so they instead took a five dollar ice cream making course together. And, that's, like, you know, part of how they learned out of my ice cream for Ben and Jerry's. So they opened up the shop

44:36

And, it wasn't like pints like you see today. It was a shop, but it was in Vermont in the freezing cold winter.

And, it wasn't like pints like you see today. It was a shop, but it was in Vermont in the freezing cold winter.

44:42

And,

And,

44:43

they're about to go out of business, like, in month three because nobody wants ice cream when it's already they're snowing outside. It's like a blizzard outside.

they're about to go out of business, like, in month three because nobody wants ice cream when it's already they're snowing outside. It's like a blizzard outside.

44:50

And so they, you know, they there are alright. What do we do? We're screwed. So what do we do? And they had this, they came up with this promotion. It's like this long acronym, like, nine letters long, and it stood for

And so they, you know, they there are alright. What do we do? We're screwed. So what do we do? And they had this, they came up with this promotion. It's like this long acronym, like, nine letters long, and it stood for

45:01

one cent off

one cent off

45:03

per degree Celsius under, you know, freezing or whatever. And so you got, like, twelve cents off if it was twelve below freezing. And so they, and that, like, That promotion was funny. People liked it. So they, like, came and, like, pitied them and basically bought bought a little ice cream. Took them through the winter. So then they were, like, still struggling.

per degree Celsius under, you know, freezing or whatever. And so you got, like, twelve cents off if it was twelve below freezing. And so they, and that, like, That promotion was funny. People liked it. So they, like, came and, like, pitied them and basically bought bought a little ice cream. Took them through the winter. So then they were, like, still struggling.

45:20

And they started the strategy of, like, making pints. They're like, oh, let's go to restaurants and give them the pints because otherwise it's just gonna melt here. Nobody's coming to our shop. And eventually, they get into corner stores and they start selling.

And they started the strategy of, like, making pints. They're like, oh, let's go to restaurants and give them the pints because otherwise it's just gonna melt here. Nobody's coming to our shop. And eventually, they get into corner stores and they start selling.

45:31

And finally, the business is working. And they're like, oh my god, this is great. We sell we sell pints. To these corner stores, and they sell our product for us. This is a good business.

And finally, the business is working. And they're like, oh my god, this is great. We sell we sell pints. To these corner stores, and they sell our product for us. This is a good business.

45:40

And then one day,

And then one day,

45:43

like, they stopped getting orders from, like, a whole area in, where they lived. And they were like, what the hell happened? They go and they talk to the store owner. They said, oh, guys, I didn't wanna tell you this, but, you know, I got word from

like, they stopped getting orders from, like, a whole area in, where they lived. And they were like, what the hell happened? They go and they talk to the store owner. They said, oh, guys, I didn't wanna tell you this, but, you know, I got word from

45:53

A big ice cream. He's like, what? He's like, yeah. Hagindas came to us. And,

A big ice cream. He's like, what? He's like, yeah. Hagindas came to us. And,

45:58

Hagindas, which is owned by pillsbury, pillsbury sent us this letter, said, I don't know who this Ben and Jerry is, but, like, you need to stop selling their stuff, only sell haagen dazs,

Hagindas, which is owned by pillsbury, pillsbury sent us this letter, said, I don't know who this Ben and Jerry is, but, like, you need to stop selling their stuff, only sell haagen dazs,

46:06

or we're pulling all pillsbury products from your shelves. See, like,

or we're pulling all pillsbury products from your shelves. See, like,

46:10

I need my crescent rolls. I can't do I can't do this, guys. I'm so sorry. And so the guys are like, shit. We're screwed.

I need my crescent rolls. I can't do I can't do this, guys. I'm so sorry. And so the guys are like, shit. We're screwed.

46:15

But they had this value, which was, like, turned the disadvantage into an advantage.

But they had this value, which was, like, turned the disadvantage into an advantage.

46:20

And so they were like, alright.

And so they were like, alright.

46:22

How can we use this? And so they

How can we use this? And so they

46:25

created this,

created this,

46:26

whole campaign called What's the doughboy afraid of? And they would put up a they would print these, like, posters that were like the pint of Ben and Jerry's, with the giant, like, dope pillsbury doughboy hands about to strangle it, and it would just say, what's the doughboy afraid of? And then on every pint of ice cream they sold, they said we're under attack, call this number to hear the story about what's going on. Why pillsbury is trying to put out your favorite, ice cream brand. And then they recorded, like, a answering machine that would tell the three minute story and say, like, if you think this is screwed up, buy these stickers and buy a pint of ice cream just to, you know, show pillsbury, you won't you won't be a bullied. And eventually, the New Yorker takes the story. And, you know, Jerry standing outside of pillsbury's

whole campaign called What's the doughboy afraid of? And they would put up a they would print these, like, posters that were like the pint of Ben and Jerry's, with the giant, like, dope pillsbury doughboy hands about to strangle it, and it would just say, what's the doughboy afraid of? And then on every pint of ice cream they sold, they said we're under attack, call this number to hear the story about what's going on. Why pillsbury is trying to put out your favorite, ice cream brand. And then they recorded, like, a answering machine that would tell the three minute story and say, like, if you think this is screwed up, buy these stickers and buy a pint of ice cream just to, you know, show pillsbury, you won't you won't be a bullied. And eventually, the New Yorker takes the story. And, you know, Jerry standing outside of pillsbury's

47:07

headquarters by himself picketing as if he's a protester, And they take this picture, they run this in the New Yorker, and pillsbury has to, like, completely back off because it looks terrible for them as a, you know, as a brand to be doing this. And secondly,

headquarters by himself picketing as if he's a protester, And they take this picture, they run this in the New Yorker, and pillsbury has to, like, completely back off because it looks terrible for them as a, you know, as a brand to be doing this. And secondly,

47:19

A whole bunch of people found out about Ben and Jerry's that didn't know about it before because this story was a lot more interesting than just here's a cool ice cream brand, started with these two hippies in Vermont. And so then it's they exploded in sales, and then that they became successful. And I remember hearing that and so everything that would happen, in our first business, like, we were, you know, twenty years old, basically trying to start the sushi chain. Everything that would happen. We'd get rejected or we'd get a cease and desist letter or whatever it was. Who were like, this is our pillsbury moment. Alright. What's the doughboy afraid of? How do we flip this? And so very quickly, it went from, like,

A whole bunch of people found out about Ben and Jerry's that didn't know about it before because this story was a lot more interesting than just here's a cool ice cream brand, started with these two hippies in Vermont. And so then it's they exploded in sales, and then that they became successful. And I remember hearing that and so everything that would happen, in our first business, like, we were, you know, twenty years old, basically trying to start the sushi chain. Everything that would happen. We'd get rejected or we'd get a cease and desist letter or whatever it was. Who were like, this is our pillsbury moment. Alright. What's the doughboy afraid of? How do we flip this? And so very quickly, it went from, like,

47:50

Anything that was bad, we got hyped because it was, like, this could be our story that we're telling someday. And that just became, like,

Anything that was bad, we got hyped because it was, like, this could be our story that we're telling someday. And that just became, like,

47:56

embedded in my mind. So I almost don't even remember the individual,

embedded in my mind. So I almost don't even remember the individual,

48:00

like, kinda, like, rejection moments because it was all, like, alright. How are we gonna use this to go viral? How are we gonna use this to, to our advantage. And that's just, like, I don't know what I've been doing for, like, fifteen years since. By the way, Ali. Welcome to my life. So I asked Sean a question. He tells me this amazing story where I'm totally enthralled.

like, kinda, like, rejection moments because it was all, like, alright. How are we gonna use this to go viral? How are we gonna use this to, to our advantage. And that's just, like, I don't know what I've been doing for, like, fifteen years since. By the way, Ali. Welcome to my life. So I asked Sean a question. He tells me this amazing story where I'm totally enthralled.

48:19

I was into it. He does such a good job of telling the story, and I'm like, I don't even know what to say. I'm I'm I'm interested.

I was into it. He does such a good job of telling the story, and I'm like, I don't even know what to say. I'm I'm I'm interested.

48:26

Like, fall down this a little bit. I'm like, I don't even remember what I asked, but, like, what else you got? Keep keep telling me tell me another. Well, tell me what I'm doing for you, Ali. I wanna learn

Like, fall down this a little bit. I'm like, I don't even remember what I asked, but, like, what else you got? Keep keep telling me tell me another. Well, tell me what I'm doing for you, Ali. I wanna learn

48:35

about titles. So I think that one of the reason your

about titles. So I think that one of the reason your

48:39

course does so well is that it's not called,

course does so well is that it's not called,

48:42

you know, how to be how to, you know, be famous on YouTube. It's called the part time you attribute academy.

you know, how to be how to, you know, be famous on YouTube. It's called the part time you attribute academy.

48:48

And part time, I think, just appeals to a whole different segment of people. And I always think about these choices because when you see the title, what you don't see is the fifty other

And part time, I think, just appeals to a whole different segment of people. And I always think about these choices because when you see the title, what you don't see is the fifty other

48:58

options that were considered. And I think about this with, like, your entire channel, like, I go to your YouTube channel right now,

options that were considered. And I think about this with, like, your entire channel, like, I go to your YouTube channel right now,

49:05

and I

and I

49:06

I, let's say popular.

I, let's say popular.

49:07

Right?

Right?

49:09

You know, some of your titles are just really good. You know, how I type really fast, all caps, and then, a hundred fifty six words per minute. Or,

You know, some of your titles are just really good. You know, how I type really fast, all caps, and then, a hundred fifty six words per minute. Or,

49:17

how I ranked first at Cambridge University, the essay, and your the thumbnails you're holding up, like, this notebook that looks like it's got, you know, the secret instructions inside. Or my evidence based skin care routine. So even though I said you weren't the most beautiful guy, you got good skin and you but saying my evidence based skin care routine is so different than just saying my skin care routine.

how I ranked first at Cambridge University, the essay, and your the thumbnails you're holding up, like, this notebook that looks like it's got, you know, the secret instructions inside. Or my evidence based skin care routine. So even though I said you weren't the most beautiful guy, you got good skin and you but saying my evidence based skin care routine is so different than just saying my skin care routine.

49:37

I'm curious,

I'm curious,

49:38

what's your method to madness? I'm getting good at titles or how you come up with the stuff?

what's your method to madness? I'm getting good at titles or how you come up with the stuff?

49:42

Yeah.

Yeah.

49:43

Nice.

Nice.

49:44

We think a lot about titles. What we found basically is that the only thing that allows us to predict the performance of a video is just the title It's not even the thumbnail. Some of my thumbnail, but in in an educational channel, my thumbnails look pretty similar. It's it's very rarely the thumbnail.

We think a lot about titles. What we found basically is that the only thing that allows us to predict the performance of a video is just the title It's not even the thumbnail. Some of my thumbnail, but in in an educational channel, my thumbnails look pretty similar. It's it's very rarely the thumbnail.

49:59

It just tends to be the title. If we know that if the title is good, then by default, the content is gonna be at least reasonable and useful. That's our main thing is, like, is this useful? And so the video is gonna fly or flop based on the performance of the title. How do you know the title will be good, though? By by the way, that's the same offer separating the offer from delivery of the of the offer is the same principle. Right? Exactly. It was the same thing for the book. You know, we it it took, like, about a hundred iterations to land on feel good productivity as, like, the thing we I've still got my Apple Notes file with, like, hundreds of title options trying to get at this idea of, like, being productive in a nice, fun, joyful sort of way.

It just tends to be the title. If we know that if the title is good, then by default, the content is gonna be at least reasonable and useful. That's our main thing is, like, is this useful? And so the video is gonna fly or flop based on the performance of the title. How do you know the title will be good, though? By by the way, that's the same offer separating the offer from delivery of the of the offer is the same principle. Right? Exactly. It was the same thing for the book. You know, we it it took, like, about a hundred iterations to land on feel good productivity as, like, the thing we I've still got my Apple Notes file with, like, hundreds of title options trying to get at this idea of, like, being productive in a nice, fun, joyful sort of way.

50:35

And the title actually came to me in the shower, like, two years into the journey of writing the book. On just on that note, one thing I would do differently next time is any feature book that I write I would make sure I've got the title nailed before trying to write the book because the title informs

And the title actually came to me in the shower, like, two years into the journey of writing the book. On just on that note, one thing I would do differently next time is any feature book that I write I would make sure I've got the title nailed before trying to write the book because the title informs

50:48

the concept and the hook, which informs everything else. And there was so much, like, surgery we had to do on the book once we came up with that title to be like, oh, okay. That's the title. So now let's rejig everything in the book to make sure it, like, matches

the concept and the hook, which informs everything else. And there was so much, like, surgery we had to do on the book once we came up with that title to be like, oh, okay. That's the title. So now let's rejig everything in the book to make sure it, like, matches

51:01

the promise, you know, the the offer, the title, and the thumbnail of of the book.

the promise, you know, the the offer, the title, and the thumbnail of of the book.

51:05

But when it comes to YouTube videos, we just do a lot of iteration. Like, he's like, how do you know a good title from a bad? Like, when you're when you're trying to decide, what what are your obviously, it's just a judgment call over time. You get a bunch of intuition, but is there anything you do or Anything that led you to be better at titles?

But when it comes to YouTube videos, we just do a lot of iteration. Like, he's like, how do you know a good title from a bad? Like, when you're when you're trying to decide, what what are your obviously, it's just a judgment call over time. You get a bunch of intuition, but is there anything you do or Anything that led you to be better at titles?

51:21

Yeah. We do a lot. We we have the strategy that we acutely called Viral replication, which is that by the the way you grow a YouTube channel is by getting a viral video. And the easiest way to get a viral video is to just copy the title of another video that's already gone viral. So a lot of our best titles have been just looking around on YouTube, sometimes within our niche, sometimes outside of our niche, and looking at the view to subscriber ratio of that particular video. So, like, back in the day, I saw some guy may made a video, like, how I use my iPad as an engineering student? I was like, okay. Interesting. But that video had, like, two million views, and the dude had, like, twenty thousand subscribers. It was like, that's that's interesting. There's something about that title that's really popped. So I thought how I use my iPad as a medical student. Sounds cool. So I made that video, and that was the first video on the channel I went viral. I've got over a million views. And I was like, Yes. Six billion views. And it's how I take notes on my iPad pro in medical school. Is that the one? Yeah. That's the one.

Yeah. We do a lot. We we have the strategy that we acutely called Viral replication, which is that by the the way you grow a YouTube channel is by getting a viral video. And the easiest way to get a viral video is to just copy the title of another video that's already gone viral. So a lot of our best titles have been just looking around on YouTube, sometimes within our niche, sometimes outside of our niche, and looking at the view to subscriber ratio of that particular video. So, like, back in the day, I saw some guy may made a video, like, how I use my iPad as an engineering student? I was like, okay. Interesting. But that video had, like, two million views, and the dude had, like, twenty thousand subscribers. It was like, that's that's interesting. There's something about that title that's really popped. So I thought how I use my iPad as a medical student. Sounds cool. So I made that video, and that was the first video on the channel I went viral. I've got over a million views. And I was like, Yes. Six billion views. And it's how I take notes on my iPad pro in medical school. Is that the one? Yeah. That's the one.

52:15

And that was the that was out of here into my channel. Yeah. Are you using software to help you do this, or are you just browsing?

And that was the that was out of here into my channel. Yeah. Are you using software to help you do this, or are you just browsing?

52:21

We're browsing. We're using VITIQ, the Chrome extension, which shows us the subscribe account of the channel just next to their name because otherwise you have to click on it and see what the subscribe account is.

We're browsing. We're using VITIQ, the Chrome extension, which shows us the subscribe account of the channel just next to their name because otherwise you have to click on it and see what the subscribe account is.

52:30

We've also now started becoming more sophisticated with

We've also now started becoming more sophisticated with

52:33

AB testing, titles, and thumbnails. So we use thumbnail test dot com, which is made by one of our Twitter friends to just test the shit out of the back catalog.

AB testing, titles, and thumbnails. So we use thumbnail test dot com, which is made by one of our Twitter friends to just test the shit out of the back catalog.

52:42

And that generates a bunch of free views, basically, every day because

And that generates a bunch of free views, basically, every day because

52:46

we can refresh an old video that's, like, three years old by just giving it a new title or a new thumbnail. There's a lot of, like, repeating that process over and over again. Before landing on a title, we often have, like, twenty titles to choose from. And sometimes if we're really not sure, we'll, like, test it on Twitter and on Instagram and on YouTube community post will say, hey, which of these four titles would you be more likely to click on? And often there's, like, a clear winner and we're like, okay, cool. Let's just do that. And we make sure we don't even think about writing the video until we have nailed a title because, obviously, like, the the framing of the title and thumbnail radically informs the way you can do the video. Our

we can refresh an old video that's, like, three years old by just giving it a new title or a new thumbnail. There's a lot of, like, repeating that process over and over again. Before landing on a title, we often have, like, twenty titles to choose from. And sometimes if we're really not sure, we'll, like, test it on Twitter and on Instagram and on YouTube community post will say, hey, which of these four titles would you be more likely to click on? And often there's, like, a clear winner and we're like, okay, cool. Let's just do that. And we make sure we don't even think about writing the video until we have nailed a title because, obviously, like, the the framing of the title and thumbnail radically informs the way you can do the video. Our

53:20

producer, by the way, I just saw her look down. She's, like, taking notes on how we can

producer, by the way, I just saw her look down. She's, like, taking notes on how we can

53:24

improve our channel. What's the,

improve our channel. What's the,

53:26

what's the software

what's the software

53:28

that you're fooling around with, because I bet you've seen a lot of interesting traders, launch cool businesses. I bet you've had a lot of opportunities run by you. Why did you sell this one? And what is it? Yeah. So this is, we're actually launching, like, this week. It's called a voice pal. And it's like, an an a voice notes meets AI transcription meets, converting your voice note into like a summary, which you can then turn into a tweet thread or a LinkedIn post or a journal entry or whatever you want.

that you're fooling around with, because I bet you've seen a lot of interesting traders, launch cool businesses. I bet you've had a lot of opportunities run by you. Why did you sell this one? And what is it? Yeah. So this is, we're actually launching, like, this week. It's called a voice pal. And it's like, an an a voice notes meets AI transcription meets, converting your voice note into like a summary, which you can then turn into a tweet thread or a LinkedIn post or a journal entry or whatever you want.

53:55

It's not launched yet, voice mail dot me, for whenever people are listening to this, it will have been launched by then.

It's not launched yet, voice mail dot me, for whenever people are listening to this, it will have been launched by then.

54:00

This is an idea I've

This is an idea I've

54:02

I've kind of had floating in the back of my mind, partly thanks to listening to your guys' pod for a few years, which is that

I've kind of had floating in the back of my mind, partly thanks to listening to your guys' pod for a few years, which is that

54:08

creators have a massive distribution advantage do not know how to make products.

creators have a massive distribution advantage do not know how to make products.

54:13

Product, people know how to make products, but really struggle with distribution. So in theory, if you can combine those two things, if you can pair a creator with a product that fit their audience nicely.

Product, people know how to make products, but really struggle with distribution. So in theory, if you can combine those two things, if you can pair a creator with a product that fit their audience nicely.

54:22

Now you're winning because the product guy makes a product and the creator has has a distribution.

Now you're winning because the product guy makes a product and the creator has has a distribution.

54:26

And so I partnered up with a friend of mine who's a second time founder. He's exited, like, to third time founder, he's exited two companies,

And so I partnered up with a friend of mine who's a second time founder. He's exited, like, to third time founder, he's exited two companies,

54:32

and he was like, hey, we should totally build some cool productivity software together. And I was like, yes. We absolutely should. And so the first idea that we're launching is this thing called voice mail, which is like, you record a voice note, and it transcribes it, and it can turn it into whatever whatever

and he was like, hey, we should totally build some cool productivity software together. And I was like, yes. We absolutely should. And so the first idea that we're launching is this thing called voice mail, which is like, you record a voice note, and it transcribes it, and it can turn it into whatever whatever

54:46

you want And we're trying to figure out, like, the messaging around this, like, double your productivity using your voice, something to that something to that effect. And we're gonna be launching this week for our thousand beta testers, and I'll post it on Twitter and LinkedIn and the newsletter, and hopefully we'll just get those thousand people very quickly. How much are you in charge? Yeah.

you want And we're trying to figure out, like, the messaging around this, like, double your productivity using your voice, something to that something to that effect. And we're gonna be launching this week for our thousand beta testers, and I'll post it on Twitter and LinkedIn and the newsletter, and hopefully we'll just get those thousand people very quickly. How much are you in charge? Yeah.

55:02

We're thinking, like, ten dollars a month initially.

We're thinking, like, ten dollars a month initially.

55:05

We've already got, like, twenty paying users, from the alpha, friends, and family test that we did where we set found thirty people to, like, twenty of them were, like, super super power users, and almost all of them converted to paid when

We've already got, like, twenty paying users, from the alpha, friends, and family test that we did where we set found thirty people to, like, twenty of them were, like, super super power users, and almost all of them converted to paid when

55:17

Pablo, the co founder reached to be like, hey, would you like to buy early access to this? And a lot of people are using it already for, like,

Pablo, the co founder reached to be like, hey, would you like to buy early access to this? And a lot of people are using it already for, like,

55:23

journalists and, like, lawyers and stuff for, like, recording depositions and and things like that? A bunch of people are using it for journaling as well.

journalists and, like, lawyers and stuff for, like, recording depositions and and things like that? A bunch of people are using it for journaling as well.

55:31

So one thing that I'm really bullish on is, like, you know, to to your point about, wouldn't it be cool to get to ten million revenue? I think the way we get there is I don't try and get there through content, but we try and get there through building cool software products on the side that I that I use personally, that I would like, oh, I fucking love a journaling app that does this. I'd love a to do list app that's different to things and to do this by doing business. Smart. And then we plug it to our audience. I think that's I think I I I think I would agree with that. Area of you're not gonna get to where you wanna go by doing the content revenue itself. Have you guys seen the app, Opel? So it's opel dot s o. It's like,

So one thing that I'm really bullish on is, like, you know, to to your point about, wouldn't it be cool to get to ten million revenue? I think the way we get there is I don't try and get there through content, but we try and get there through building cool software products on the side that I that I use personally, that I would like, oh, I fucking love a journaling app that does this. I'd love a to do list app that's different to things and to do this by doing business. Smart. And then we plug it to our audience. I think that's I think I I I think I would agree with that. Area of you're not gonna get to where you wanna go by doing the content revenue itself. Have you guys seen the app, Opel? So it's opel dot s o. It's like,

56:04

No.

No.

56:05

Man, you guys gotta check this out. So opel dot s o. So it says, find your focus. Make the most of every day with the world's greatest screen time software.

Man, you guys gotta check this out. So opel dot s o. So it says, find your focus. Make the most of every day with the world's greatest screen time software.

56:12

So the problem with iPhone software is that, you know, like, the screen time thing, you can just click, like, bypass or whatever.

So the problem with iPhone software is that, you know, like, the screen time thing, you can just click, like, bypass or whatever.

56:19

So somehow these guys made it to where I can't bypass. So between eight or nine and six PM, I cannot go on social media on my phone.

So somehow these guys made it to where I can't bypass. So between eight or nine and six PM, I cannot go on social media on my phone.

56:28

And they've done it in such a way that, like, I I literally can't bypass it. And it's, like, a hundred and twenty dollars. They've got a crazy amount of reviews.

And they've done it in such a way that, like, I I literally can't bypass it. And it's, like, a hundred and twenty dollars. They've got a crazy amount of reviews.

56:37

And I think that What I think is gonna happen is I think I I think there's already a lot of these, but these, like, screen time focus session,

And I think that What I think is gonna happen is I think I I think there's already a lot of these, but these, like, screen time focus session,

56:44

app, apps, I think historically have done pretty good. So there there's a few ones for the past couple years.

app, apps, I think historically have done pretty good. So there there's a few ones for the past couple years.

56:52

There's Chrome plugins for this. But this one, in particular, is the only one that stuck with me.

There's Chrome plugins for this. But this one, in particular, is the only one that stuck with me.

56:58

I don't I have no idea who these guys are. This isn't like a promotion. I just I just thought it was cool. I could see you launching something like this. I think they charge two hundred dollar three hundred dollars for a lifetime license and then a hundred dollars a year.

I don't I have no idea who these guys are. This isn't like a promotion. I just I just thought it was cool. I could see you launching something like this. I think they charge two hundred dollar three hundred dollars for a lifetime license and then a hundred dollars a year.

57:10

But I really like Like, if I'm you, I would just look at what are the most

But I really like Like, if I'm you, I would just look at what are the most

57:14

what are the best,

what are the best,

57:16

apps out there for productivity?

apps out there for productivity?

57:18

Who's spending the most on advertising?

Who's spending the most on advertising?

57:21

And how do I acquire a small part of their company or launch something similar? Because I don't have to my margin will be their advertising budget.

And how do I acquire a small part of their company or launch something similar? Because I don't have to my margin will be their advertising budget.

57:30

Yeah. That is, like, exactly the way we're thinking. We're we're we're we're sort of thinking of it as a sort of barbell strategy where there there's a couple of companies that I've invested in get, like, a small equity stake in in the company. RISE is one of them r I z e. They're, like, another focused time tracking e type thing that I've been using for, like, two years. And so that we we invested in them, but we invested sponsorship dollars. So, like,

Yeah. That is, like, exactly the way we're thinking. We're we're we're we're sort of thinking of it as a sort of barbell strategy where there there's a couple of companies that I've invested in get, like, a small equity stake in in the company. RISE is one of them r I z e. They're, like, another focused time tracking e type thing that I've been using for, like, two years. And so that we we invested in them, but we invested sponsorship dollars. So, like,

57:51

however much it was, like, for sponsorships worth of investment into the company, And it's great because I use it every day. I love it. It's easy to recommend. And when I say I've invested in a thing, it's like, people like, oh, you like, you liked it so much. You actually invested in that's for a small equity stake. And then on the other side, we're trying to do these sort of co founding,

however much it was, like, for sponsorships worth of investment into the company, And it's great because I use it every day. I love it. It's easy to recommend. And when I say I've invested in a thing, it's like, people like, oh, you like, you liked it so much. You actually invested in that's for a small equity stake. And then on the other side, we're trying to do these sort of co founding,

58:07

software product for, like, a twenty or thirty percent equity stake. So I'm trying to try and experiment with both, but I'm particularly bullish on, like, building our own shit because I think that's where

software product for, like, a twenty or thirty percent equity stake. So I'm trying to try and experiment with both, but I'm particularly bullish on, like, building our own shit because I think that's where

58:16

I get to mold the direction of the product in a way that personally suits me one of the cool things about that is, like,

I get to mold the direction of the product in a way that personally suits me one of the cool things about that is, like,

58:22

oh, what what I love trying to find is

oh, what what I love trying to find is

58:25

apps where

apps where

58:28

apps where I can share a screenshot of the thing, which promotes the app without it looking like a promotion. So, for example, whenever I do a workout, I use the app strong I just screenshot it and post it on my Instagram story. And I will always get, like, dozens of comments being like, what app is that. Right. I love noise me because I'm like, this is an app I don't own. And it's just really good. But If I did own the app strong or a workout tracker, and I was just posting screenshots on my workouts, no one would think I'm plugging a product. They would think, oh, he's sharing screenshots of this product. Right. So I'm I'm always looking for these organic promotional opportunities that don't look like they're that that they don't look like they're out. Or like another one is Scrib scriptner. Is that what it's called? I know you love that app, that writing app, which I think it's just, like, a guy in, like, Montana or something like, you know, a little bit random like that who owns that writing tool.

apps where I can share a screenshot of the thing, which promotes the app without it looking like a promotion. So, for example, whenever I do a workout, I use the app strong I just screenshot it and post it on my Instagram story. And I will always get, like, dozens of comments being like, what app is that. Right. I love noise me because I'm like, this is an app I don't own. And it's just really good. But If I did own the app strong or a workout tracker, and I was just posting screenshots on my workouts, no one would think I'm plugging a product. They would think, oh, he's sharing screenshots of this product. Right. So I'm I'm always looking for these organic promotional opportunities that don't look like they're that that they don't look like they're out. Or like another one is Scrib scriptner. Is that what it's called? I know you love that app, that writing app, which I think it's just, like, a guy in, like, Montana or something like, you know, a little bit random like that who owns that writing tool.

59:11

But

But

59:12

you should acquire stakes in these businesses or launch some of their own. And I think you'd be very successful at that.

you should acquire stakes in these businesses or launch some of their own. And I think you'd be very successful at that.

59:19

Yeah. Yeah. One thing I've been thinking a lot is that with a lot of these productivity apps, they tend

Yeah. Yeah. One thing I've been thinking a lot is that with a lot of these productivity apps, they tend

59:24

they tend not to be differentiated on the product itself. Like, fundamentally all to do list app to do the same thing. And when you watch reviews of them, it's like, oh, well, things three has slightly nicer animations, and todoist has, like, teams. And this one is available on iPad. So you should get that. It's like the the the product features that just that differentiate these are so small.

they tend not to be differentiated on the product itself. Like, fundamentally all to do list app to do the same thing. And when you watch reviews of them, it's like, oh, well, things three has slightly nicer animations, and todoist has, like, teams. And this one is available on iPad. So you should get that. It's like the the the product features that just that differentiate these are so small.

59:45

So if we could, in theory, just clone one of these, we're in our own way, in our own design language, whatever,

So if we could, in theory, just clone one of these, we're in our own way, in our own design language, whatever,

59:51

and we've got feature parity on the product side, we will have a distribution advantage. And the market for these productivity apps is so huge that, like, you know, a few users would be would be pretty good. How many

and we've got feature parity on the product side, we will have a distribution advantage. And the market for these productivity apps is so huge that, like, you know, a few users would be would be pretty good. How many

01:00:01

users to, let's say, if you owned scrivener or Opel. How many users could a handful of your videos drive do you think?

users to, let's say, if you owned scrivener or Opel. How many users could a handful of your videos drive do you think?

01:00:09

Probably

Probably

01:00:10

thousands to tens of thousands. Based on what the users are that we drive to, like, Skillshare and Brilliant, and these are the, like, the sponsor type things. If there's a good fit with the audience, then yeah.

thousands to tens of thousands. Based on what the users are that we drive to, like, Skillshare and Brilliant, and these are the, like, the sponsor type things. If there's a good fit with the audience, then yeah.

01:00:21

There was a time where Sean brought up some company

There was a time where Sean brought up some company

01:00:24

that does accounting or his taxes on the pod.

that does accounting or his taxes on the pod.

01:00:28

And then afterwards he asked

And then afterwards he asked

01:00:30

He lied. I don't think, Shawn, you didn't have any he didn't he had no stake. He was just like, I just met this guy and it was cool, and I ended up using the product, and it was interesting. Here's what it was.

He lied. I don't think, Shawn, you didn't have any he didn't he had no stake. He was just like, I just met this guy and it was cool, and I ended up using the product, and it was interesting. Here's what it was.

01:00:38

And then he, like, hollered at them two weeks later and was, like, did you see a bump? And the guy was, like, raving, you know, I I don't know what numbers I'm allowed to say or not. But Sean, you could decide if you wanna say it or not. But it was, like, a substantial sum. And then that Calendly was booked out, like, four months. Or something. I don't know if they didn't have a lot of slots or what happened, but, like, that was,

And then he, like, hollered at them two weeks later and was, like, did you see a bump? And the guy was, like, raving, you know, I I don't know what numbers I'm allowed to say or not. But Sean, you could decide if you wanna say it or not. But it was, like, a substantial sum. And then that Calendly was booked out, like, four months. Or something. I don't know if they didn't have a lot of slots or what happened, but, like, that was,

01:00:58

that was great for them.

that was great for them.

01:01:01

When when that happened. Yeah. But then we both had a light bulb moment and we're like,

When when that happened. Yeah. But then we both had a light bulb moment and we're like,

01:01:06

oh, if there's something there, you know what I mean?

oh, if there's something there, you know what I mean?

01:01:09

Now, of course, you have to pick and choose which ones you do and you can't do too many at one time. You probably should only do one at a time for a certain amount of time. But, yeah, like, we had that same moment as well.

Now, of course, you have to pick and choose which ones you do and you can't do too many at one time. You probably should only do one at a time for a certain amount of time. But, yeah, like, we had that same moment as well.

01:01:19

So one thing that we did we so we recently launched, well, recently a few a few months ago, a studio called Hey Friends, which is like a double Yeah. With Hunter and Sa Hill, with Hunter and tile. Oh, yeah. Because that you you guys are working with them as well.

So one thing that we did we so we recently launched, well, recently a few a few months ago, a studio called Hey Friends, which is like a double Yeah. With Hunter and Sa Hill, with Hunter and tile. Oh, yeah. Because that you you guys are working with them as well.

01:01:32

And one tweet from me.

And one tweet from me.

01:01:35

And, yeah, just like one tweet drove

And, yeah, just like one tweet drove

01:01:38

two million MRR worth of leads that they're still, like, going through the sales calls and, like, trying to shore up capacity because there's so many AARP. Fourteen thousand,

two million MRR worth of leads that they're still, like, going through the sales calls and, like, trying to shore up capacity because there's so many AARP. Fourteen thousand,

01:01:47

MRR.

MRR.

01:01:48

Was at least

Was at least

01:01:49

yeah. Wow. Okay. That's a shit. Yeah. There were, like, literally hundreds hundreds of people that signed up for a fourteen thousand a month sales call, and they were, like, like, we can only onboard, like, one or two people a month because we need to hire editors and script writers and all this kind of stuff. And it was just, like, one tweet, and Twitter isn't isn't even my main platform, but I guess it's why people with,

yeah. Wow. Okay. That's a shit. Yeah. There were, like, literally hundreds hundreds of people that signed up for a fourteen thousand a month sales call, and they were, like, like, we can only onboard, like, one or two people a month because we need to hire editors and script writers and all this kind of stuff. And it was just, like, one tweet, and Twitter isn't isn't even my main platform, but I guess it's why people with,

01:02:05

people like you guys are more likely to read a tweet of mine than watch a video. So if I'm like, hey, I've got this fifteen k a month, YouTube as a service, thing. It's like that drove so many leads. And we're like, oh, that's that's interesting.

people like you guys are more likely to read a tweet of mine than watch a video. So if I'm like, hey, I've got this fifteen k a month, YouTube as a service, thing. It's like that drove so many leads. And we're like, oh, that's that's interesting.

01:02:16

And Sean and I

And Sean and I

01:02:17

we did this thing. I think two years ago, Sean, we're or maybe a, you know, maybe a year ago. We're we were like, okay. So we understand how there's these billion dollar businesses built on Instagram. That that's been done

we did this thing. I think two years ago, Sean, we're or maybe a, you know, maybe a year ago. We're we were like, okay. So we understand how there's these billion dollar businesses built on Instagram. That that's been done

01:02:28

maybe a couple times,

maybe a couple times,

01:02:30

with the Kardashians and a handful of other people.

with the Kardashians and a handful of other people.

01:02:33

It's very plausible that it's happening or has already happened with YouTube, mister Beast, and there's whoever, you know, there's many more that have built businesses that are worth hundreds of millions of dollars, maybe even more on YouTube.

It's very plausible that it's happening or has already happened with YouTube, mister Beast, and there's whoever, you know, there's many more that have built businesses that are worth hundreds of millions of dollars, maybe even more on YouTube.

01:02:44

It hasn't happened yet with Twitter. And our prediction was, like, this is gonna happen more. And the reason it's gonna happen more is because, a, there's a business audience on Twitter a bit more than those other platforms. So you can sell higher priced things. And, b, the conversion's

It hasn't happened yet with Twitter. And our prediction was, like, this is gonna happen more. And the reason it's gonna happen more is because, a, there's a business audience on Twitter a bit more than those other platforms. So you can sell higher priced things. And, b, the conversion's

01:02:57

quite high. So, like, I don't know what the click through rate on your video. So how many people click a link to to your products? It probably is less than one percent. On Twitter, it's not crazy

quite high. So, like, I don't know what the click through rate on your video. So how many people click a link to to your products? It probably is less than one percent. On Twitter, it's not crazy

01:03:06

that to be five percent at times where you post a link and five percent of people click it. And we're like, wow, we could just drive way more traffic to a website It hasn't happened yet. I think it's in the process of happening. Hopefully, Sean and I and a couple of our friends are are en route to doing that. But I think it's gonna happen in the next five. Who's even Twitter famous? Right? Like, I can I I can go on YouTube and Instagram, and I know, like, oh, I don't know who Charlie Demilio

that to be five percent at times where you post a link and five percent of people click it. And we're like, wow, we could just drive way more traffic to a website It hasn't happened yet. I think it's in the process of happening. Hopefully, Sean and I and a couple of our friends are are en route to doing that. But I think it's gonna happen in the next five. Who's even Twitter famous? Right? Like, I can I I can go on YouTube and Instagram, and I know, like, oh, I don't know who Charlie Demilio

01:03:29

is, but I know that that's a person that's TikTok famous? Like, started on that platform, got huge on that platform has a huge fan based on that platform. You could say Dan Bilzerian and others were doing that on Instagram when Instagram first came out. And on YouTube, you had, you know, whoever the tons tons of people, mister Beast and others. I don't even know who that would be on Twitter. Who the hell is Twitter famous? Like, Sahill, maybe. Sahill's Is our friend Sahill the most Twitter famous guy out there? That may that's the biggest, like, No offense to Tahill. Sounds great. But, like, shouldn't it be a famous person? Like, shouldn't there be, like,

is, but I know that that's a person that's TikTok famous? Like, started on that platform, got huge on that platform has a huge fan based on that platform. You could say Dan Bilzerian and others were doing that on Instagram when Instagram first came out. And on YouTube, you had, you know, whoever the tons tons of people, mister Beast and others. I don't even know who that would be on Twitter. Who the hell is Twitter famous? Like, Sahill, maybe. Sahill's Is our friend Sahill the most Twitter famous guy out there? That may that's the biggest, like, No offense to Tahill. Sounds great. But, like, shouldn't it be a famous person? Like, shouldn't there be, like,

01:04:02

the whoever, you know, like, Like, mister Beast is, like, massive Pewdiepie was massive. These were, like, massive, massive creators.

the whoever, you know, like, Like, mister Beast is, like, massive Pewdiepie was massive. These were, like, massive, massive creators.

01:04:09

Who is that on Twitter? I don't even know. Like, is there and I'm on Twitter all the time. I guess you or our friends. I don't I don't know. It can't be.

Who is that on Twitter? I don't even know. Like, is there and I'm on Twitter all the time. I guess you or our friends. I don't I don't know. It can't be.

01:04:18

I think I think it also really Why does it not have that? That's insane.

I think I think it also really Why does it not have that? That's insane.

01:04:22

I think it also really depends on what audience you're going up. Like, normal people have never heard Syle Bloom. The only people who have other people who are in are sort of like business. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. So, like, who's the mass market? Like, you know, on Instagram, it was, like, beautiful people went they were the mass market famous people. Right? And then on YouTube, it's like the funny vlogger types on Twitch. It was like Twitter is in Fortnite player in the world. Alright. Fortnite's super popular. Makes sense that ninja's super popular. Doctor disrespecting these guys. Troud, whoever.

I think it also really depends on what audience you're going up. Like, normal people have never heard Syle Bloom. The only people who have other people who are in are sort of like business. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. So, like, who's the mass market? Like, you know, on Instagram, it was, like, beautiful people went they were the mass market famous people. Right? And then on YouTube, it's like the funny vlogger types on Twitch. It was like Twitter is in Fortnite player in the world. Alright. Fortnite's super popular. Makes sense that ninja's super popular. Doctor disrespecting these guys. Troud, whoever.

01:04:49

I don't even know who those people are on Twitter. Who is, like, like, is it Elon? Is he the only guy who is, like, or famous on Twitter? Oh, yeah. Trump. Like, they're they're famous. They were famous off Twitter, which is why they're big on Twitter. Like, is there anybody who's just natively

I don't even know who those people are on Twitter. Who is, like, like, is it Elon? Is he the only guy who is, like, or famous on Twitter? Oh, yeah. Trump. Like, they're they're famous. They were famous off Twitter, which is why they're big on Twitter. Like, is there anybody who's just natively

01:05:03

so good at tweeting

so good at tweeting

01:05:05

that they just got huge. Because if not, something is broken about this platform.

that they just got huge. Because if not, something is broken about this platform.

01:05:10

It's not broken. My point is it it's small. It's small. So how many people how many users does Twitter have? I don't know. Three or four hundred million. Yeah.

It's not broken. My point is it it's small. It's small. So how many people how many users does Twitter have? I don't know. Three or four hundred million. Yeah.

01:05:17

Yeah. A fraction compared to what the other platforms have. So it's just small.

Yeah. A fraction compared to what the other platforms have. So it's just small.

01:05:21

And also it's text based. So it's a little bit less exciting. So, like,

And also it's text based. So it's a little bit less exciting. So, like,

01:05:26

and you don't exactly see, like, the view count, like, you do on YouTube, I see Ali's video that has six million views. And I'm like, oh, many other people know this person. I'll see a tweet just randomly through my my feed, and I don't know it's more one to one versus one to many. So I don't know that other people's are people are consuming it, but that's okay. It's no. It's there is no famous but that's okay. You I think you could still build a big business because there's people like Ali or you or my on there who will spend more money. Twitter's like twenty years old. It's if it's not big now, it's never getting big. Like, a twenty year old product. There's three hundred million people. What like, who's more than ten million followers? Is there, like,

and you don't exactly see, like, the view count, like, you do on YouTube, I see Ali's video that has six million views. And I'm like, oh, many other people know this person. I'll see a tweet just randomly through my my feed, and I don't know it's more one to one versus one to many. So I don't know that other people's are people are consuming it, but that's okay. It's no. It's there is no famous but that's okay. You I think you could still build a big business because there's people like Ali or you or my on there who will spend more money. Twitter's like twenty years old. It's if it's not big now, it's never getting big. Like, a twenty year old product. There's three hundred million people. What like, who's more than ten million followers? Is there, like,

01:05:59

who who is not already famous? Like, trump and Elon, take them out.

who who is not already famous? Like, trump and Elon, take them out.

01:06:03

That has more than ten million followers organic. I don't know. Like, I know two of the blogs that got popular. Right? Like, you know, that's insane to me. Maybe it's, like, a couple yeah. There's maybe some of these, like,

That has more than ten million followers organic. I don't know. Like, I know two of the blogs that got popular. Right? Like, you know, that's insane to me. Maybe it's, like, a couple yeah. There's maybe some of these, like,

01:06:13

crazy,

crazy,

01:06:14

you know,

you know,

01:06:15

like, f gerry like, is there even, like, an f gerry type of account on Twitter?

like, f gerry like, is there even, like, an f gerry type of account on Twitter?

01:06:22

I don't know. I don't think so. Sure there is. Somebody who knows is just yelling at the podcast player right now. Like, why aren't they saying blah blah blah, the obvious. So we're all friends with the most famous guy on Twitter. Siled Blue. Yeah. Congrats. So we're saying. Yeah.

I don't know. I don't think so. Sure there is. Somebody who knows is just yelling at the podcast player right now. Like, why aren't they saying blah blah blah, the obvious. So we're all friends with the most famous guy on Twitter. Siled Blue. Yeah. Congrats. So we're saying. Yeah.

01:06:33

And what is it that you say? A a dwarf amongst midgets, you know, like Yeah. That's basically what's going on here. Like, well, and and the only reason he's famous is because he's Indian, so he has a billion potential fans and he's ripped. So he's already gonna track all the dudes. By the way, it's never women that are attracted to the ripped dudes. It's always other men like me who see a a rip guy

And what is it that you say? A a dwarf amongst midgets, you know, like Yeah. That's basically what's going on here. Like, well, and and the only reason he's famous is because he's Indian, so he has a billion potential fans and he's ripped. So he's already gonna track all the dudes. By the way, it's never women that are attracted to the ripped dudes. It's always other men like me who see a a rip guy

01:06:53

and he, like, talks about productivity. So he's got this whole other angle. So he's, like, this he's a he's a triple assassin.

and he, like, talks about productivity. So he's got this whole other angle. So he's, like, this he's a he's a triple assassin.

01:07:00

So he's not Indian. He's also half Indian.

So he's not Indian. He's also half Indian.

01:07:04

So he's super hot also. Right? Like, yeah.

So he's super hot also. Right? Like, yeah.

01:07:07

Using combination of things. If dude, if he had all his accent, it'd be over. Yeah. If he had a British or a a London accent and was sounded all proper. He's he he's got it all. He's a he'd be a he he'd had everything.

Using combination of things. If dude, if he had all his accent, it'd be over. Yeah. If he had a British or a a London accent and was sounded all proper. He's he he's got it all. He's a he'd be a he he'd had everything.

01:07:20

Ali, thanks for doing this, man. The name of the book, what does it feel good for activity? It's coming out in January or, December twenty six. Right? Yeah. December twenty sixth feel good productivity. It's about how to do more of a buzz to you in a way that's Right. Appointable, meaningful, sustainable. Yeah. Yeah. I did not know that most gifts are bought literally three days before that.

Ali, thanks for doing this, man. The name of the book, what does it feel good for activity? It's coming out in January or, December twenty six. Right? Yeah. December twenty sixth feel good productivity. It's about how to do more of a buzz to you in a way that's Right. Appointable, meaningful, sustainable. Yeah. Yeah. I did not know that most gifts are bought literally three days before that.

01:07:40

Shit.

Shit.

01:07:41

Good point.

Good point.

01:07:43

Respiration

Respiration

01:07:43

date for the production. There was there was this whole, like, astrology that the publishers did where they were like, well, if we go before Christmas, we're competing with cookbooks and like celebrity memoirs, and those are often gifted over Christmas rather than like self help books. But if we go just after Christmas, people are on a new year, new me kind of thing. So maybe that's when it'll hit. Oh, okay. I'm not sure how much of this was astrology versus, like, actual data, but mean, they seem pretty switched on, so may so maybe there was some data behind it as well. And your cover looks like an air table spreadsheet.

date for the production. There was there was this whole, like, astrology that the publishers did where they were like, well, if we go before Christmas, we're competing with cookbooks and like celebrity memoirs, and those are often gifted over Christmas rather than like self help books. But if we go just after Christmas, people are on a new year, new me kind of thing. So maybe that's when it'll hit. Oh, okay. I'm not sure how much of this was astrology versus, like, actual data, but mean, they seem pretty switched on, so may so maybe there was some data behind it as well. And your cover looks like an air table spreadsheet.

01:08:11

The cover we okay. It it's the thing with with these sorts of books. The the reason atomic habits were so successful is because it was picked up by the demographic of

The cover we okay. It it's the thing with with these sorts of books. The the reason atomic habits were so successful is because it was picked up by the demographic of

01:08:20

women in their thirties in the Midwest, apparently,

women in their thirties in the Midwest, apparently,

01:08:24

which is, like, by far, the biggest demographic of people who buy books and especially people who buy self help books. And it really hit that crowd, like, sometime in the pandemic.

which is, like, by far, the biggest demographic of people who buy books and especially people who buy self help books. And it really hit that crowd, like, sometime in the pandemic.

01:08:33

The Kinsies of the world. A bunch of a bunch of ladies named Kinsy.

The Kinsies of the world. A bunch of a bunch of ladies named Kinsy.

01:08:37

Yeah. That kind of thing. You know, it was a kid that that fits up.

Yeah. That kind of thing. You know, it was a kid that that fits up.

01:08:40

And so the publisher was like, look, productivity is too broy. We need we need to have a cover that will be a bit more gender neutral, feel a bit more, like, kind of fresh and inviting.

And so the publisher was like, look, productivity is too broy. We need we need to have a cover that will be a bit more gender neutral, feel a bit more, like, kind of fresh and inviting.

01:08:50

And, you know, that's why productivity is, like, an Allison Abdahl.

And, you know, that's why productivity is, like, an Allison Abdahl.

01:08:55

Yeah. I'm a good point.

Yeah. I'm a good point.

01:08:57

Yeah. Talk about right.

Yeah. Talk about right.

01:09:00

Why it covers all, like, bright and colorful and stuff. That's also my vibe. I like bright and colorful. Well, the landing page is beautiful. It looks good, man. You're gonna kill congratulations in all this. Thanks, man. Thanks for giving us shout outs, and and we'll,

Why it covers all, like, bright and colorful and stuff. That's also my vibe. I like bright and colorful. Well, the landing page is beautiful. It looks good, man. You're gonna kill congratulations in all this. Thanks, man. Thanks for giving us shout outs, and and we'll,

01:09:13

we'll have to repay you in some way when your book comes out and we'll, and we'll share it. But we appreciate you coming and, we'll wrap up here. That's the pod.

we'll have to repay you in some way when your book comes out and we'll, and we'll share it. But we appreciate you coming and, we'll wrap up here. That's the pod.

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